NTSB Looking into motorcycle crashes

[NC_Yank]

I came across this article early this morning.

NTSB looking into motorcycle crashes

For those that have followed various debates that surround motorcycling, this is nothing new however in

light of high profile accidents, I think its a matter of time before there will be a flurry of motorcycle saftey legislation both state and federal that we will see coming down the pipe.

What is disturbing is that several factors are directly related to motorcyclist themselves.

Gleaning some basic causes into motorcycle fatalities we have the following.

1) Excessive speed (we all have been guilty of at one time or another)

2) Alcohol (the article stated that approx. 40% involved alcohol)

This coincides with statistics involving cagers as well. I have investigated thousands of accidents and about 40% of them were alcohol related.......the percentages go up even more on accident that occur at night or in the early morning hours.

Anyone that feels they can have a few alcoholic beverages and then get out and drive is playing a game of Russian Roulet.....not only with their life but with others as well. I have never arrested anyone whose main intent was to get drunk and then drive.............. however because alcohol impairs ones mental facualties then it is almost inevitable that at one point in that persons life they will get behind the wheel or handle bars and drive / ride.

3) Safety Equipment

I know this is a volatile subject, especially with HD rider in regards to helmet laws. Look at the statement Mr. Reichenbah said in the aricle..... "Mr. James "Doc" Reichenbach, a bearded and tattooed biker who lives in Silver Springs, Fla., said better statistics are needed to show whether or not helmets protect riders."

I have heard the same crap about seat belts.....how they don't save lives or more research is needed.

Oh please.....lets just be honest about it. If you dont want to wear a seat belt or a helmet for

personal reaons then say so......but dont make stupid statements like that, it makes motorcyclist look like we are morons.

I dont think they every interviewed those cyclist who favored safety equipment.

Helmets and seatbelts do save lives......I have seen both.

I am not advocating both but from a factual basis, they do save lives.

In regards to helmets, I am not talking about the piss kettle buckets that people put on their heads.

I am only speculating but I bet that Roethlisberger had such a bucket on his head at the time of his accident.

Several years ago I investigated a mc vs. cager accident in which the cyclist (early 20's) was racing his buddy from light to light. Eventually the cyclist ended up hitting a van that was making a left turn.

The van was headed south making a left turn into a business parking lot while the mc heading north was stuck at a red light. As soon as the light turned green the mc took off and with in 2 seconds had traveled half the distance of a football field and hit the van that was already in the middle of its left turn.

MC rider was thrown (vaulted) over 100 feet landing / scaping on his head. Fortunately he was wearing a full face helmet. His helmet told the story of what his face and skull would have looked like.

Although he was unconscious from the accident, he ended up being treated and released with just a few bruises and of course a Careless and Reckless ticket in hand.

With that said, I personally thinks it should be a personal decision for experienced riders if they want to strap a helmet onto their head but at the same time if they get seriously maimed then my insurance and taxes should not pay for their foolishness.......regardless to who is at fault. I do think that all young and new riders should be required to wear a full face helmet.

4) Other drivers

Not much you can do about that then what we already should be doing........expecting people do to stupid things around us.

I think that ultimately Uncle Sam will tie federal tax dollars to the enforcement of motorcycle legislation, much like the enforcement of 55mph limits on federal highways.

 

[SMC]

Well reasoned comments from experience NC Yank!

 

[FJR1300Jeff]

4) Other driversNot much you can do about that then what we already should be doing........expecting people do to stupid things around us.

Great report. I've often figured that many of the one bike crashes are alcohol related. Or just inexperience combined with excessive speed. Of course all the media reports is motorcyclist killed. He or she was or was not wearing a helmet.

The ones that scare me are the completely unforeseen on unexpected ones. Like you are riding at the speed limit and cruising through a green light and someone just flat out runs the light and takes you out. Or the little old lady that mistakes the accelerator for the brake while coming up behind you. Not much if anything you can do about that weather in a cage or on a bike. Unfortunately when it happens to us on a bike we usually come out the losers.

 

[Mogambo]

I came across this article early this morning.

NTSB looking into motorcycle crashes

For those that have followed various debates that surround motorcycling, this is nothing new however in

light of high profile accidents, I think its a matter of time before there will be a flurry of motorcycle safety legislation both state and federal that we will see coming down the pipe.

What is disturbing is that several factors are directly related to motorcyclist themselves.

Gleaning some basic causes into motorcycle fatalities we have the following.

1) Excessive speed (we all have been guilty of at one time or another)

2) Alcohol (the article stated that approx. 40% involved alcohol)

This coincides with statistics involving cagers as well. I have investigated thousands of accidents and about 40% of them were alcohol related.......the percentages go up even more on accident that occur at night or in the early morning hours.

