Bike Damaged By Cager

I knew I could not beat the odds forever. I commute 120 miles per day with lots of Saturdays for the last 2.5 years and I had a car change lanes in front of me on the way to work Friday afternoon. Luckly I was only doing 15 mph when I was spliting lanes in stop-n-go traffic, so I did not lay the bike down. I was 3rd in a group of 4 with guys I didn't know and this car suddenly changes lanes. I ran into his right rear quarter panel before I knew what happened. The bikers in front and behind (a Kawasaki Z-10 & a Harley) pulled over and checked on me. The driver of the car was very apologetic and his insurance has already judged that he was at fault, he admitted that he tried to shot over to an open lane without looking. I was glad that his family in the car was OK. I came through without a scratch, I wear ATGATT. The bike is rideable so I will drop it off at the dealership today. And the weather is just getting nice too.....

Glad yer OK!

Fingerflicker said:

I knew I could not beat the odds forever. I commute 120 miles per day with lots of Saturdays for the last 2.5 years and I had a car change lanes in front of me on the way to work Friday afternoon. Luckly I was only doing 15 mph when I was spliting lanes in stop-n-go traffic, so I did not lay the bike down. I was 3rd in a group of 4 with guys I didn't know and this car suddenly changes lanes. I ran into his right rear quarter panel before I knew what happened. The bikers in front and behind (a Kawasaki Z-10 & a Harley) pulled over and checked on me. The driver of the car was very apologetic and his insurance has already judged that he was at fault, he admitted that he tried to shot over to an open lane without looking. I was glad that his family in the car was OK. I came through without a scratch, I wear ATGATT. The bike is rideable so I will drop it off at the dealership today. And the weather is just getting nice too.....

Click to expand...

Glad he's taking responsibility and that you're okay.

glad you are OK

Considering ALL the things I can do on a street bike, lane splitting worries me...alot. Troubles me when I'm in my car too.

I like to think I drive my car pretty well...heads up with good SA. Based on what I see happening around me all the time, I know I do better than a big majority of the other drivers out there. But I am ROUTINELY surprised by lane splitters coming up from behind me sometimes on the right, mostly on the left. That's because I don't spend sufficient time in the mirrors in slow or stop-go multi-lane traffic to see these folks in advance every time they show up. In that sort of traffic, one's attention is necessarily and predominantly out the front sector because that's where all the close-in action is occurring. And the quiet ones are the worst...loud bikes will tend to announce their presence acoustically well in advance of their arrival. So even though I have a good scan rate for the mirrors, a fairly large percentage of these (mostly quiet) riders "surprise" me as thy enter my car's private space.

I also note that some cage drivers in that sort of traffic (every weekday morning & afternoon on the freeways here in So Cal) will move aggressively and quickly to take advantage of any perceived speed or positional advantage in these situations. Heck, I even do it myself. Many drivers won't take the time to thoroughly "check six" like they should and, viola.

Where the hell did he come from is probably the usual response.

I don't like to do lane splitting...

W2

Wee Willy said:

Considering ALL the things I can do on a street bike, lane splitting worries me...alot. Troubles me when I'm in my car too.
I like to think I drive my car pretty well...heads up with good SA. Based on what I see happening around me all the time, I know I do better than a big majority of the other drivers out there. But I am ROUTINELY surprised by lane splitters coming up from behind me sometimes on the right, mostly on the left. That's because I don't spend sufficient time in the mirrors in slow or stop-go multi-lane traffic to see these folks in advance every time they show up. In that sort of traffic, one's attention is necessarily and predominantly out the front sector because that's where all the close-in action is occurring. And the quiet ones are the worst...loud bikes will tend to announce their presence acoustically well in advance of their arrival. So even though I have a good scan rate for the mirrors, a fairly large percentage of these (mostly quiet) riders "surprise" me as thy enter my car's private space.

I also note that some cage drivers in that sort of traffic (every weekday morning & afternoon on the freeways here in So Cal) will move aggressively and quickly to take advantage of any perceived speed or positional advantage in these situations. Many drivers won't take the time to thoroughly "check six" like they should and, viola.

Where the hell did he come from is probably the usual response.

I don't like to do lane splitting...

W2

Click to expand...

I agree. When I was younger (Before kids), I pulled off somewhere and hung out until traffic was lighter because I did not like lane splitting. I was usually on my day off riding for fun, so I had time to waste waiting for commuter traffic to lighten up.

