Most technically challenging road

[Goodman4]

We rode a "greatest hits" tour of popular NC (and nearby) roads this last week and Tammy asked me which one was the most technically challenging.  Also, how do NC roads compare with the other US twisty roads?  I've been contemplating that and am wondering what you guys think. 

Factoring out traffic, what do you think the most challenging twisty road is? I think the big mountain ascents like Mt Evans and Pike's Peak were the most difficult rides I've done, but that is more due to elevation and the falling off the edge of the world dynamic. Sierra passes in California, Rocky Mtn passes in Colorado and the Beartooth in Wyoming are beautiful and sometimes scary due to heights, but I'm thinking they are not as technically challenging with back to back tight curves like NC roads.  The Arkansas Ozarks has some challenging switchbacks but they are not long sections.

This week we rode the Snake, Cherohala, Dragon, Back of the Dragon, BRP, 80 south of BRP, 58 through Grayson Highlands, Moonshiner 28, 221 from Linville to Blowing Rock, the Suches Gauntlet, and Charley's Creek Rd this trip, but have also enjoyed the Rattler, Roan Mtn, Wayah Rd, and Little Switzerland 226A that come to mind right now.

I usually agree with the ratings of the many motorcycle sites on what are the "best roads" but that is often for scenery or other factors than technical challenge of the twisty-ness of the road.  I guess any road is challenging at a higher speed than is reasonable, but I'm trying not to consider that.

My answer to Tammy for my opinion of the most challenging twisty we rode this trip (which likely will not be popular due to its hype) was the Dragon, followed by the Snake, 80, then 58 Grayson Highlands, then Back of the Dragon. I just love the layout of 129 with the way you can lock into a serpentine back and forth. 

Whaddya think?

 

[escapefjrtist]

Lots of great motorcycle roads...I've ridden both the Dragon and Skyway and enjoyed both, with the Skyway getting the nod from me.

Perhaps not the most technically challenging, but definitely the most entertaining:

• Riding the "box" in north central Oregon.
  
• Northern California, coast range.
  
• Southern & central California, gotta love those canyons!
  

~G

 

[Bugnatr]

To me the difference riding the east mt. roads is they have a nice camber to them whereas in the west roads are flatter or even off camber in the corners.  Next time out west hit me up, I'll take you on Mosquito Ridge road- that can keep you real busy and may persuade you to include it on your list. 

 Ca has the best mc roads for one state by far.

 

[Goodman4]

To me the difference riding the east mt. roads is they have a nice camber to them whereas in the west roads are flatter or even off camber in the corners.  Next time out west hit me up, I'll take you on Mosquito Ridge road- that can keep you real busy and may persuade you to include it on your list. 

 Ca has the best mc roads for one state by far.

I like your point about the camber. I had forgotten about riding 190 by 100 Giants in California last year.  It actually tired me out with so many curves, where the NC roads feels like a track as I get into a serpentine feel.  I think that serpentine feel is what I enjoy technically the most. The lack of camber in a road probably makes it MORE technically challenging, but it doesn't FEEL as twisty or pull you through at as much speed, maybe?

Lots of great motorcycle roads...I've ridden both the Dragon and Skyway and enjoyed both, with the Skyway getting the nod from me.

Perhaps not the most technically challenging, but definitely the most entertaining:

• Riding the "box" in north central Oregon.
  
• Northern California, coast range.
  
• Southern & central California, gotta love those canyons!
  

~G

I've heard other people say they like the Cherohala better.  I've been thinking about why that might be different for us. When I got back into riding in 2008 and actually began learning how to ride correctly, we took the Honda VTX to the Dragon and Cherohala.  We LOVED the Cherohala but the Dragon actually scared me and my wrists were cramping up from holding too tight. The Cherohala became our favorite road and we did both roads a couple more times, still loving the Cherohala, but getting better at the Dragon. Then I got the FJR and the Dragon was a blast and the Cherohala became a little boring for us. 

Here is the key factor, as I'm not saying the Cherohala is a boring road... Tammy doesn't like sweepers and I can't ride them very fast. But she handles twisties really well and pulls out the camera to take pictures no matter how fast I take the curves. I've done the dragon a few times by myself and really didn't ride it any faster than with her on back. But I haven't done the Cherohala by myself. She doesn't enjoy doing a fast sweeping turn and then I don't enjoy it.  Maybe the Cherohala is great on both edges of the speed spectrum, but not so much the middle?  For a beginner, it feels great at the recommended yellow speeds, and for someone pushing things, the decreasing radius turns make for a challenging ride. But it's just a good, pretty road at the speed limit, maybe?

I'd like to try the Cherohala by myself again.  My favorite experience riding, other than the track day, was on push mountain in Arkansas a few years ago on the FJR by myself. That was all sweepers but I took them as fast as I felt comfortable (and I felt pretty comfortable that day  ). I remember posting about that ride afterwards trying to get a feel whether I was riding too hard for my ability or not. I do like living, still, and want to balance fun and safety. I'm sure I don't ride as fast or as well as many riders here.  Big Sky here on the forum took time to reach out and talk with me personally about the value of riding hard when you feel the groove and riding easy when you don't.  I sure miss him. I head to south central Missouri this Friday on the FJR to ride the Emminence area with my nephew so I'll see how I feel on those sweepers riding solo.

