Adjusting CO levels GEN II vs. Barbarian Mod

[RaYzerman19]

OK, I'm an *****. This post should be deleted. I didn't realize the Barbarian procedure and still searching. Apologies for wasting your time.......

My FJR is still new to me, and I just stumbled on Section 3-7 of the 2006 Service Manual. Right after the TB sync, it describes how you put the instrument cluster in diagnostic mode and adjust the CO for each cylinder individually. It's called "Adjusting The Exhaust Gas Volume - NOTE - Be sure to set the CO density level to standard then adjust exhaust gas volume."

The question to those more experienced, can a CO adjustment be done that will approximate the Barbarian Mod, or somehow "benefit" in a similar fashion? Has anyone done this, and is special diagnostic equipment required (e.g., exhaust gas analyzer, etc.)???????? I could not find this in my search elsewhere.

Ray.

 

[DaJudge]

OK, I'm an *****. This post should be deleted. I didn't realize the Barbarian procedure and still searching. Apologies for wasting your time.......
My FJR is still new to me, and I just stumbled on Section 3-7 of the 2006 Service Manual. Right after the TB sync, it describes how you put the instrument cluster in diagnostic mode and adjust the CO for each cylinder individually. It's called "Adjusting The Exhaust Gas Volume - NOTE - Be sure to set the CO density level to standard then adjust exhaust gas volume."

The question to those more experienced, can a CO adjustment be done that will approximate the Barbarian Mod, or somehow "benefit" in a similar fashion? Has anyone done this, and is special diagnostic equipment required (e.g., exhaust gas analyzer, etc.)???????? I could not find this in my search elsewhere.

Ray.

You have to do the jumper mod before you can adjust the CO levels on US bikes. The BJM will help a little at certain engine speeds, but you'll still have some of the off-idle throttle whack '07s are known for.

Just install a PCIII, use the smoothness hybrid map found HERE and be done with it.

 

[dll]

OK, I'm an *****. This post should be deleted. I didn't realize the Barbarian procedure and still searching. Apologies for wasting your time.......
My FJR is still new to me, and I just stumbled on Section 3-7 of the 2006 Service Manual. Right after the TB sync, it describes how you put the instrument cluster in diagnostic mode and adjust the CO for each cylinder individually. It's called "Adjusting The Exhaust Gas Volume - NOTE - Be sure to set the CO density level to standard then adjust exhaust gas volume."

The question to those more experienced, can a CO adjustment be done that will approximate the Barbarian Mod, or somehow "benefit" in a similar fashion? Has anyone done this, and is special diagnostic equipment required (e.g., exhaust gas analyzer, etc.)???????? I could not find this in my search elsewhere.

Ray.

You have to do the jumper mod before you can adjust the CO levels on US bikes. The BJM will help a little at certain engine speeds, but you'll still have some of the off-idle throttle whack '07s are known for.

Just install a PCIII, use the smoothness hybrid map found HERE and be done with it.

Supposedly it's smoother on the 08's, I wonder if changing to an 08 or 09 ECU would help?

 

[noland]

Just performed the throttle center spring unwind and the Barbarian Jumper Mod. The center throttle spring was one (1) unwinding. All the effort and then I hear 'click". The Barbarian Mod was easy too. Had to wait almost two days to ride which I did yesterday. Wow! Those mods along with a G2 and adjusting the throttle cables. What I missed most and am able to do now is gently modulate the throttle. Before, I'd have to carry speed into turns but would be slow on exit because I could not trust opening the throttle. It took a lot of effort and sometimes once I could overcome the spring tension I would end up way too much in the throttle. Now I can modulate while in the turn. Not perfect, but damn close.

So I go riding yesterday and it's near perfection. So smooth. I go home with a smile on my face. I then check the answering machine for messages.

The Yamaha dealership called. I have an 07 AE that apparently needs the ignition switch replaced. Fair enough.

They also want to replace the ECU due to the altitude problem. Great! Glad for the call.

Has anyone done the Barbarian Mod and then have had their ECU replaced? If so, does this mean I'll have to do it again, or is getting a new ECU like getting a different bike - meaning I won't have the problem at all. (Assuming that the ECU is a "non 07AE" unit. Meaning more not an 07 ECU but maybe an ECU that could be found in say a 2010 model). Perhaps one just recently built? If not, I can always do the Berb. Mod. again, but what a waste.

Should I reverse the Barb. Mod. before taking the bike to the dealership?

Has anyone unwound the throttle spring twice? - That is two (2) unwindings on the same bike? Is unwinding it twice too much?

Thanks to you all.

 

[RaYzerman19]

It's been a while, but I decided to go with a PC-V for a better fuel map instead of the CO settings. Throttle cable adjustments, of course. It's running pretty sweet.