On the rare occasion that I drive a car to work, I also get surprised by an occasional biker when they lane split. Most of the time I see them approaching. Some go way too fast, and I wonder if I appear that way as well?

Glad your OK

Fingerflicker said:

Wee Willy said:

Considering ALL the things I can do on a street bike, lane splitting worries me...alot. Troubles me when I'm in my car too.
I like to think I drive my car pretty well...heads up with good SA. Based on what I see happening around me all the time, I know I do better than a big majority of the other drivers out there. But I am ROUTINELY surprised by lane splitters coming up from behind me sometimes on the right, mostly on the left. That's because I don't spend sufficient time in the mirrors in slow or stop-go multi-lane traffic to see these folks in advance every time they show up. In that sort of traffic, one's attention is necessarily and predominantly out the front sector because that's where all the close-in action is occurring. And the quiet ones are the worst...loud bikes will tend to announce their presence acoustically well in advance of their arrival. So even though I have a good scan rate for the mirrors, a fairly large percentage of these (mostly quiet) riders "surprise" me as thy enter my car's private space.

I also note that some cage drivers in that sort of traffic (every weekday morning & afternoon on the freeways here in So Cal) will move aggressively and quickly to take advantage of any perceived speed or positional advantage in these situations. Many drivers won't take the time to thoroughly "check six" like they should and, viola.

Where the hell did he come from is probably the usual response.

I don't like to do lane splitting...

W2

Click to expand...

I agree. When I was younger (Before kids), I pulled off somewhere and hung out until traffic was lighter because I did not like lane splitting. I was usually on my day off riding for fun, so I had time to waste waiting for commuter traffic to lighten up.

On the rare occasion that I drive a car to work, I also get surprised by an occasional biker when they lane split. Most of the time I see them approaching. Some go way too fast, and I wonder if I appear that way as well?

Click to expand...

I disagree. I'm a big fan of what the Brits call "filtering" and we call lane-splitting, and I think it's safer than normal riding in SoCal traffic because the chance that someone will cut over and crush you is in my view actually lessened by the fact that they're not expecting a clear space to cut over into, so they're more likely to look around them at the traffic. I've learned to be more vigilant when I'm filtering in heavy traffic if there's a potential opening for a car I want to pass. I watch the driver, and I can see his intention. Drivers are also more likely to use their blinkers to signal their intentions when traffic is heavy.

I've had way more close calls from drivers changing lanes when I'm riding "normally" in traffic than when I'm filtering.

palerider said:

I've had way more close calls from drivers changing lanes when I'm riding "normally" in traffic than when I'm filtering.

Click to expand...

"Filtering" is a way of managing what IS a high-risk activity. In my experience, and IMHO, even "filtering" WILL NOT reduce the risk (percent chance of an "incident" per minute spent riding in that mode) to a value below slab riding at speed in traffic. Many and varied reasons for this: surprise factor, speed differentials, attention span (both parties) and where it's directed, number of degrees of freedom being managed, etc.

That said, I respect your decision and hope that you continue to ride without incident. There's a very good chance you won't find me behind you.

Cheers,

W2

Well, first I'm glad the OP wasn't hurt and the bike not damaged much. So he just kind of nudged you and you didn't go down and you both stopped? That's kind of surprising right there. I'd almost expect him to have kept going under those circumstances. Maybe this incident was more than I'm picturing, but still, good it was no worse.

As to the safety of the maneuver, I'm down with the lane splitters. But of course you can't assume a gap you can make it through now will still be available when you get to it. If traffic is very heavy and VERY slow, you can pretty much go through with impunity. The cars have nowhere to go; nobody changes lanes when they're sitting still and there's a car right next to them. It's when it opens up a bit that it gets more sticky. Those little openings just beg to be jumped over into by a lot of drivers, and on the freeways, a blinker is an invitation to the guy back behind you in the lane you want to enter to speed up and grab the spot you want. "How dare this guy take that spot in front of me?"

So if there's an opening in either of the lanes you're riding between as you come through, that's when you really have to watch for a sudden move--really for the possibility that someone could make a sudden move. Well, I choose to take the chance, often, but you can't be afraid to slow down, either, and just hold back till it's real clear you can make it through that next gap safely.

To you non-splitters, you can't think of it like just riding blithely down a nice little "motorcycle lane;" it's really a series of completely separate decision points with every car or pair of cars you pass.

