Master Yoda Riding Position

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fossilrider

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I'm in love again. After reading the MYRP article on the BMW website, I practiced at home this sitting position while at my computer. This morning I took off the risers and Koubalinks, the bike is back to stock. Just returned from a 3.5 hour non-stop run and I'm smiling. The problem wasn't the bike it was me . Although I had to remind myself several times during the ride, pivot at the hips, arch the back, relax the arms, I can say the bike feels like a different animal. It definitely take practice and will honestly take some time before it's completely natural to me but the difference is dramatic. I'm not sure if it will help others but it definitely made my day more enjoyable.

FYI, I'm 59 years old, 5'6" tall and weigh 160lbs.

I've attached the link to the MYRP article below for any interested in reading.

Take care and enjoy!

MYRP

 
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Thanks for that, interesting reading. I wont get rid of any mechanical ergo improvements, but I think all the IBA folks know physical conditioning is what keeps them "in the zone". This separates them from us mere mortals.

 
I've attached the link to the MYRP article below for any interested in reading.
Take care and enjoy!

https://bmwrt.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?C...0560&page=0
Ya know... lots of good information in that article. But until THAT knuckleHEAD LEARNS just HOW TO type a MESSAGE and FORMAT his sentences in a SOMEWHAT READABLE manner, I'm going to CONTINUE TO HAVE a HEAD ACHE just trying TO GET THROUGH his POST.

Jeezuz, I think my brain is bleeding.

 
Ya know... lots of good information in that article. But until THAT knuckleHEAD LEARNS just HOW TO type a MESSAGE and FORMAT his sentences in a SOMEWHAT READABLE manner, I'm going to CONTINUE TO HAVE a HEAD ACHE just trying TO GET THROUGH his POST.

Jeezuz, I think my brain is bleeding.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

 
I'd agree the "method" of writing was a bit lacking but I did find the information helpful.

My right shoulder certainly appreciates the article (constant pain while riding - even worse afterward). I realized that I had almost no weight on my feet and all of my weight on my wrists/arms/shoulders.

Still teaching myself but good points to make you aware of your riding position.

:clapping:

 
I recently finished an 8k mile trip with average travel days at 600 miles. What was my trick? Physical conditioning? (no) Bike mods? (no)

Every other day, get a first class massage and hot tub with a PYT.

 
jeeeezzz

How am I supposed to read this thread with an avatar like that?

Riding position? yeah that's what I'm thinkin 'bout

Is it warm in here?

 
6mmbr. Focus, man, focus,,,,,

After almost 40 yrs of riding, most in the dirt, this yoda stuff is a wake up. I now realize that the days I was fastest in the dirt were the days that I dropped my elbows and got on the balls of my feet. Ever since first reading about it several months ago, I have tried to relax and re learn how to ride again. What an amazing difference to both my body not tiring and my cornering skills getting smoother and faster.

Now that the weather here in the NW is so crappy, I am going to miss the new learning curve I was working on.

A lot of parallels to Keith Codes book "A Twist of the Wrist" in riding position.

I'm a believer!

 
Dick Frantz is a member here. His sig. says he owns an '05 FJR. Could not find if he has posted this info over here or not. Good stuff though, it seems like I always find myself with straight arms and its not good for cornering or comfort. Something to work on.

Bill

 
I have taken the liberty to edit Mr. Frantz's original text. I hope not to offend Mr. Frantz and if this does I will remove it immediately.

[You sit on top of a sport bike. You sit within a K1200RS. Sport bikes require getting weight off your butt so the rider can slide his/her butt inside corners to affect a different cg. Consequently sport bikes induce weight on the handle bars. Someone sitting on a K1200RS will note some ergonomic differences, and fall toward, positioning their body as if they were riding a sport bike. They probably also carry forward certain muscle memories developed, from other seating positions.

People have learned to sit upright. It is not a function for which the human body was designed, and continued practice causes damage. Automobiles promulgate the poor seated position. Only lately have they applied several things like lumbar support to keep that position from killing the user. Most motorcycles continue the promulgation to one degree or another. They emulate "sit upright," (so much so that the term UJM (universal Japanese motorcycle) was partially defined by a riding position called - sit up and beg, like a puppy. This position became a mental norm. We think that's how a motorcycle is ridden.