I wouldn't unwind the throttle spring any more than once. At idle/low speed, it's hardly pulling any pressure at all with one unwind. As for the Barbarian Mod, just pull the jumper. You will have to redo when you get your new ECU.

 

[yamafitter]

It's been a while, but I decided to go with a PC-V for a better fuel map instead of the CO settings. Throttle cable adjustments, of course. It's running pretty sweet.

I wouldn't unwind the throttle spring any more than once. At idle/low speed, it's hardly pulling any pressure at all with one unwind. As for the Barbarian Mod, just pull the jumper. You will have to redo when you get your new ECU.

As part of the winter project for my FJR I am going to install the G2 throttle tube and probably do the throttle spring unwind. I downloaded the "hybrid" map listed above and will load that into my PCIII. I had the new ECM installed on Yamaha's dime before I went to WCR since I was going to be at altitude and didn't want any problems. My dealer (Asselstine) in Blackstock were very supportive in getting the ECM replaced and I am also friends with the regional service manager for Yamaha Canada so you will not hear any complaints from me about Yamaha service.

 

[yamafitter]

It's been a while, but I decided to go with a PC-V for a better fuel map instead of the CO settings. Throttle cable adjustments, of course. It's running pretty sweet.

I wouldn't unwind the throttle spring any more than once. At idle/low speed, it's hardly pulling any pressure at all with one unwind. As for the Barbarian Mod, just pull the jumper. You will have to redo when you get your new ECU.

As part of the winter project for my FJR I am going to install the G2 throttle tube and probably do the throttle spring unwind. I downloaded the "hybrid" map listed above and will load that into my PCIII. I had the new ECU installed on Yamaha's dime before I went to WCR since I was going to be at altitude and didn't want any problems. My dealer (Asselstine) in Blackstock were very supportive in getting the ECM replaced and I am also friends with the regional service manager for Yamaha Canada so you will not hear any complaints from me about Yamaha service.

 

[noland]

Thanks for the replies. Has anyone had a new ECU installed on an 07AE? Did it negate the need for the Barbarian Mod and/or a Power Commander?

 

[mcatrophy]

Thanks for the replies. Has anyone had a new ECU installed on an 07AE? Did it negate the need for the Barbarian Mod and/or a Power Commander?

I doubt it would make any real difference. The mod was to help problems associated with changing altitude.

Yamaha simply runs the engine as lean as they can to reduce emissions. This inevitably means poor response from overrun (no fuel) and idle (not really enough fuel).

The Barbarian Mod increases the fuel at idle, the PC (can) give some fuel on the overrun. Both will improve throttle response (the PC more).

I write this purely from hearsay (things I've read over the years on this Forum), no first hand experience. But my 2010 behaves much better than my 2006, probably mostly due to the revised (some would say un-revised) throttle cam profile.

 

[yamafitter]

Thanks for the replies. Has anyone had a new ECU installed on an 07AE? Did it negate the need for the Barbarian Mod and/or a Power Commander?

With the installation of the new ECU it is my understanding that there is no need for the Barbarian mod since the new ECU addressed the issue of high altitude which the Barbarian mod was all about. I could be wrong but that is my understanding.

 

[ionbeam]

With the installation of the new ECU it is my understanding that there is no need for the Barbarian mod since the new ECU addressed the issue of high altitude which the Barbarian mod was all about. I could be wrong but that is my understanding.

Mouse over the dotted lines.

The Barbarian mod was only about addressing leanness at idle, with the inference that fattening up the mix at idle would also translate into slightly richer running at higher rpms. The originators of this procedure bunged all 4 head pipes and used a 4 channel EGA to look at CO at both the head pipe and exhaust, each having a different specification. Their results were true only for the one '03 motorcycle tested. The lemming effect has had everyone else chanting the Barbarian Up 7 mantra ever since. The '03 ECU FI mapping has little similarity to the Gen II ECU mapping other than overall EPA leanness.

The ECU recall was supposed to be only about fixing the rate at which the ECU sampled the intake air pressure sensor which was the root cause of altitude sickness. Many people that had the ECU replaced also had the impression that the replacement ECU had new FI mapping. This would be a separate and unadvertised special from the altitude problem. Enough people noted this and had some corroborating evidence such as gas mileage change that it does seem that Yamaha diddled the FI at the same time as fixing the altitude problem.

If someone were to riv-nut the head pipes and connect an EGA to the bungs here are a few notes. First, the AIS should be disabled and the engine up to full operating temperature. At the head pipes the CO should be adjusted to 3%-4% with 4% being preferred. This should equate to ~1.5% CO measured exiting the muffler. When set to 4% it should allow a rich enough setting to improve driveability and still remain within EPA limits as of 2008.

 

[mcatrophy]

[...The Barbarian mod was only about addressing leanness at idle...

...