First of all I'm glad your OK, & the cager is doing the right thing by you.

As a commuter for over 30 years in NYC, to stay safe while commuting (or anytime really) it is a daily mental excersice that I try to improve on all the time. Besides riding skills I use something called Risk Management.

We are all aware that just swinging a leg over a motorcycle is putting ourselves at risk, but even though we accept that this sport/passion is a risk you have to realize when the odds are no longer in your favor (acceptable). Here in the city the only time I lane split is when traffic is basically at a standstill. If no one can change lanes the odds IMHO is acceptable. If traffic is moving slow, then I drive like a car while making the stereo a little louder.

Lane splitting here will never become legal & if by some miracle it did I still wouldn't. And that's due to the type of drivers I have to put up with here. I drive a school bus every day & I can't give you an accurate count on how many times during the last school year while driving my bus that I have been cut off by people texting, talking on a cell, putting on make up, eating etc. and they all have the same excuse, I'm sorry..... I didn't see you. ****, if they don't see me while driving 29,000 lbs of YELLOW, they certainly aren't going to see me on a motorcycle.

I'm aware that traffic is different in SoCal than in NYC, while we may have congestion we rarely get the massive backups for miles upon miles that you guys do. We do have the same objective though & that is getting home safely to our loved ones.

That's all I ask....God deliver me safely from my ride to my loved ones. But I must do my part with a little risk management.

Glad you're OK.

As a "Brit", I am well used to filtering, it can be a real help to getting from A to B in very heavy traffic. But, as others have intimated above, I do have "risk management" considerations. (I am in no way criticizing your riding, just putting down some of my own "rules" that might help others.)

If the traffic is moving above something like 15 or 20 mph, I don't filter. The actual speed depends on all sorts of probably indefinable variables, call it "gut feel" at the time.

I never travel much faster than the two queues I'm between, say 10 to 15 max; this includes stationary traffic. Again, "gut feel" comes into play.

I keep aware of other motorcyclists filtering between other lanes than mine, some car drivers will move to help one filterer only to impede another.

If a motorist does move to help me, I always raise a hand (or possibly just fingers of my right hand) as a thanks when I am just past him/her (but I never look at them, which would mean taking my eyes off what's ahead).

I'm always on the lookout for the jealous ones who will try to block you. I will hang back until they've gone back to sleep, or get a safer opportunity to pass. On one occasion, I got a lot of satisfaction from one such; he'd deliberately baulked me three times. I sold him a dummy, accelerated as if to pass him, he moved to cover my pass, I was able to flick the bike over to pass him the other side (I love the bike's handling and performance). I'd also made sure I could get past at least one other car, I didn't want to risk him being able to tail-gate me or worse.

If a faster bike comes up behind me I will pull into one of the car lanes to let him through, a combination of keeping his frustration with my slow progress down, and I can then use him to warn drivers that there are filterers coming through (also to alert the jealous types, I assume nothing).

(Have you noticed, anyone who is traveling slower than you is a bumbling *****, anyone who wants to go faster is a raving lunatic?)

In bad weather, I will still filter so long as I feel safe.

I will not filter between queues that are traveling at much different speeds, or if I see 3 or 4 youths in an old car, or if I don't feel 100% alert (there are other reasons, including the good old "gut feel").

I still remember words spoken by the instructor I had after my 35-odd year gap in motorcycling (one of many he said). "You don't ride a motorcycle to stay in a queue of cars." He wasn't advocating stupid riding, just stating one of the reasons why we ride motorcycles.

As for the legal side, in Britain we are allowed to filter provided we don't endanger ourselves or others. The "reasonableness" of our riding would be a matter of any observer's opinion. We are certainly not allowed to weave in and out of other traffic, though I see it quite often. I really wish we had many more traffic police on our roads instead of speed cameras. (Sorry, one of my pet rants.)

Sorry about the length of my pontifications, but if it helps anyone, or even makes them think, I feel it's worth it.

SacramentoMike said:

Well, I choose to take the chance, often, but you can't be afraid to slow down, either, and just hold back till it's real clear you can make it through that next gap safely.
To you non-splitters, you can't think of it like just riding blithely down a nice little "motorcycle lane;" it's really a series of completely separate decision points with every car or pair of cars you pass.

Click to expand...

Two excellent points, Mike. These say it in a nutshell...and one must be aware of their physical and mental status.