As for California, we did enjoy riding all around California and South Oregon last year.  We hope to ride Washington and North Oregon in the next couple years as that is  about the only good riding area in the lower 48 that we have not been to.  Well, we haven't been to the lower part of Arizona or the good riding part of Texas now that I think about it.  

One last point - for pure riding joy, the Beartooth is still my favorite road even after three times.

 

[1911]

Green River Cove Road Saluda  NC

 

[SacramentoMike]

I guess we're all kind of proud of the best roads in our own areas, and we do have some real good ones out this way (N. Cal).  Funny Doug mentioned Mosquito Ridge--that popped into my mind while reading the first post.  Steep, super tight turns (almost switchbacks), and damn narrow.  But only a few miles long.  We have lots of super roads that go on and on for miles.  You've all seen the sign at the start of California 36--the one with the wiggly arrow and reading "next 96 miles."  There are others as fun, some even more so.  Like US 1 from Leggett to Ft. Bragg (and for another 30 or 40 miles beyond).  That's my own favorite, taking over first place from my previous favorite, CA 108, the Sonora Pass.   Both have amazing riding, amazing views, and very light traffic. 

But doing NAFO in Montrose, CO, introduced me to some new incredible roads, like the "Million Dollar Highway," (US 550), a new high in scary-dangerous riding.  No shoulder (for extended stretches) and seven-mile drop-offs.  At least.  But when I tried it, speed was not a factor because it was always choked with traffic.  Still . . .

Rode the Dragon.  Too short to qualify.  Started the Cherahola, but gave it up just a few miles in, following two wahoos on Harleys with straight pipes deafening me, and a big-ass un-passable dump truck in the lead.  Hairiest road I ever tried?  My vote still goes to one not even on this continent.  Eidelweiss tour with some of you in 2013 (there's Don Stanley at the end), some crazy little road straight up the side of a mountain, name unknown.  I've posted it before, but worth another look.  Check it out.

 

[McRide]

Hwy 96 West from Yreka, following the Kalamath River, to Willow Creek, then to 299 West , take a south on Titlow Hill Road to Hwy 36 and stop at the Mad River Burger Bar. Take 36 east or west from there.

 

[Auburn]

Hwy 96 West from Yreka, following the Klamath River, to Willow Creek, then to 299 West , take a south on Titlow Hill Road to Hwy 36 and stop at the Mad River Burger Bar. Take 36 east or west from there.

yep, one of my favorite rides.

you can also turn off of Hwy 96 at Somes Bar and follow the Salmon River east back over to Callahan on Hwy 3, then go south over Scott Mountain following Trinity Lake and to Weaverville, west to Willow Creek and Titlow Hill Road, then finish out your route.

 

[dravnx]

The famous Hwy 36 sign is next 140 miles, not 96. 

Technically challenging depends on the rider, the bike, the conditions, etc. I rode Breckenridge Rd in the southern Sierras near Lake Isabella. It's one of the most technically challenging roads I've ever ridden. Hairpin turns for miles going up the side of a mountain, single lane with traffic going in both directions, not much but they were there and sand in the roadway. I've ridden the roads all over California and this was the most challenging. Horsing the FJR up this mountain was a work out, physically and mentally. The reward was going down the other side. Fun, fast and clean. 

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Breckenridge+Rd,+California/@35.4095588,-118.7419871,14.32z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x80c1dc79f0a20e05:0xbbbc5155e8b90f5d!8m2!3d35.4304078!4d-118.7277662

 

[Panman]

Any given Rd I'm on at the moment is the best Rd.

If your lucky enought to ride a M/C and understand it, your lucky enough! 

JSNS

 

[SwollenRaccoon]

   Love the topic, but there are so many variables that it boggles my tiny, walnut-sized brain.  "Technically-challenging"?  A few years ago, I was in northern Arkansas on the FJR, and we got off the paved stuff to cut across to another good paved section.  Might have been near Oark.  Anyway, the "gravel" road had just been recently covered with new rock, and when I say recently, I mean like maybe the day before. You could see that almost no vehicles had traveled on it yet. The rocks they used to cover the road were just slightly smaller than ping pong balls, and all loose, since they hadn't been packed down yet. It felt like I was guiding a boat through shallow water with the motor tipped way up, wallowing like a walrus in petroleum jelly.  I sweated like a whore in church, and tried to keep reminding myself to lose the death grip on the handlebars, and finally resigned myself to the fact that I was going to tip over, sooner or later, so I just tried to go at a speed that would minimize the wallowing, yet slow enough that I wasn't going to explode the bike when I tipped over.  Amazingly, we made it the five or six miles to the pavement without falling over.  I have no idea how. So, "challenging"?  You bet.