The ECU recall was supposed to be only about fixing the rate at which the ECU sampled the intake air pressure sensor which was the root cause of altitude sickness....

...

You explain it so much better than I did :fan_1:

 

[Bustanut joker]

Did somebody say Lemmings?

I like lemming Pie!

:jester:

 

[ionbeam]

Did somebody say Lemmings?

I like lemming Pie!

Dats 'cause you been spending too much time with the whale blubber chewing, seal bashing Texskimo. Who got married, lost ownership of his dangles and has become one of the disappeared.

 

[Fred W]

It's been a while, but I decided to go with a PC-V for a better fuel map instead of the CO settings. Throttle cable adjustments, of course. It's running pretty sweet.

I wouldn't unwind the throttle spring any more than once. At idle/low speed, it's hardly pulling any pressure at all with one unwind. As for the Barbarian Mod, just pull the jumper. You will have to redo when you get your new ECU.

I do not think that this will do quite what you expect it to do.

Pulling the Barbarian jumper should only disable your ability to further vary whatever CO settings have already been (previously) programmed into your ECU. It will not erase those prior settings. This is evident since the factory programmed values we find in our ECUs are in effect on all US bikes, even though they have disabled our ability to modify them.

So, what I'm saying is, you'll want to set them all back to "stock settings" (or else whatever you want them to remain) before pulling out the jumper. Or else just leave the jumper in and set them back (that's what I've done).

Hope that helps

 

[noland]

Thanks to you all. I better understand now. I will get the dealer to make the changes. IF there is a noticeable change worthy of a post, I'll update.

 

[RaYzerman19]

With the installation of the new ECU it is my understanding that there is no need for the Barbarian mod since the new ECU addressed the issue of high altitude which the Barbarian mod was all about. I could be wrong but that is my understanding.

Mouse over the dotted lines.

The Barbarian mod was only about addressing leanness at idle, with the inference that fattening up the mix at idle would also translate into slightly richer running at higher rpms. The originators of this procedure bunged all 4 head pipes and used a 4 channel EGA to look at CO at both the head pipe and exhaust, each having a different specification. Their results were true only for the one '03 motorcycle tested. The lemming effect has had everyone else chanting the Barbarian Up 7 mantra ever since. The '03 ECU FI mapping has little similarity to the Gen II ECU mapping other than overall EPA leanness.

The ECU recall was supposed to be only about fixing the rate at which the ECU sampled the intake air pressure sensor which was the root cause of altitude sickness. Many people that had the ECU replaced also had the impression that the replacement ECU had new FI mapping. This would be a separate and unadvertised special from the altitude problem. Enough people noted this and had some corroborating evidence such as gas mileage change that it does seem that Yamaha diddled the FI at the same time as fixing the altitude problem.

If someone were to riv-nut the head pipes and connect an EGA to the bungs here are a few notes. First, the AIS should be disabled and the engine up to full operating temperature. At the head pipes the CO should be adjusted to 3%-4% with 4% being preferred. This should equate to ~1.5% CO measured exiting the muffler. When set to 4% it should allow a rich enough setting to improve driveability and still remain within EPA limits as of 2008.

Question.... if you vary the CO settings, doesn't the ECU get it's information from the 02 sensor, then adjusts the FI accordingly? OR is it simply a hard programming? Those of us with PCIII or V have (I assume) unplugged their 02 sensors. Anyway, just wondering if this is true or not. If not, would it be appropriate for anyone with a PC to modify their CO settings? Anyone done it and notice any goodness?

Fred.. I meant that just pull the jumper and not reset it, as they are not going to look anyway. Those returned ECU's may be scrapped or reflashed with all new values and "factory defaults".

 

[Donal]

For what it's worth........... I have an '09 which was a bit 'snatchy' from new. I adjusted all the Carbon Monoxide levels (no need to do the barbarian mod on British bikes). The bike was transformed! Since the adjustment all snatchiness has gone and it will run smoothly below 30 mph in 5th gear and pull away without a stumble. The factory settings were 0 for all 4 injectors, I adjusted them to 15.

Don

 

[ionbeam]

Question.... if you vary the CO settings, doesn't the ECU get it's information from the 02 sensor, then adjusts the FI accordingly? OR is it simply a hard programming? Those of us with PCIII or V have (I assume) unplugged their 02 sensors. Anyway, just wondering if this is true or not. If not, would it be appropriate for anyone with a PC to modify their CO settings? Anyone done it and notice any goodness?

Adjusting the CO values offsets the base FI map in the ECU; adjusting the map either up or down in a range from +128 to -127. Any feedback from the O2 sensor would be on top of the CO trim. The PC III then intercepts the ECU FI signal going to the injector and replaces it with a fuel injection volume that was tweaked by the PC III map.

The PC III EX still recommends disconnecting the O2 sensor.