New Driving Technology in Cars - impact on Motorcyles?

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Goodman4

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I just read another article about the technology improvements coming in automobiles. Cool stuff but a lot of the debate will be about privacy issues and safety concerns when you trust the robot to drive. What do you guys think the future looks like for motorcycles in a robot car world? Americans are going to have a tough time letting robot cars be the only drivers on the road because they love driving, but I still think it's coming, even though not soon.

More realistically, are the safety features in cars that are now or near future going to play well with motorcycles? Does an auto-park system work in front of a bike for instance? Does the autobrake on the new cars see a bike?

Or will some of this technology move to motorcycles? Will we have autobraking or warning indicators? I'll bet we have black boxes for accidents soon enough.

 
Hey All,

Dont think this emerging technology will have much of a difference on motorcycles. Don,t know about the state you reside in but here in the great state oTexas, around 80% or more of motorcylce accidents are the fault of the motorcyclist, no joke. I would take a wild guess that the average is close in most states. Also, the leading cause of death among riders is no / wrong protective gear. Try as we may.............sometimes you just can't fix "stupid".

As for "Black Box" technology, sorry to tell you that it's already in most cars. There has been a push by privacy advocates for legislation that would require dealers to inform buyers if their car is equiped with one. Progressive Insurance "safe driver" plug in monitor is just that. It monitors acceleration, deceleration braking and just about any other info regarding driving habits.

When it comes to letting "Big Brother" into our lives, some would just rather leave the door wide open for him. Don't get it, but thats just me.

To All:

Be Good, Be Safe

Daniel

 
There are so many "safety" features in cars now days that the idiot "drivers" don't think they need to pay attention any more. They seem to think the car will do everything for them. "OH, I can change lanes now without having to look because my car has blind spot warnings. I don't need to pay attention to my lane placement because my car has lane departure warning. I don;t need to pay attention to my following distance because my car has adaptive cruise control. All of these things now let me pay MORE attention to my phone and car info screen instead of having to worry about actually driving my car...."

Hell, MAYBE the robot cars will make it safer for those of us on two wheels. I doubt it though.

 
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It worries me to see drivers trust the vehicle to do the driving. I spent most of my working life in the technology industry, and I know that technology is not foolproof. However, it is coming because the risks of a technological failure is less than the risk we live with from inattentive drivers. I don't object so much to warning lights and buzzers, but once people learn to trust the vehicle to brake for them then they will become even less attentive and that is more dangerous for everyone, especially motorcycles.

Regarding motorcycles, I think we may see some warning lights and buzzers and such, but I doubt buyers will be interested in a motorcycle that takes control of the brakes or other systems.

The insurance industry loves the fact that the ECU records a lot of control input and we will likely see that added to motorcycles as they become more dependent on ECU functions. It wouldn't surprise me if the 2014 FJR has that capability since it has so many other ECU features. The data is useful for debugging problems and the fact that it is collected is not really a problem, it is a problem if we allow it to be transferred beyond the vehicle, like On-Star can do. FWIW, some (maybe all, I don't know) vehicles store this data in volatile storage and it is lost if the battery is disconnected.

The way for us to prevent the black box from becoming part of motorcycling is to refuse to buy a new one that has it.

 
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I just read another article about the technology improvements coming in automobiles. I'll bet we have black boxes for accidents soon enough.
Goodman4,

Most cars newer than 2000 (and before) have black boxes now. They ran it through the airbag system, so it can't be disconnected easily. Many insurance companies will not pay an accident claim until an insurance "adjuster" downloads the black box information from the wreck, usually at the wrecking yard or shop, and they will not ask you for permission first.

Be careful what you wish for . . .
no.gif


Infrared

 
IMHO, manufacturers will have to refine this technology to recognize motorcycles without fail (if they don't, the liability implications would be enough to make an ambulance chaser drool), or legislate motorcycles off the road. If they are successful in creating a system that recognizes motorcycles, I hate to think of the chaos one squidly sportbike rider could create weaving in and out of traffic at speed on a heavily traveled road (like I270 in morning rush) when vehicle computers are performing all the driving functions. Lots of development gonna be required before this "perfect world" is a practical reality...

 
So much technology to work around the actual root cause - the loose nut behind the wheel. This is a soap box topic that I could go on about. I enjoy driving; I'm involved in the process and hope to have good situational awareness. My brother sees his car as a rolling entertainment system first and transportation a distant second place. I race at the track and have a good idea of the performance characteristics of my car and I'm practiced at gauging closing distances and speed. I'm not yet ready to turn over the driving to anyone or anything else.