   "Challenging" in terms of having to be in charge of your faculties and have your antennae at full alert?  Arkansas 123 south of Mount Judea, Push Mountain Road in Arkansas, Arkansas 9 between Allison and Melbourne, short sections of Wisconsin 88, south of Gilmanton, and County C, south of Mindoro (Old Hwy 108), Colorado 550 between Silverton and Ouray, the climb up Mount Evans, and Canada Ridge Road, north of Fountain City, Wisconsin, in the early fall, when the corn is tall and you can't see the corners coming over the blind crest.  Those are some of my favorites.  I have not ridden in California, but by all accounts, I do need to ride there, and I probably will.

   (And this morning, here in southern Minnesota, we just set another record low for this date....11 degrees F.  It has been ten consecutive days that we haven't reached 40 for a high temp, and it's only October. That is bullshit, my friends.)

 

[Bugnatr]

I guess we're all kind of proud of the best roads in our own areas, and we do have some real good ones out this way (N. Cal).  Funny Doug mentioned Mosquito Ridge--that popped into my mind while reading the first post.  Steep, super tight turns (almost switchbacks), and damn narrow.  But only a few miles long.

Uhh, Mike you may need to go ride it again as it's 50 plus miles to Wentworth Springs road.

 

[hppants]

   ..., Arkansas 9 between Allison and Melbourne, ...

Ya know - in all the years I've ridden Arkie, well over a dozen times on Push Mountain, and I've NEVER ridden that section of Hwy 9.  But I see it on the map, and the next time I'm up there, I definitely will.  Thanks S/R!!

If I interpret the O/P literally, then the most technical road I've ridden is the Dragon.  Blind corners, decreasing radius curves, keeping an eye out for squids, semi trucks, pirates, and all other forms of idiots and animals, tight (TIGHT) twisties.... that would be my vote.

 

[Goodman4]

Great responses, thanks!!  I've been pulling up everything on the map.  Even though we rode a lot of great roads in our 2300 mile California trip last year, of all the ones mentioned, we only did Highway 1.  It makes me want to go back and hit those this time.  Except for Breckenridge, the rest of the CA roads here were on my initial list but got substituted to make Yosemite, Lassen and Crater Lake in a circuit.  If I had to go back in time I wouldn't change it because they provided such great scenery, but certainly I will make these suggestions top priority if we get to go back. My brother lived in the town of Lake Isabella for several years but I wasn't aware of Breckenridge road. 

Enjoyment of a road certainly depends on traffic and personal preference. Usually a recommended road makes me enjoy it more due to the anticipation and wondering what the other rider liked about it.  But finding a good road on a map that you did not have high expectations for is also fun.  I remember enjoying Wayah road in NC with my nephew after we took it because we saw it looked twisty on the map.  He will tell you it's his favorite road of all time.

But back to the "technical" nature, I would agree with SwollenRaccoon that a recently gravelled road is in a class by itself.  I think I've been on the road by Oark he mentions but it wasn't fresh gravel by any means, so I feel for him.  I've been on gravel just like that taking a shortcut here locally and I'm lucky I didn't drop the FJR. 

I was initially thinking more technical than dangerous, I guess.  For dangerous, I think of Moki Dugway in Arizona.  It was dangerous for three reasons: 1. It's narrow, steep, and twisty with some pavement, but gravel on the turns, 2. I did it on the Goldwing with the wife after telling her it wouldn't be too bad, and 3. I got nervous from the drop off and tightened up and almost ran into the inside ditch.  I'm really lucky she didn't kill me afterward.  We still joke about it.  What we survive makes for good memories.

 

[Bounce]

Did deep gravel during the Roadkill Safari Rally. The point was to collect city signs with names of animals. There was no prohibition about them being in English or NOT being fictional, so I went after Draco, TX.

Turns out that it no longer exists and only a memorial plaque that was put there in 1968; put of by the state. Worth a score though. In and out of there was deep gravel just like above (loose and about wheel-rim deep). It seems, in my recollections, that it was 25 miles in and another to get back out but it may have been 25 miles total.

Stand on pegs, unload the front wheel by getting your weight back. Slow and smooth.

 

[Bugnatr]

I was initially thinking more technical than dangerous, I guess.  For dangerous, I think of Moki Dugway in Arizona.  It was dangerous for three reasons: 1. It's narrow, steep, and twisty with some pavement, but gravel on the turns, 2. I did it on the Goldwing with the wife after telling her it wouldn't be too bad, and 3. I got nervous from the drop off and tightened up and almost ran into the inside ditch.  I'm really lucky she didn't kill me afterward.  We still joke about it.  What we survive makes for good memories.

Ha,years ago a buddy on his GS and me on my 04 came to the Dugway without knowing a thing about it. We rode up it and actually was a bit surprised on how easy it was. Did you ride up or down Moki?  Riding downhill on steep mountain roads is much more difficult than going uphill, even worse 2 up. Gravel always adds a bit of interest to any road.

I suspect it's all a matter of prospective, when you live and drive/ride on steep mountain roads daily those cliffs of death don't seem like that big of a deal anymore.  OR as my lovely wife has said "you made it this far, don't f-up now!"