The important thing to remember is you learned to do it that way, and you can learn something else. The largest, developed, muscle memory is the angle between torso and thighs. This is controlled by the largest muscles involved in riding. Southeast Asian peoples go about teaching their kids to squat, and that brings on an entirely different thigh/torso relationship. That posture is much more common across all of Asia. Some things can be difficult to overcome for some folks when they have become habits rather than cognizant, controlled responses. A great example is about leaning motorcycles in corners.

The human develops a sense of danger when leaning any farther than when they stand up. Danger signals are sent when lean angle extends much beyond the angle the neck can be bent and still keep the eyes level (20 to 30 degrees). It is our response to body signals that can make up our "sense" of our comfort levels. Those things can change when we control them, rather than the other way round. The K1200RS was designed to promote a canted forward riding position. This was done on purpose by BMW. They knew it was required to get the K1200RS performing to the desired levels, and to keep the rider comfortable for long periods of time, in the regimes where the bike was intended to be most often used (i.e. not riding on city streets). It all starts with a low seating position -- not a high position like a sport bike.

BMW then set out to discover what else needed to be done: add comfort to this position and provide a supporting airflow; support the position by moving the pegs downward while still allowing good ground clearance for cornering; reduce effort to maintain the position by moving them forward to change the support vector. This removes the need to place any weight on the handle bars. Do so if you wish, but you'll pay the price in comfort. You'll also find that you make the bike feel dull and unresponsive, when compared to properly distributing your weight about the bike. Properly is appropriate here in light of gaining the performance qualities BMW built into the bike. Perhaps the motorcycle magazines don't find the riding qualities we owners do when they test the K1200RS: they are riding it differently than it was designed to be ridden.

The keynotes to the riding position are:

1. Bend at the hips, not at the waist.

2. Maintain a slight arch to the back, not allowing it to curve.

3. Move the butt aft so the weight is over your feet.

4. Using your thigh muscles to support your weight.

The goal is to distribute all your weight over your butt and feet – not on your hands.

Move fore and aft on the seat to make all those things happen. Except for the hip bend, they are not absolutes, but rather ranges. Move about until you can see all of them are happening to some extent with no weight being placed on the handlebars. Do this when the bike is stationary. Take the time to sit on the parked bike. Practice - one must teach their own body. You’ll notice that all good training is done by abstract exercises, not just running off to the playing field and doing what you heard. Learn to press down with the feet. Then, when riding, check that's what you are actually doing.

You should be able to lift your butt off the seat at a millisecond’s notice: as when knowingly approaching a severe bump in the road. Learn to bend at the hips. Do it both ways, and show yourself that you can operate the body differently. Be willing to touch that gas tank. Some people are incredibly fearful of touching a gas tank -- it's almost laughable. If you fear scratching the tank, get some clear tank protectors. Better to think "the gas tank is my friend." it will be some day when you are six hundred miles into your ride and still two hundred miles from your destination.

Your body is not yet trained to operate that way. Flap your elbows like a chicken to relax your arms occasionally. Prove you have your weight supported, mostly by your feet and butt. Even after 25,000 miles on an RS, I end up leaning onto the bars and need to readjust my position. Many people will need to change the riding position they use for riding on the K1200RS. Because "sit up" is so common in our lives, it can come to seem we are not operating the body, even to just sit. But, sit on a wooden stool for six hours and feel what you encounter.

The mind controls the body in healthy people. Take the time to sit on the stationary bike when you are learning. Flex, tighten, relax, and move about across a small but definite range of positions on the bike. Without moving, flex all your body muscles, in order, from the feet toward the hands and head. Feel what that feels like when you relax each muscle, and are still holding the proper riding position. close your eyes and feel it. Not all the muscles are fully relaxed. You are using some of them. How? How much? Why? Then, when you've done that for all the body's muscles, flex them all, and relax and feel it over all.

Even go so far as to stand back 10 feet and look at yourself if you can. Attempt to maintain that position, within reason, for as long in your ride as you can. When you are tire, stop. get off the bike and bend, stretch, and flex all your muscles. Walk until you feel normal, and then get back on the bike in the proper position. Repeat. You'll find you ride longer and longer, and comfort grows and grows. Eventually, it will seem normal.

If you notice tightness or pain, stop. You are compensating for a muscle that has already become tired. You need to develop those muscles. Right then, it will be hard to find that muscle. The next time you start riding; do a better job of finding what muscles you really need to use to hold that position. Begin by riding in a relaxed environment so you can pay attention to your muscles. Continue to adjust your weight distribution via the elbow flapping, weight transfer between feet and butt, and neck twisting. I promise that if you are doing this correctly your riding pains will disappear.

