05 FJR & 07 Moto Guzzi Norge comparison

[9MileCatDaddy]

Greetings,

Have not been here for awhile and thought I would check in.

Sold the FJR and was looking for an 08+ newer ABS FJR replacement. A friend of mine purchased a new 2008 MG Norge 1200 and offered to let me ride it.

I was in lust with only one ride and consequently purchased a RED model.

Particulars of FJR versus Norge:

FJR is faster and better handling.

Norge is way more comfortable, has more room for rider and passenger, comes with 3 stage factory heated handgrips, electric windshield that stays in place, single sided swingarm, ABS and much larger saddlebags. 6 gal gas tank, Hydraulic clutch. All lines are stainless steel braid and it consistently gets 46 - 48 miles per gallon. Love the dry clutch rattle and stock pipe sound. Same sized tires as the FJR. Comes with factory installed wiring plug for GPS. I have my Garmin 2610 installed.

Fit and finish is much better on the Moto Guzzi. Very easy to do maintenance. Good thing since dealers are far and few between.

Few final Drive issues (Unlike the BMW). No radiator & no heat issues, the heads are near my knees out in the wind seems to keep thing cool.

Cons: Very few dealers in the US but a long lived reputation of pretty good reliability. Factory requires 10-60 oil.

Many owners have no local dealer support but forums have very experienced help available and parts can be had via the internet.

Final - The Moto Guzzi Norge has boat loads of character & torque. After owning so many different HD's and BMW's etc I am convinced this is the Sport touring bike Harley should have built. I get ALOT of attention with the very R E D motorcycle that hardly anyone knows about.

At speed on the freeway it is very composed and settled. I see a long distance ride in my future. I am very happy thus far.

I am still in my Honeymoon period with the bike. Time will tell if it stands up as well as the FJR did.

A few pics: https://i943.photobucket.com/albums/ad279/S...adtoMyHouse.jpg

https://i943.photobucket.com/albums/ad279/S...e/2BikeMike.jpg

 

[wheatonFJR]

Sounds like fun bike...can I borrow it for awhile??

 

[El Toro]

Good luck with the Norge. Maybe they got it sorted out for 08. I bought an 07 when they were first introduced. I kept mine for 3 months, put 3000 miles on it, and was glad to see it go.

On the 07 you could not check the oil without removing three fairing pieces, but it needed to have its oil checked because the air cooled engine tended to use a bit, even of their fancy 10W60 full synthetic AGIP oil. An aftermarket company in Holland sold dipstick extenders so that you could access the oil level without removing the tupperware, but these did not really fit very well.

I remember the tupperware was brittle, so after you'd removed pieces a few times, the tabs started breaking off. Guzzi considered this a warranty item for some customers, but I traded mine as the cracks were becoming visible.

I remember the stock seat as pretty horrible for a guy of my size. But on the bright side, it was cheap, so you could buy one from Piaggio if they had any in inventory for about $135, and then you could send it to Sargent and have it rebuilt on the stock seat pan for about another $180.

I remember that a lot of the fancy electronic stuff didn't work. One guy's oil pressure light didn't work right, and after they replaced the light, and the sending unit, they sent him away with a light still flickering. It was just a few months later that the engine seized and he had to wait three months for parts from Italy.

I remember that there are very few dealers, even fewer honest dealers, and even fewer honest and competent dealers, and finally very very very few honest, competent dealers who had shelled out the bucks for the Axone Diagnostic System which Guzzi required them to use, but did not require them to buy. Ferracci, of Fast by Ferracci, sells an aftermarket product that is close to the Axone system, and I have that one myself, but the only dealer that I was ever able to actually get to correctly deal with the engine control module's decisions about what the TPS meant was Seacoast in NH. I really like those guys, and if I lived near them, maybe I'd be more positive about the Guzzi.

The Norge is a bike who's honest power output at the rear wheel is probably something close to a similar displacement Harley Davidson. After all, Guzzi is the Harley Davidson of Italy. I won't make a longer list of stuff I remember about the Norge, but I will encourage you to watch your oil level, and don't let any dealer send you away with a flickering oil pressure light.

I hope its a great bike for you, but compared to the FJR, all I can think of in the Guzzi's favor is that it is not a tall bike, and it is a fairly light bike for what it purports to be.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

...was glad to see it go....not check the oil without removing three fairing pieces

...tended to use a bit, even of their fancy 10W60 full synthetic AGIP oil.

...tupperware was brittle

...stock seat as pretty horrible

...a lot of the fancy electronic stuff didn't work

One guy's oil pressure light didn't work ...a few months later that the engine seized and he had to wait three months for parts from Italy.

