Gen II Rear Brake

[Big-D]

On the way home from Taos, I lost my rear brake. I mean the foot pedal went all the way down as far as it could with no brake taking effect. I remember Daniel (Sin Loki) mentioning to me that he thought my rear shock has blown a seal because there seemed to be fluid under my bike. BeemerDon and I looked at it and felt the stuff on the ground was old that may have dripped from a car. So I didn't think more about it. Anyway, I worked on my bike yesterday, checking the pads and such and everything looks fine. So I bled the rear brake, which did not improve anything. Now I do not own a OEM shop manual, so when I look at all of the spegetti under the side cover, I decided to leave it alone until I either picked up a manual or received some wisdom from this Forum. Before I get jumped on, I did look through the FJR-Tech and the only rear brake application I saw was on a Gen l (the slower FJR).

I did receive a message from Pinhead about having to bleed the right front caliper along with the rear because they are tied together, which I will do tomorrow. I would have done it today, but I was under direction to get our BBQ propane tanks refilled or face hell from the wife. And of course after having the tanks filled and picking up a couple bottles of DOT-4 brake fluid my neighbor pulled in with his brand new Dodge Diesel pickup and wanted me to come on over and partake in the consumption of his beer while he demonstrated all of the facets of his new truck. Needless to say, I'll work on the brakes tomorrow instead.

My experience with brakes and all around maintenance on cars & trucks is fairly extensive. I have repaired and/or replaced brakes on numerous vehicles makes, models and types, but I have never seen a brake system like that of an FJR with ABS. Even my '95 Goldwing with brakes that operated the front & rear in conjunction with one another were simple to work on, although it did not have ABS. Without having the service manual, I felt it better to first hear from our Forum experts before I fork out for a manual. So that explains why I'm posting this. I'm not doubting what my friend Dave have already told me and I will do that tomorrow morning, but any other advice pertaining to my situation will be appreciated.

What caused this brake failure? I was unable to locate any leak in the system, meaning there was no trace of brake fluid either on the ground or any parts that would have surely attracted dirt while running down the road. Air must have invaded my rear brake system. The fluid level was full prior to me trying to bleed the rear caliper. The rear pedal is spongy. With the bike on the center stand, the rear brake will stop the wheel in a free spin, but once weight is applied, it is basically worthless. I showed BeemerDon while coming home from Taos, we were stopped for gas and I showed him how my pedal was easily going as far down as it could with no resistance. I truly hope by bleeding the right front and rear caliper this problem will be fixed, as it seems to be an expensive situation is that does not fix it.

So now I put my problem in your hands. Is my problem easily fixed by bleeding the air from my right front and rear brake caliper? Of has anyone experienced other problems that remind you of what I have described.

If Michigan wasn't so damn far away, I could have gone over to Bust's house, partaken in the consumption of his beer while I was properly instructed in the care and maintenance of the Gen ll brake system.

 

[GalaxyBlue]

I got nothing good to add... Damn Darksider! That MUST be it!

 

[escapefjrtist]

GB beat me to it...must be the CT! :lol:

Don't have an explanation as to what caused the loss of rear brakes. Sounds like you have experience with brakes...the FJR's are no different just be careful not to introduce air around the bleeders. I bleed mine the old fashioned way by sealing the hose end in fluid and then pumping the master cylinder until the fluid is clean. Make sure you are on the correct bleeder for the Rt. front caliper. Compare both sides and you will see the difference.

Unless something happened and boiled the fluid or seals failed, not much to go wrong. Good luck.

--G

 

[JamesK]

I assume you've checked the rear pads - just checking.

FYI, the rear brake bleeder on the front RHS caliper is the one nearly in the center of the caliper. The FSM recommends bleeding this front (rear) then the rear caliper. It might be a good idea to use this opportunity to completely flush this brake circuit with new fluid just in case it has picked up access moisture...

 

[wfooshee]

ABS doesn't add anything to the bleeding process, except time. It adds to the length of pipes the fluid goes through. I would bet that you find something when bleeding that front bleed.

 

[Big-D]

OK, after I bled the front caliper (middle bled valve), my rear brakes are working better than they ever have. I suspect that sometime during assembly, either the selling shop or the factory, air was allowed to get into the rear brake system. I don't know if it's possible or not, but it seemed to take 20k miles on the odometer before the brakes completely failed due to air in the line. I say this because my rear brakes work much better than they ever have. I don't use my rear brakes much, so I never had much reason to question them or anything to compare them to.

So anyway, after about 15 minutes, they work perfect. Thanks for the few replies. And a big thanks to my bud Pinhead for steering me in the direction of the right side front brake caliper.

 

[pinhead]

I'm glad it worked out, Dan. I'm baffled (not a stretch for me) as to why they took so long to fail. Something must have boiled?

 

[RaYzerman19]

Brake fluid is naturally hydroscopic, so it will absorb some moisture over time. If it got hot enough, the water would potentially boil and separate.

Best to flush at least every two years, some will say every year, which can't hurt. Check also that the rear brake pedal is not sticking as some have found.