The ability of cars to gather information, store it, transmit it and make it available without my consent is a double edge sword. On the one hand it makes it easier for a mechanic to diagnose subtle problems in what is now a highly complex car. On the other hand, your bare ass is hanging out for all to see every action you take (or missed taking) is there for anyone to see.



 
It worries me to see drivers trust the vehicle to do the driving.
Color me a cynic, but based on how people in the US drive (compared to the rest of the world), it might be better trusting the vehicle.
Yes, most drivers do not enjoy the task of driving and do not focus on it. They have become complacent and careless. Having a vehicle with the technology to compensate for this lack of driver's focus teaches them that they are OK and don't need to re-learn how important it is to pay attention to the task of driving. As painful as this is to those of us who actually enjoy driving and riding, it is even worse because of the possibility of the technology to fail.

 
Good comments. To clarify, I know we have black boxes on our cars, but I don't think most motorcycles have them yet.

I think I read the article on CNN on my phone but I can't find anything but a video that only covers about half what I read a couple days ago. Maybe they decided that people that are interested in driverless cars are the same people that don't like to read and have to watch a stupid multimedia video to understand something. But news videos are another pet peeve of mine.

The part of the article that concerned me was them talking about lowering your insurance rate depending on your driving style. They have already gleaned that people are more likely to have to file a claim if the driver usually breaks quickly instead of gradually. That means your rates are going up if you are an aggressive, but skilled driver.

What about when they get to the point they send you a ticket every time you go over the speed limit as determined by your data upload from your car? It's very feasible.

I also am very skeptical of "learning technology" that they discussed that learns your habits and helps make decisions for you. I work in IT and used to be a developer. Back in the dark ages I took a few AI classes and was really intrigued by the actual programming as opposed to the Sci-Fi concepts. It's mostly about rule creation and exception management.

An example of bad learning technology to me is Garmin's learning mode on my Nuvi I use in my car. I took it on a trip and had to get off the main road to avoid some traffic and so from then on it "learned" I wanted to take side roads and avoid the main thoroughfare. I had to figure out how to turn that mode off and go back to "quickest route" before I went nuts. It's going to take a long time for them to make the rules match all the exceptions of individual human situations to be helpful.

 
All good points. The pizza video is scary from the point that when I give certain retailers my cell phone number they confirm my address from their computer. Whaaat! My biggest issue with all of this is the lack of everyone's ability to volunteer.

I remember my parents back in 1967 requesting seat belts in the new station wagon they were ordering. Why can't we still do that? Why can't we order airbags as an option?

Many reasons but what it all comes down to in this day and age is a willingness to accept whatever the government mandates. After all, they are only looking out for our welfare.

Okay, enough soapbox.

Mark

 
Why can't we still do that? Why can't we order airbags as an option?
Many reasons but what it all comes down to in this day and age is a willingness to accept whatever the government mandates. After all, they are only looking out for our welfare.

Okay, enough soapbox.

Mark
Because then too many people will make the wrong decision.

I used to think poeple will make the right decision for themselves but in the past five years I've changed my mind. I've come to realize that most people don't put enough thought into their decisions and end up doing stupid things. Like taking out mortgages on homes they can't afford, buying $40k trucks when they can't afford 12 MPG, or refusing to wear a helmet becaue they think they cause neck injuries, or spending money on booze and cigarettes instead of health insurance. These are just a few examples, the list could seemingly go on forever.

Sure .. I think a few of us are capable of weighing the pro's and con's and actually benefit from the ability to choose whether to buy seat belts etc. but by far most of the people in our society would rather go for the short-term benefit, while justifying thier behavior. Like my wife's college-educated friend who refuses to wear a seat belt because if he drives into a lake she thinks she'll be trapped ... doi ... my brother's friend who thinks health insurance should be cheaper for smokers because they die sooner (and he smokes .. no surprise there..) .. wtf ... ?!? and a fellow rider (a really nice guy but not the sharpest tool in the shed) who actually believes the Affordable Care Act has made health insurance cheaper and keeps thinking he's "getting money from the government" when he gets a tax REFUND. Or the mother of the 12-year-old we are mentoring ... just had another kid (third one, third baby-daddy) when she could barely afford the two first ones, and realized now she doesn't have to work because welfare and child-support pays better (I hope she doesn't quit school). Ugh.