...there are very few dealers

...bucks for the Axone Diagnostic System which Guzzi required

...I won't make a longer list

They're sure pretty, tho...:

 

[SockMonkey]

CatDaddy & El Toro: how would you compare the hard bags of the Norge against the FJR - volume (hold a full face helmet?), useability, mounting/unmounting, etc.? I'm seriously interested in the MG Stelvio 1200 ABS (as soon as they add another gallon capacity to the fuel tank...) and the Norge bags fit that bike perfectly as illustrated below.

 

[FJRay]

Hey !! Marty woke up. Looks like there might be a little less to detail on the Guzi.

 

[SockMonkey]

Hey !! Marty woke up. Looks like there might be a little less to detail on the Guzi.

Yeah, but I'll live. I'll just have to add a little bristle brush to my kit in order to clean between the fins on the cylinders...

 

[El Toro]

CatDaddy & El Toro: how would you compare the hard bags of the Norge against the FJR - volume (hold a full face helmet?), useability, mounting/unmounting, etc.?

The bags were similar in capability to those on the FJR. Maybe the FJR had a slight advantage. I believe that I was using a Nolan N102 XL helmet when I had the Norge, and it stored OK.

The FJR came with really nice bag liners, and I like bag liners because then I don't have to mount and dismount bags. I never had any trouble attaching or removing my FJR bags. The Norge bags were a bit trickier to get right, but all of these bag issues are resolved with a bit of care and practice.

I had Bestem bag liners that I'd bought off of ebay for my ST1100, and these fit the Norge bags really well. I used them as bag liners for the Norge and was happy with this solution.

If I were going for another Guzzi, the one you're thinking about is the one I might consider because I wouldn't have to worry about the crackling tupperware.

Someone above pointed out that the Norge is very pretty.... I stopped at Seacoast to look at their inventory when I was driving through Derry, NH back in July, and they had several Norges, including at least one leftover 2008 (yes, a leftover 2008). I think they were asking about $8500 for the leftover with 0 miles on it.

In any event, they are pretty when you don't look too close. As soon as you start taking a more careful look, there is an awful lot of stuff that looks either crude or chintzy.... to my eye. Now I know that there are guys who love these things to death....

I was a hardcore member of the Guzzista Apologista for about a month. I became an agnostic after about a month of explanations and apologies. In the third month, I was wondering how a guy with my background (mechanical engineering design) could have fallen for this....

and then it was painlessly over.

Piaggio is the US importer. They don't even answer their phone for their dealers. The 24/7 hotline for roadside assistance reaches that guy that calls himself Peggy on the Discover commercials ... or not....

Better you than me

 

[9MileCatDaddy]

Mine is a Red 07..... No Need to take off Plastic to check oil any longer... There is a dip stick that is easily accessed via a hole in the lower fairing.

Certainly not as simple as looking at the oil window on the FJR...but it is not a problem

Anyone can purchase the VDST software for $200 to diagnose and work on the bike or do adjustments.

Yes dealers are problematic but so far I have had no discerning problems to complain about... Probably gonna put in 20/50 SG oil or Redline 10-60.

in it on next oil change.

 

[El Toro]

Mine is a Red 07..... No Need to take off Plastic tpo check oil any longer... There is a dip stick that is easily accessed via a hole in the lower fairing.Certainly not as simple as looking at the oil window on the FJR...but ity is not a problem

Anyone can purchase the VDST software for $200 to diagnose and work on the bike or do adjustments.

Yes dealers are problematic but so far I have had no discerning problems to complain about... Probably gonna put in 20/50 SG oil or Redline 10-60.

in it on next oil change.

The VDST software is what Ferracci tweaks and rebadges to sell as an alternative. On the bright side, if you spend a few bucks more, either with VDST directly, or with Ferracci, you used to be able to also work on your Aprilia, Ducati, H-D, Victory, and others who use the Italian sourced ECU.

Glad to hear they finally provided the access hole for oil checks. This was a big sore point, especially since the plastic parts that had to be removed proved to be fragile.

Oil arguments or recommendations for the Guzzi are the same as for every other marque. What to use, what to use..... well, its more important to get oil pressure to the top end and into the crank journals than it is to argue about what brand of oil to use. FWIW, you can buy a case of the AGIP from the US importer in Connecticut.

The primary Guzzi forum back in 2007 ended up with a huge amount of negative stuff. Not sure why, but they ended up wiping the slate clean and restarting the forum. A lot of former posters didn't return, but there were plenty that stayed. It was a humorous place, with good natured moderators. There was always a solution for whatever problem surfaced. Like the new hole in the fairing to allow easier oil checks. It was always coming in the next shipment.

Personally, being of Scandinavian descent, I loved the whole idea of traveling along with the Guzzi's up to the arctic circle and beyond. What would we do without Guzzi's great invention, the swing arm?

