Where do you buy your oil change kit from

[Ciscoz]

Canadian side... Rotella T6 5W-40 used to sell for $122 (for 18.9 Liter/5 gal pail) at Cdn Tire 2 yrs ago pre-covid. Today it sells for $189 or $10/Liter. I found another option at Cdn Tire last week, their Motomaster Full Synthetic 5W-40 motor oil, went on sale for $149 for 18.9 L pail, ($7.88/Liter). The pail says it is made for Cdn Tire by Shell, so is most likely a re-branded Rotella, and is JASO MA/MA2 certified, so suitable/certified for wet clutch motorcycle use. I'm going to give it a try this fall (or mid-summer depending on my mileage this summer), and whether I find any T6 sales in the meantime. I've run Rotella T6 in just about everything I own with a motor for years, including GMC Duramax, Kubota tractor, Yamaha FJR, Ducati Hypermotard, Mercruiser 350 I/O boat, and Yamaha Outboard, and all are still running flawlessly to this day.

For filters, I just placed an order for 14 filters (air and oil) for all my vehicles and toys to RockAuto in the U.S. They charge pretty much a flat rate of $20 shipping to Canada regardless of the number of filters, so I put an order in every 2-3 years for a bunch and make it worth the effort. They carry numerous brands, but I use Wix in most of my stuff, including my FJR. The cost for the Wix 51358 (FJR) is $9.65 (Cdn) at Rock, vs $24.39 at NAPA (Canada). Another example is my GMC Duramax filter is $11.45 at Rock vs $34.49 at NAPA. So even if you order only 2 filters you're saving money, but if you order a box full, the savings are huge. And shipping is usually within a week. Just a couple cost-saving options for y'all to consider.

 

[torch]

I remember that - just a CYA statement, I'm sure. I just had a look on their site and couldn't find anything other than them recommending their PurolatorSPORT version - but no part number for FJR. The PurOne isn't on their site anymore - renamed Purolator ONE? They show the BOSS (their best filter) and a cheaper one with a red can.
https://www.purolatornow.com/en/products/oil-filters.html

I'm not so sure. IIRC, the oil pressure in the FJR can climb to +/-70psi at redline. What is the bypass valve setting of the Purolator filter? It may start passing unfiltered oil as the rpms climb. Many, many years ago I built a test jig with a 200psi, 5gal/min capable pump and tested a wide variety of filters that fit the FJR. A number of them suffered from this problem. I finally settled on the Bosch 3323 Premium as my filter of choice for fit, filtration size, flow rate, bypass pressure and build quality.

Sadly the complete results are lost in the mists of time and forum software changes. Also sadly, Bosch changed the filter base so now it requires the same modified adapter nipple as the others, so I can't be sure the medium is still as effective. I should probably re-run those tests one day with the current crop of potentials.

 

[Bounce]

I remember that - just a CYA statement, I'm sure. I just had a look on their site and couldn't find anything other than them recommending their PurolatorSPORT version - but no part number for FJR. The PurOne isn't on their site anymore - renamed Purolator ONE? They show the BOSS (their best filter) and a cheaper one with a red can.
https://www.purolatornow.com/en/products/oil-filters.html

Might it be because their bipass might not be set up for bike pressures so more likely to bipass before needed?

Oops. See Torch addressed that on the next page.

 

[RossKean]

The Purolator "warning" was as follows (from an old post here). No longer on the Purolator site, as far as I can tell.

If you're thinking you want to install a PureONE oil filter on your bike, please think again. PureONE oil filters are designed for vehicles, not bikes. Because of PureONE's high efficiency, the motorcycle oil pump may not be able to handle the pressure. The Purolator motorcycle filter line is designed to meet the specific needs of a bike; therefore we highly recommend the use of a Purolator ML filter over a PureONE oil filter.

Not sure why the FJR isn't a vehicle, but whatever...
Anyway, they were saying that the filter medium was so restrictive that our wimpy (145 HP) engine couldn't pump well enough - nothing to do with bypass. Again, I think it is CYA and an attempt to sell their motorsport filters.

Another post with feedback from Motorcycle Consumer News, FWIW
https://www.fjrforum.com/threads/this-months-motorcycle-consumer-news-oil-filter.161140/
Even if the filter bypass differential pressure means some oil bypasses under some conditions, not that big a deal as long as most of the oil goes through the filter most of the time.

Aren't oil (and filter) threads fun?

 

[Bounce]

I would suggest that the finer material in the vehicle filters "causes" increased pressures as the pump tries to force oil through the pours of the media harder/faster than the media will allow... creating the specific scenario where the spring tension in the bypass overcome, and so forth.

Courting routine bypass mode can't be good for the motor as you are choosing to allow contaminates to stay in the oil. Wouldn't it be better to pick a proper filter with a little less constriction and filter everything instead of knowing some chunkier-than bits that would be filtered by the bike filter and allowed to dance around in the motor repeatedly as it takes the bypass.

Thoughts?

 

[RossKean]

I would suggest that the finer material in the vehicle filters "causes" increased pressures as the pump tries to force oil through the pours of the media harder/faster than the media will allow... creating the specific scenario where the spring tension in the bypass overcome, and so forth.

Courting routine bypass mode can't be good for the motor as you are choosing to allow contaminates to stay in the oil.

Thoughts?

Finer media will normally require higher pressure to maintain the same flow rate for a given media type but the bypass valve in a filter should be designed to accommodate back-pressures expected for the filter medium. Purolator's statement about "bikes vs vehicles" is meaningless. There is no reason why an FJR's oil pump can't get oil through a filter and even if it couldn't, the filter bypass valve wouldn't be activated.