Anyone that feels they can have a few alcoholic beverages and then get out and drive is playing a game of Russian Roulet.....not only with their life but with others as well. I have never arrested anyone whose main intent was to get drunk and then drive.............. however because alcohol impairs ones mental facualties then it is almost inevitable that at one point in that persons life they will get behind the wheel or handle bars and drive / ride.

3) Safety Equipment

I know this is a volatile subject, especially with HD rider in regards to helmet laws. Look at the statement Mr. Reichenbah said in the aricle..... "Mr. James "Doc" Reichenbach, a bearded and tattooed biker who lives in Silver Springs, Fla., said better statistics are needed to show whether or not helmets protect riders."

I have heard the same crap about seat belts.....how they don't save lives or more research is needed.

Oh please.....lets just be honest about it. If you dont want to wear a seat belt or a helmet for

personal reaons then say so......but dont make stupid statements like that, it makes motorcyclist look like we are morons.

I dont think they every interviewed those cyclist who favored safety equipment.

Helmets and seatbelts do save lives......I have seen both.

I am not advocating both but from a factual basis, they do save lives.

In regards to helmets, I am not talking about the piss kettle buckets that people put on their heads.

I am only speculating but I bet that Roethlisberger had such a bucket on his head at the time of his accident.

Several years ago I investigated a mc vs. cager accident in which the cyclist (early 20's) was racing his buddy from light to light. Eventually the cyclist ended up hitting a van that was making a left turn.

The van was headed south making a left turn into a business parking lot while the mc heading north was stuck at a red light. As soon as the light turned green the mc took off and with in 2 seconds had traveled half the distance of a football field and hit the van that was already in the middle of its left turn.

MC rider was thrown (vaulted) over 100 feet landing / scaping on his head. Fortunately he was wearing a full face helmet. His helmet told the story of what his face and skull would have looked like.

Although he was unconscious from the accident, he ended up being treated and released with just a few bruises and of course a Careless and Reckless ticket in hand.

With that said, I personally thinks it should be a personal decision for experienced riders if they want to strap a helmet onto their head but at the same time if they get seriously maimed then my insurance and taxes should not pay for their foolishness.......regardless to who is at fault. I do think that all young and new riders should be required to wear a full face helmet.

4) Other drivers

Not much you can do about that then what we already should be doing........expecting people do to stupid things around us.

I think that ultimately Uncle Sam will tie federal tax dollars to the enforcement of motorcycle legislation, much like the enforcement of 55mph limits on federal highways.

No, Mr. Roethlisberger wasn't even wearing one of those head buckets. Would you like to know why (in my opinion)? If he wore a proper helmet, then no one would be able to see that it was Ben Roethlisberger riding that Hayabusa (with no MC license, either I might add).

Vanity. people are willing to risk their lives to feature themselves riding a motorcycle.

Here in PA, our genius Governor actually repealed the helmet law we had in place. Now please explain to me the sense it makes to institute and enforce laws in regard to automobile drivers wearing a seatbelt, and then make the decision to say that it is O.K. for motorcyclists to ride without a helmet. It doesn't make ANY sense. Either both or none.

I know I will receive flack for this (not that I care), but I really do believe that sometimes laws are necessary for morons to protect themselves from their own lack of common sense, or just plain stupidity. Of course I also believe that it should be illegal to talk on the cell phone (even hands free) and drive. We ALL know how dangerous this is and we ALL have stories about encounters. BUT...they still allow it. WHY? Money. Can you imagine how much money cell phone carriers would lose if cell phone use in cars was banned?

And people say that it is no more dangerous than eating a sandwich or changing the radio station while driving. ********. People are being killed and maimed by the thousands by the practice of driving while on cell phones, but nobody raises a finger to do anything about it. Why? Money. Profit.

Sorry for the tangent.

 

[Scab]

Vanity. people are willing to risk their lives to feature themselves riding a motorcycle.

Well, that explains my willingness to wear my full-face helmet. Anti-vanity. Anything that covers.

But really, I would like to see an in-depth science based study on motorcycle safety. We don't have any current information and a lot of things have changed. If the study has no preconceived ideas or notions then we would all benefit from it's findings. Without the facts and information, bad decisions are made. Good factual information can only lead to better decisions, whether governmental or individual. edit: (not that it would, but could)

 

[radman]

Any time the NTSB focuses on any group/vehicle, bad things follow. Always. Name any percieved problem that the guv has focused on that improved as a result of any actions taken by said guv.

 

[Scab]

cafe standards

 

[twowheelnut]

Any time the NTSB focuses on any group/vehicle, bad things follow.

Word, dat be da troof.

 

[tripletango]

Well reasoned comments from experience NC Yank!

Agreed.