Somedays I know my mental acuity is low or my physical reactions are slow....then I'm much more cautious and less likely to "filter". In fact, I'm more likely to take the river road home rather than the stop-0and-go highway.

mcatrophy said:

If a motorist does move to help me, I always raise a hand (or possibly just fingers of my right hand) as a thanks when am just past him/her (but I never look at them, which would mean taking my eyes off what's ahead).
If a faster bike comes up behind me I will pull into one of the car lanes to let him through, a combination of keeping his frustration with my slow progress down, and I can then use him to warn drivers that there are filterers coming through (also to alert the jealous types, I assume nothing).

Click to expand...

Yes...yes...and yes!

I'm always on the lookout for the jealous ones who will try to block you. I will hang back until they've gone back to sleep, or get a safer opportunity to pass. <snippage> I didn't want to risk him being able to tail-gate me or worse.

Click to expand...

There are a certain percentage of drivers who will intentionally block.

My mother told me there was a CHP motor officer recently killed in the L.A. area being run into a big rig by a motorist. It's possible that she confused another accident.....

I've been tail-gated/forced out of the lane by an aggressive cage driver who didn't like being passed and sped up and forced me into the lane to the right. It happens...best maneuver is to move over and await the opportunity to get away from that person.

BUT, this shouldn't turn into a diatribe on lane sharing/filtering.

This thread is about FingerFlicker's incident and damage to his bike. Thankfully no person was harmed in the making of this post and the bike will be repaired soon.

War Machine said:

Lane splitting here will never become legal & if by some miracle it did I still wouldn't.

Click to expand...

Well, you may have far more self-discipline than I (in fact it's pretty likely that you do), but I have to tell you that on a hot LA day, sitting in stop-and-stop traffic, sweat staining your shirt, dlesel smoke blowing in your face, engine heat searing your legs, some dipstick's 100-decibel hip-hop throbbing in your temples, and an opening between two rows of cars before you, it's tough to resist the temptation to (cautiously) just keep moving if you can.

And--this is pure anecdotal evidence and subject to all the caveats thereof--I've been endangered way more often in regularly flowing traffic than while filtering. The differencs is that the options for drivers to take me out are actually more limited and better-defined while I'm filtering, and thus there's a smaller set of potential problems to look our for.

But if you would actually choose to sit where you were, I'd admire your resolve, and I've have the beers and nachos ready for you when you arrived.

I thank everyone for their inputs and condolences. I have enjoyed reading everyone's input, comments, and habits. I will keep it simple by saying I share many of your views and opinions. What I have learned from this mishap is that the "safety in numbers" (I was 3rd in a group of 4) is not always a given and letting my guard down just a little was a big mistake, fortunately not a fatal one. In the spirit of "what doesn't kill you will make you stronger", I will ride on a much wiser and safer rider. The important thing is I will continue to ride because I still enjoy the riding experience.

Fingerflicker said:

In the spirit of "what doesn't kill you will make you stronger", I will ride on a much wiser and safer rider. The important thing is I will continue to ride because I still enjoy the riding experience.

Click to expand...

:clapping: Attaboy! :clapping:

Gut feeling...The Force...heightened awareness...new knowledge about what can happen...whatever...

Let's be careful out there...and keep riding!

glad you're ok and glad he fessed up with witnesses. in some lane sharing proposals things like this would result in you being at fault (rear ended and in LS mode).

I've been to Rio de Janeiro several times where of course "lane-splitting" is just part of the normal flow of traffic. What all the riders do there is constantly beep their bike horns while they're lane splitting - may not perfectly alert all cars ahead of them but i think it helps their odds, especially in slow moving traffic. Maybe folks in CA should try it? Most of the bikes in Brasil are smaller (300cc is considered a powerful engine) but it seems to work well.

mikerbiker said:

What all the riders do there is constantly beep their bike horns while they're lane splitting - may not perfectly alert all cars ahead of them but i think it helps their odds, especially in slow moving traffic.

Click to expand...

Beeping horns is probably culturally acceptable there. Here, if they were able to hear you through their rolled up windows, A/C, stereo music, "boompa-boompa" base sounds and cell phone bluetooth.....it'd likely make them more angry.

I mean..er..if they don't hear an emergency siren or see a fire truck, ambulance or law enforcement officer..... :dntknw:

For the most part, when done with a little care and patience, it really isn't that bad. One takes the observant and plans for the brain-numbed. Fingerflicker just happened to find one who was oblivious and careless but who ultimately "fessed-up".