Even Master Yoda gets tired during a 14 hour riding day, and sometimes during just a six hour riding day. Build up your thigh muscles. Let them do the work. Even with bad knees and a bad back I can ride this lovely performing machine from sunrise to long past sunset.

Blessings to you all, Dick Frantz So. Cal.]

 
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Gretat info saved it on my FAVORITES to remind my self. I have only been riding for 40 years and am still finding my self falling into bad riding habits. Is there any information out there on the proper riding positions for a passanger and two up riding??

 
Yoda riding position really helped me with the wrist problem but after a 4 day 1500 mile ride I have a new issue. My back is really jacked up 2 weeks later. I guess I need to hit the gym :) .

 
Curious... anyone who thinks this "master yoda" riding position is something new or unknown, have you ridden any kind of sport bike for more than 10 minutes? Not trying to sound insulting, seriously curious about the experiences. Anyone coming directly from, say a standard or tourer, or especially a cruiser, will find any lean-over seating to be a real problem with lots of physical problems stemming from it.

Any bike (or chair) that leans you forward will hurt you until you learn to adjust to it, and figure out that you should be using your legs, glutes and abs to maintain your position, and should not be putting any weight on your arms (thus leading to elbow and wrist problems, and exacerbating carpal tunnel syndrome where present).

I went from standards to cruiser to sport bikes to the FJR, and found coming from the sport bike to the FJR to be the perfect compromise between lean-over seating with some level of relaxed ergos.

 
Curious... anyone who thinks this "master yoda" riding position is something new or unknown, have you ridden any kind of sport bike for more than 10 minutes? Not trying to sound insulting, seriously curious about the experiences.
It was new & unknown to me until fairly recently. When I got back from my FJR's maiden voyage to Boise, I commented on a message board that I found myself putting a lot of weight on my forearms. Then an acquaintance showed me the MYRP link, and voila, no more sore wrists or shoulders. I'm just saying that the MYRP doesn't necessarily come naturally to everybody. As in my case (and many others from the sound of it), it had to be learned and practiced.

 
Curious... anyone who thinks this "master yoda" riding position is something new or unknown, have you ridden any kind of sport bike for more than 10 minutes? Not trying to sound insulting, seriously curious about the experiences.
It was new & unknown to me until fairly recently. When I got back from my FJR's maiden voyage to Boise, I commented on a message board that I found myself putting a lot of weight on my forearms. Then an acquaintance showed me the MYRP link, and voila, no more sore wrists or shoulders. I'm just saying that the MYRP doesn't necessarily come naturally to everybody. As in my case (and many others from the sound of it), it had to be learned and practiced.
Yeah, I should have worded that differently... sounds way more abrupt than I meant it. I only meant to say that the lean-over seating is a fairly well known issue and there is a learned(able) technique to it that sport bike enthusiasts have been going on about for years. I never really bought into it until trying to do several-hundred-mile days on a sport bike. It only takes one of them for you to reconsider riding positions :)

 
Curious... anyone who thinks this "master yoda" riding position is something new or unknown, have you ridden any kind of sport bike for more than 10 minutes? Not trying to sound insulting, seriously curious about the experiences. Anyone coming directly from, say a standard or tourer, or especially a cruiser, will find any lean-over seating to be a real problem with lots of physical problems stemming from it.
Any bike (or chair) that leans you forward will hurt you until you learn to adjust to it, and figure out that you should be using your legs, glutes and abs to maintain your position, and should not be putting any weight on your arms (thus leading to elbow and wrist problems, and exacerbating carpal tunnel syndrome where present).

I went from standards to cruiser to sport bikes to the FJR, and found coming from the sport bike to the FJR to be the perfect compromise between lean-over seating with some level of relaxed ergos.

Years ago (in my 20's) I had a 600 Ninja. Didn't think anything of "comfort."

Came from a custom chopper (Big Bear Choppers) to the FJR this past summer.

This was a HUGE difference for me. Really laid back "cruiser" to the FJR.

I will agree, I was not expecting the difference in riding style needed until after the "master yoda" article.

 
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..., and found coming from the sport bike to the FJR to be the perfect compromise between lean-over seating with some level of relaxed ergos.
I agree. I did a few 3-400 mile days on my Katana (although its not a tank hugging Ninja) No prob. I find the FJR comfy and don't find the ergo probs most complain about. But that could be that Im 6'2 with long arms and legs.

The article seems like a natural riding position to me, as I was doing most of this pre read.

 

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