Somewhere I read that if all riders who died without a helmet, nearly 40% would have survived if they were wearing one.

 

[radman]

cafe standards

Pfffffffffffft. Read the first line in yer sig............

 

[Fencer]

Vanity. people are willing to risk their lives to feature themselves riding a motorcycle.

Well, that explains my willingness to wear my full-face helmet. Anti-vanity. Anything that covers.

And for that we are ALL GREATFUL

 

[Toecutter]

I'd like to see some numbers comparing people injured in motorcycle crashes to people injured on staircases.

 

[Bounce]

Any time the NTSB focuses on any group/vehicle, bad things follow. Always. Name any percieved problem that the guv has focused on that improved as a result of any actions taken by said guv.

from the wording it looks like they'll focus on the wrong things (how to change motorcycles) instead of the right things (improved driver training and certainty/severity of those who kill motorcyclists through inattention or intent).

 

[jestal]

cafe standards

You are talking about CAFE standards...as in Corporate Average Fuel Economy? And are you joking or serious that they worked??

CAFE standards actually did the exact OPPOSITE of what they were intended for.

CAFE standards are similar to passing laws that the clothing industry must only make small and medium sized clothes so as to force people to loose weight.

All CAFE standards did was to force auto companies to make cars smaller and lighter....which is NOT what people wanted to drive. They wanted large cars still soo.... they bought trucks. CAFE standards can be directly blamed for the explosive popularity of large SUVs over the past decade. The SUVs were the only vehicles that did what the public wanted.

The problem was dependence on oil a la the "gas crisis" of the late 70's. The intended goal was to get people to drive more efficient vehicles that used less fuel. CAFE was the tool of choice. As a result the average fuel economy of the actual vehicle fleet on the highways barely changed over the last couple of decades. Cars got a lot more efficient as a result of CAFE. But fewer people bought them and they bought trucks and SUV's instead. So, CAFE is a dismal failure and typical of the kind of asinine BS the government cooks up to "solve" a problem.

I'd like to see some numbers comparing people injured in motorcycle crashes to people injured on staircases.

...........or skiing, or bicycling or horse back riding or playing high school football, or skateboarding, etc. Lots of injuries and deaths there also but they are more politically correct activities than motorcycling.

 

[twowheelnut]

from the wording it looks like they'll focus on the wrong things (how to change motorcycles) instead of the right things (improved driver training and certainty/severity of those who kill motorcyclists through inattention or intent).

What, like this is Yerup or sumpin'? Send lawyers, guns and money and then, more lawyers and aw, nevermind... But your assement is correct. If you have the opportunity, grab AutoWeek's (two weeks ago) issue that dealt with and delved into the whole issue of driver training...

[SIZE=8pt]...and he walked away mumbling something about Pablum pukers.[/SIZE]

 

[sparky3008]

I agree with almost everything you said or presented except 1 thing.

You don't think insurance should pay for a biker who isn't wearing gear yet pays for insurance.

Ok but if you view this as a burden on your insurance premiums then I will pose that we don't treat criminals that get shot or injured buy police officers. They usually don't even have insurance and yet they get treatment and I am pretty confident they are never going to pay the bill yet we motorcyclists with insurance will.

I also would like for anyone in an accident that has been drinking does not have their bills paid for by insurance or the state either.

You may also know that many insurance companies will not pay a bill if the accident occured while riding a motorcycle, or doing other types of hobbies. There is a bill I signed a while back that was suppose to prevent this. Even if we are wearing safety equipment...

https://people.tribe.net/tripseven/blog/432...6f-a04ed61e4565

 

[Toecutter]

Vanity. people are willing to risk their lives to feature themselves riding a motorcycle.

Definitely. There are those bikers who want to be seen (and heard) and some of us who'd rather just enjoy ourselves, and can do so more, without drawing attention. I'll save my publicly noticeable antics for times when the rush is worth the risk.

 

[jestal]

If anyone suggests that motorcyclist insurance claims should be rejected if they are not wearing safety gear then be fair and reject claims for driving while drinking, or riding a bicycle without a helmet or skiing without a helmet or skating without full protection, or hunting or shooting without bullet proof vests on, etc.

What comes around goes around.

 

[sparky3008]

With that said, I personally thinks it should be a personal decision for experienced riders if they want to strap a helmet onto their head but at the same time if they get seriously maimed then my insurance and taxes should not pay for their foolishness.......regardless to who is at fault. I do think that all young and new riders should be required to wear a full face helmet.

NC_Yank did say it jestal.

Also if you went to my link you will see that horseback riding, motorcycling, snowmobiling and more activities get rejected by insurance. Even though it is illegal to not give them insurance that doesn't mean the provider has to cover them if injured in any of these activites.