The movie "Idiocracy" was terrible but I think there was an element of truth to it. Likewise .. "People" magazine is read more than newspapers or books.

At my core I'm a libertarian, but over the years I've realized that most of the people in our country would not be able to function in a truly libertarian political system. It isn't easy reconciling that with the liberal notion that people are stupid and government has to make important decisions for them.

Oh right, mandatory driving technologies...

Despite the instrusions on personal freedoms and increased costs of vehicles, one can't look away from how technology has made our roads much safer. That's despite many more cars going significantly faster with more dolts driving.

 
One of the "mandated" emerging technologies is some sort of wi-fi "network" between all the vehicles in a cluster of traffic. This is for early warning (automatic braking) in the event of an impending collision and I believe lane change safety.

I'd like to see some so of add on transmitter we could put on our bikes just to let these cars know we are there.

 
...I'd like to see some so of add on transmitter we could put on our bikes just to let these cars know we are there.
My car has proximity detectors with selectable sensitivity. When something gets within the sensed range I get a beep, the display shows a car icon indicating the side or end of the car that is getting too close. It starts with a green indicator at the offending location, if I continue to get closer the beeps get more excited and the display changes to yellow then red. It alerts me if I get too close to adjacent vehicles or if they drift too close to me. So far it hasn't been a nuisance and has been helpful to keep my trunk out of snow banks when backing up. At highway traffic speeds I dunno if it is fast enough to prevent changing lanes into a motorcycle in my blind spot.

 
Why can't we still do that? Why can't we order airbags as an option?
Many reasons but what it all comes down to in this day and age is a willingness to accept whatever the government mandates. After all, they are only looking out for our welfare.

Okay, enough soapbox.

Mark
Because then too many people will make the wrong decision.

I used to think poeple will make the right decision for themselves but in the past five years I've changed my mind. I've come to realize that most people don't put enough thought into their decisions and end up doing stupid things. Like taking out mortgages on homes they can't afford, buying $40k trucks when they can't afford 12 MPG, or refusing to wear a helmet becaue they think they cause neck injuries, or spending money on booze and cigarettes instead of health insurance. These are just a few examples, the list could seemingly go on forever.

Sure .. I think a few of us are capable of weighing the pro's and con's and actually benefit from the ability to choose whether to buy seat belts etc. but by far most of the people in our society would rather go for the short-term benefit, while justifying thier behavior. Like my wife's college-educated friend who refuses to wear a seat belt because if he drives into a lake she thinks she'll be trapped ... doi ... my brother's friend who thinks health insurance should be cheaper for smokers because they die sooner (and he smokes .. no surprise there..) .. wtf ... ?!? and a fellow rider (a really nice guy but not the sharpest tool in the shed) who actually believes the Affordable Care Act has made health insurance cheaper and keeps thinking he's "getting money from the government" when he gets a tax REFUND. Or the mother of the 12-year-old we are mentoring ... just had another kid (third one, third baby-daddy) when she could barely afford the two first ones, and realized now she doesn't have to work because welfare and child-support pays better (I hope she doesn't quit school). Ugh.

The movie "Idiocracy" was terrible but I think there was an element of truth to it. Likewise .. "People" magazine is read more than newspapers or books.

At my core I'm a libertarian, but over the years I've realized that most of the people in our country would not be able to function in a truly libertarian political system. It isn't easy reconciling that with the liberal notion that people are stupid and government has to make important decisions for them.

Oh right, mandatory driving technologies...

Despite the instrusions on personal freedoms and increased costs of vehicles, one can't look away from how technology has made our roads much safer. That's despite many more cars going significantly faster with more dolts driving.

I have to disagree. As soon as you say 'most people will make the wrong decision' you are implying that you know what the right decision is for someone else, even if that person disagrees. The real issue is that everyone has to accept responsibility for the consequences of their actions and decisions. By making the decision for them you relieve them of responsibility.

 
Taken from BMW's auto side/industry, they now have keyless ignition on the GT-E Motorcycles. Just like a car, simply have the Key-FOB on you (jacket pocket?) and you can start/run bike as if the key is in the ignition. Sure makes it simple especially when going in and out of diners, touristy look out spots etc.

I can see this as a future Yami addition :)

 
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