I'm sure you'll love your Norge. It is light, and not too tall, and it feels flickable, and you should not get into any trouble with the right wrist. The Norge fanciers are always telling stories about blowing away K1300GTs, and FJRs, and such... sort of like noble Hobbits attacking Ring wraiths and getting the better of them. One thing that a lot of guys who "race" others don't understand is that it takes two to make a race, and on public roads it takes two morons. If there's only one moron, there's no race.

I try not to be too negative about other bikes. I've owned a lot of bikes myself, and there's been something good about just about every one of them. True even for the Norge. The Norge does not hold the record for shortest residence in my stable..... that honor belongs to a Suzuki Burgman 650 which lasted less than 3 weeks before I discovered that the FJR had the AE model which could be shifted with the left hand instead of the foot and made the Burgman obsolete. The Norge has second shortest tenure of ownership. FJR was actually fourth longest tenure of ownership, only being beaten out by my trusty 1970 Royal Enfield Interceptor Mk II, the ST1100, and a K1200Rsport.

I've got nothing but good feelings about the engineering, quality of manufacturing, and general ergonomics of the FJR. Actually, this is true for most of the bikes I've ever owned, regardless of manufacture. Guzzi is a special case, and as usual, YMMV.

 

[9MileCatDaddy]

There are no " perfect " bikes... That I know after 37+ years of riding without pause.. Of course the BMW & HD crowd does not see it that way and refuse to see the shortcomings in their chosen brand or anything for sale outside of it... OOps better stop generalizing here.. I know my HD buddies only see HD moto-sickles. I have loved something about every bike I have owned, in one way or another..

 

[timk]

That is really red!!!

 

[rushes]

Beautiful bike!

 

[lnewlf]

Looks like a young Isabella Rossalini !

 

[El Toro]

Its obvious that everyone likes the Guzzi style.

One morning, long after my Norge had been traded, I was on a ride with a guy who still had his Norge, and we parked his red 07 Norge and my black cherry FJR in adjacent parking places at a restaurant. We had a table with a view of the parking lot. Every time anyone would get out of their car to walk toward the entrance of the restaurant, they'd get side tracked by the Norge. Not one person took a second look at the FJR. When we got out to the parking lot after eating, there were people their by the Norge, with their backs to the nearly new, shiny clean, FJR....

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

And, it's not just a pretty red Norge.

Years ago my riding partner rode all over on a V65SP and I had a 1st Gen, persimmon red, Concours. Well, I can tell you that everywhere we went that Concours was almost invisible (when compared with the Guzzi) -- everyone wanted to look at, and comment on, the Moto Guzzi.

V65SP:

When there was vintage racing at Steamboat, a friend's brother met my buddies and I there on an old, green-ish, 850T3. We all parked on the main street Sat. night and, without fail, just about everyone had to go and make a fuss about that old Guzzi... There must've been hundreds of thousands of $$$ worth of motorcycles (some pricey ones...) on that street that night.

Go figure...

 

[ramrezz425]

I ran a Piaggio dealership back in 2006, At the dealer meeting in San Antonio I got to ride the Norge and I quickly fell in love. Piaggio was delayed in getting them to the USA, Then the parts issues that I had with the scooters were reported with dealers selling the Norge. The Red Norge was the hot ticket, always not available, was well built and high quality, Dealer support was spotty and the only one that had any knowledge was up in santa barbara, I have to admit that the norge was my first pick but I am 150% happy with my Gen I FJR.

 

[scubatech]

And, it's not just a pretty red Norge.Years ago my riding partner rode all over on a V65SP and I had a 1st Gen, persimmon red, Concours. Well, I can tell you that everywhere we went that Concours was almost invisible (when compared with the Guzzi) -- everyone wanted to look at, and comment on, the Moto Guzzi.

V65SP:

When there was vintage racing at Steamboat, a friend's brother met my buddies and I there on an old, green-ish, 850T3. We all parked on the main street Sat. night and, without fail, just about everyone had to go and make a fuss about that old Guzzi... There must've been hundreds of thousands of $$$ worth of motorcycles (some pricey ones...) on that street that night.

Go figure...

Charis,

I used to really enjoy the vintage races at Steamboat. Too bad it is gone. Ironically the resort that ended the event went out of business after a couple seasons. I believe a larger corporation bought the place. Steamboat was probably the last place in America where there was racing on the streets!! Legally.

 

[9MileCatDaddy]

CatDaddy & El Toro: how would you compare the hard bags of the Norge against the FJR - volume (hold a full face helmet?), useability, mounting/unmounting, etc.? I'm seriously interested in the MG Stelvio 1200 ABS (as soon as they add another gallon capacity to the fuel tank...) and the Norge bags fit that bike perfectly as illustrated below.

The Bags are very spacious and larger then the FJR's.. They attach the same way and the bike looks great without them on.

Opening the bags is a little different as they unlock from the top but there is an additional clip to undo at the rear.

Can't vouch for being water proof yet... *The more I ride it, the More I want to ride!