 

[beemerdons]

I'm glad it worked out, Dan. I'm baffled (not a stretch for me) as to why they took so long to fail. Something must have boiled?

Dear pinhead, Many thanks for helping out our friend Big-D with his brakes. Dan actually called me, before he called you. But he did not like my recommendations. I had instructed Big-D to jack up the handlebars, the fuel tank and the rear seat assembly: Then drive a good, solid Gen 1 FJR under the raised bars, tank and seat. After he had buttoned up these items, I'd instructed Dan to take his old Gen 2 to the Lake Havasu City dump. Why ask for my excellent advice, when you won't follow it? Jesu Cristo!!!

 

[yamafitter]

I have installed Speed Bleeders on the bike to help prevent getting air into the brake system when bleeding the brakes. Basically there is a check valve in the bleeder that only allows any movement of air/fluid in one direction.

Sometimes the rear brake can be difficult to bleed due to the fact that the rear caliper is lower than the master cylinder. If not using speed bleeders there is an old dirt bike trick of reverse bleeding where you take a large syringe full of brake fluid and inject the fluid back through the bleeder into the system. You need to be very sure that you have not trapped any air in the syringe or connecting tube if attempting this method which is why I personally don't use this method.

Another tip that I have used is to remove the rear caliper and hang it so that it is higher than the rear master cylinder and leave overnight. This gives any air in the rear brake line time to migrate into the rear caliper which you can then bleed out the next day.

I bleed the brakes on the dirt bike fairly often since it is more common to "boil" the brake on a dirt bike if your feet are too big and you drag the brake all the time :nono:

 

[JamesK]

The Mityvac makes the bleeding process a quick and easy one man job, and eliminates any issues due to the caliper location.

or

 

[North Ryder]

If you that have that special tool to bleed the system, you can used a old trick, do you have a nitril glove ( doctor glove) cut one finger fill it with brake fluid put it at the bleeder attach it with an elastic open the bleeder squeeze gently, you gone see small bubble in the oil tank(as to be open)repeat until bubble are gone.

 

[Bustanut joker]

I don't use my rear brakes much, so I never had much reason to question them or anything to compare them to.

Suggestion here.....

As you don't use them why don't ya jest take em off? You could have Stanley ride bitch..

Tie a rope to his ass and boot him off when you need a little assistance form the rear wheel.

:jester:

 

[yamafitter]

I don't use my rear brakes much, so I never had much reason to question them or anything to compare them to.

Suggestion here.....

As you don't use them why don't ya jest take em off? You could have Stanley ride bitch..

Tie a rope to his ass and boot him off when you need a little assistance form the rear wheel.

:jester:

I think Stanley would be too much of an anchor.

 

[Bustanut joker]

I don't use my rear brakes much, so I never had much reason to question them or anything to compare them to.

Suggestion here.....

As you don't use them why don't ya jest take em off? You could have Stanley ride bitch..

Tie a rope to his ass and boot him off when you need a little assistance form the rear wheel.

:jester:

I think Stanley would be too much of an anchor.

Ya might just have something there Bill :lol:

 

[beemerdons]

I don't use my rear brakes much, so I never had much reason to question them or anything to compare them to.

Suggestion here.....

As you don't use them why don't ya jest take em off? You could have Stanley ride bitch..

Tie a rope to his ass and boot him off when you need a little assistance form the rear wheel.

:jester:

I think Stanley would be too much of an anchor.

Ya might just have something there Bill :lol:

Brother Barry, I have got something for you right HERE!!!

 

[beemerdons]

I don't use my rear brakes much, so I never had much reason to question them or anything to compare them to.

Suggestion here.....

As you don't use them why don't ya jest take em off? You could have Stanley ride bitch..

Tie a rope to his ass and boot him off when you need a little assistance form the rear wheel.

:jester:

I think Stanley would be too much of an anchor.

Brother Bill, Was it not the Immortal Bard William Shakespeare whom once stated: "Doth not this Pot call yon Kettle black!"

 

[yamafitter]

I don't use my rear brakes much, so I never had much reason to question them or anything to compare them to.

Suggestion here.....

As you don't use them why don't ya jest take em off? You could have Stanley ride bitch..

Tie a rope to his ass and boot him off when you need a little assistance form the rear wheel.

:jester:

I think Stanley would be too much of an anchor.

Brother Bill, Was it not the Immortal Bard William Shakespeare whom once stated: "Doth not this Pot call yon Kettle black!"

Tie a rope around me and kick me off the back and you will be going over the bars.

"May the Devil damn thee black thou cream faced loon"

Macbeth - Act 5 Scene 3

 

[CJDMOON]

If you that have that special tool to bleed the system, you can used a old trick, do you have a nitril glove ( doctor glove) cut one finger fill it with brake fluid put it at the bleeder attach it with an elastic open the bleeder squeeze gently, you gone see small bubble in the oil tank(as to be open)repeat until bubble are gone.

I have the tool but am confused about using the glove. Maybe sometime when doing your service a picture would be much appreciated. Thank you