If a proportion of the oil bypasses the filter sometimes at high RPM, it really doesn't matter as long as most of the oil goes through the filter most of the time. (If a contaminant particle misses the filter this time, it will get caught the next time.) If the filter is clogged and on effectively permanent bypass, that's an entirely different situation.

I highly doubt that Purolator's filters are significantly different from other "premium" automotive filters from Mobil, Bosch, Quaker State or even Fram in terms of resistance to flow through the medium (back-pressure). I have been using automotive filters (mostly Mobil) on two different FJR's for close to a half million kilometers without incident. YMMV.

 

[torch]

Finer media will normally require higher pressure to maintain the same flow rate for a given media type

And area. You can have a more restrictive (ie: finer filtration) media, but still keep the back pressures down by having more filter area to increase the total flow rate.

 

[Whooshka]

As stated in the other thread.... " popular Purolator PL14610 relief valve is spec'd at 14-18 PSI and Yamaha specifies 11-17 PSI." Considering those numbers are so close I don't think that's an issue. Then again I am no expert nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

 

[saread]

As stated in the other thread.... " popular Purolator PL14610 relief valve is spec'd at 14-18 PSI and Yamaha specifies 11-17 PSI." Considering those numbers are so close I don't think that's an issue. Then again I am no expert nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Also understanding that the bypass pressure probably has as much to do with protecting the filter than it does guaranteeing protection of the engine. There is a pressure differential across the filter and if it gets too big you can have a media or end cap failure (see cheap Fram end caps). The Yamaha value is likely lower than the Purolator value as Yamaha is either responding to their filter vendor's media quality, or lack of media restricting flow (filter length and number of pleats). If bypassed oil is causing damage to your engine, you already have issues that no filter will solve. Oil in the sump is pretty darn clean due to the constant filtering. If your engine is shedding enough junk to do damage with bypassed oil, the damage is already done. Lots of miles on the ubiquitous PL14610 and PL14612 filters and still going strong.

I read a study by Blackstone where they looked at engine wear products in customer samples based on oil brand. Their conclusion was that there was basically no statistically significant difference. See here: Blackstone Study

 

[Bounce]

Finer media will normally require higher pressure to maintain the same flow rate for a given media type but the bypass valve in a filter should be designed to accommodate back-pressures expected for the filter medium. Purolator's statement about "bikes vs vehicles" is meaningless. There is no reason why an FJR's oil pump can't get oil through a filter and even if it couldn't, the filter bypass valve wouldn't be activated.

If a proportion of the oil bypasses the filter sometimes at high RPM, it really doesn't matter as long as most of the oil goes through the filter most of the time. (If a contaminant particle misses the filter this time, it will get caught the next time.) If the filter is clogged and on effectively permanent bypass, that's an entirely different situation.

I highly doubt that Purolator's filters are significantly different from other "premium" automotive filters from Mobil, Bosch, Quaker State or even Fram in terms of resistance to flow through the medium (back-pressure). I have been using automotive filters (mostly Mobil) on two different FJR's for close to a half million kilometers without incident. YMMV.

I agree.

Me read of "the bypass valve in a filter should be designed to accommodate back-pressures expected for the filter medium" includes the implied caveat that "in the expected application".

Which puts me back at:

Can create an unanticipated situation if using it where it wasn't designed to be used?

IOW: The media resisting more than anticipated; either engaging bypass more than or might it wear out parts (pump) early from forcing it to work harder than intended?
..
Just saw Sared's post. Thanks.

 

[RossKean]

Canadian side... Rotella T6 5W-40 used to sell for $122 (for 18.9 Liter/5 gal pail) at Cdn Tire 2 yrs ago pre-covid. Today it sells for $189 or $10/Liter. I found another option at Cdn Tire last week, their Motomaster Full Synthetic 5W-40 motor oil, went on sale for $149 for 18.9 L pail, ($7.88/Liter). The pail says it is made for Cdn Tire by Shell, so is most likely a re-branded Rotella, and is JASO MA/MA2 certified, so suitable/certified for wet clutch motorcycle use. I'm going to give it a try this fall (or mid-summer depending on my mileage this summer), and whether I find any T6 sales in the meantime. I've run Rotella T6 in just about everything I own with a motor for years, including GMC Duramax, Kubota tractor, Yamaha FJR, Ducati Hypermotard, Mercruiser 350 I/O boat, and Yamaha Outboard, and all are still running flawlessly to this day.

For filters, I just placed an order for 14 filters (air and oil) for all my vehicles and toys to RockAuto in the U.S. They charge pretty much a flat rate of $20 shipping to Canada regardless of the number of filters, so I put an order in every 2-3 years for a bunch and make it worth the effort. They carry numerous brands, but I use Wix in most of my stuff, including my FJR. The cost for the Wix 51358 (FJR) is $9.65 (Cdn) at Rock, vs $24.39 at NAPA (Canada). Another example is my GMC Duramax filter is $11.45 at Rock vs $34.49 at NAPA. So even if you order only 2 filters you're saving money, but if you order a box full, the savings are huge. And shipping is usually within a week. Just a couple cost-saving options for y'all to consider.

T6 5W40 (18.9 pail) is on sale this week at Canadian Tire for $160... I agree that the Motomaster 5W40 Synthetic Diesel oil is LIKELY just rebranded T6.
Still, $8.46 CDN/Litre is pretty inexpensive (at least for Canada).