Green Light Triggers

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MartinH

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I got my FJR late in the fall, didn't ride much. Almost all of the miles so far have been highway. However, on a recent trip around town I got stock at a red light. I'm guessing that there is not a lot of steel in the FJR. My old bike didn't get stuck as much.

My question is: Has anyone used one of the various "Green Light" triggers that tell the light you are there? I'm talking about the legal version, not the emergency vehical version.

Thanks

Martin

 
I had the same problem triggering lights, and automated gates at my workplace... To rectify this issue I RTV'ed a neodymium magnet to the underside of the bike (just behind the front wheel). I no longer have this problem...

 
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Although this may be a placebo effect according to others, I push my centerstand down at a light in between the magnetic loops. Works for me. Seriously.

 
I just make sure that I pull up with my wheels directly over the groove cut in the road for the sensor wires. If the light is adjusted right, it works fine. If it's not, I call the local city and their techs come out and adjust it like it should be.

 
I looked at that green light trigger/magnet from Cyclegear for 15 bucks. I figured the price wasn't two bad so I got it. I had two stoplights on my commute to work that would never trip for me unless there was a cage involved. After the install I tested it. Both stoplights tripped when I stopped on the sensors. :)

 
I use my kickstand too. Has worked if I recall every time but once, and that one time I think that sensor was broken.

I don't know what those underground sensors are made of, but it would appear they are looking for metal mass, not a magnetic field. Thus, even the typical parts store neodymium magnet with all its extra concentrated lines of flux would not have the metal mass needed to make the sensor trigger. But I'm just guessing... :unknw:

 
I don't know what those underground sensors are made of, but it would appear they are looking for metal mass, not a magnetic field...
My guess is that they are simply a circuit/loop with a current running through them...creating an electromagnetic effect. Once a car with a lot of metal appears adjacent to to this loop it affects or distorts the magnetic field...therefore "notifying" the control box that "a vehicle is present"...and thereby initiating the "change light" timer.

But this is all a guess...smarter people than me will come along and ruin my hypothesis. :)

 
I don't know what those underground sensors are made of, but it would appear they are looking for metal mass, not a magnetic field...
My guess is that they are simply a circuit/loop with a current running through them...creating an electromagnetic effect. Once a car with a lot of metal appears adjacent to to this loop it affects or distorts the magnetic field...therefore "notifying" the control box that "a vehicle is present"...and thereby initiating the "change light" timer.

But this is all a guess...smarter people than me will come along and ruin my hypothesis. :)
I "think" you're correct Wheatie. They are actually called Loop Detectors... or is it Detector Loops. One or the other. Civil Engineers, where are all of you?

 
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I don't know what those underground sensors are made of, but it would appear they are looking for metal mass, not a magnetic field...
My guess is that they are simply a circuit/loop with a current running through them...creating an electromagnetic effect. Once a car with a lot of metal appears adjacent to to this loop it affects or distorts the magnetic field...therefore "notifying" the control box that "a vehicle is present"...and thereby initiating the "change light" timer.

But this is all a guess...smarter people than me will come along and ruin my hypothesis. :)

They are a loop of wire. They do not have current in them. They use a radio frequency signal through the loop of wire. Typically it is a 14 gage wire with 4 to 6 turns in it depending how far away from the controller the loop is. The theory is that when your bike/car/truck crosses the loop it causes a change in the RF in the loop and a detector in the cabinet sense that change and sends a signal to the controller to let the signal know out are there. The most sensative part is the edge of the loop, so always pull up on a bike near the edge. It does rely on ferrous metal to change the field. Similar to installing a metal core inside a transformer affects the output of the transformer.

Here is a link to one of the leading companies that make loop detectors. They are adjustable to tune out interference also.

Reno Loop detectors

 
Well, I wasn't gonna get sucked into this thread, but...

The following is a compilation of what I wrote in this thread.

The 'in pavement' sensors are a wire loop. The loop has a specific AC frequency running around the loop which is monitored by a computer. When a significant sized FERROUS object rolls over and into the loop it causes a significant change in the AC frequency. The computer identifies this change to mean a vehicle is present. When your ALUMINUM motorcycle rolls over the wire and into the loop the frequency change is substantially less. For your motorcycle to be detected the computer must be programmed to have significantly better sensitive to small frequency changes. There is reluctance to do this because the more sensitive setting can cause adjacent lane sensing errors. In electronics terms, a vehicle rolling into the in pavement wire loop acts as an inductive tuning slug that significantly alters the AC frequency running in the wire loop. Motorcycles and bicycles are a small tuning slugs which yield a small AC frequency change.

Over the last decade there have been improvements in loop design which will improve detection, will reduce adjacent lane falsing and be more accommodating to large trucks whose trailers can be 3'-5' above the wire loop. The new loop design is supposed to reliably detect bicycles without causing adjacent lane falsing. These intersection detection systems can easily start at $1 million and go up from there so there hasn't been a rush to upgrade existing systems.

When I was working in the city of Manchester, New Hamster they rebuilt several intersections around our building. After the work was complete there were 3 significant intersections where one or more lanes would not recognize my FJR. On a lark I looked up the city's Highway Department and sent them an email about the vehicle sensing. In a Stunning Turn of Events™ I got a letter back from the man in charge of the Highway Department in less than 2 hours. I provided detailed information about the intersections, lanes and issues. In Stunning Turn of Events II -- by noon the next day the city work crews had readjusted all the intersections. Nobody in the USA was more shocked than I was at noon the following day, when all the intersections worked. The Highway Department guy even wrote back to ask if things were working properly.

In an area that you travel regularly you are not helpless or an eternal victim to the situation; at least make an effort to let someone know. At worst nothing will happen, but sometimes it may actually help and improve things.

Magnets are the equivalent of adding the same mass of ferrous metal down low; the magnetic field does very close to zero. Magnets are to tripping lights as copper bracelets are to managing arthritis; if you believe, then it works.

The traffic light controllers have a pre-programmed time delay between when the light is triggered and when the actual light change takes place. Some times a left turning car from the opposite direction will have already tripped the light before you pull into the loop. These two factors can make it seem like putting the center stand down or a strong neodymium magnet has initiated the triggering. In any case, the size of the vehicle does not determine when the light changes, it is a delay set by the software.

If you approach an intersection which has a rectangular box cut in the pavement (Dipole loop) you will have the best chance of triggering the light if you pull up with both wheels aligned with either the right or left long side of the rectangle. If the intersection has a rectangular box with a third cut right up the center (Quadrupole loop) place both wheels directly on the center cut. There are no guarantees, if the sensing loop is broken or out of adjustment there is almost nothing that a bicycle, scooter or motorcycle can do to trip the light, no matter how clever the rider is or how well advertised the Light Tripping gizmo may be.

Edit: I see a lot got posted while I was pasting these bits together.

 
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Killing this post, it was a duplicate for some reason. Damn rookie at the keyboard.

 
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