2007 AE Downshifting Problems

[cbdunn]

I have a 2007 FJR1300AE with about 21,200 miles on it.

I just picked it up from service and winter storage. The 20K mile service was performed over the winter. I've had it out for two short (27 miles round-trip commutes to work. During both rides, but more on the second ride, I've had trouble getting the bike to downshift while approaching a stoplight or stop sign at slow speed. I've seen this before - very rarely - when already at a stop and the bike won't shift from 3/2 down to 1 while sitting there. A little touch on the throttle (not enough to move the bike) and it shifts.

Today's problem was much worse. Rolling toward a stop sign in 4th... I couldn't get any downshifting... even with a little throttle. At the stop, I was able to get it to 1, but only after blipping the throttle for each gear change. Similar behavior two or three times on my 25 minute stop-and-go commute (side streets, stop signs, lights).

Rode it home tonight... only one minor downshifting incident - but no stop and go intersections or lights.

No problems at all when at cruising speeds. No problems upshifting. I know how to shift the bike -- well. It's not operator error.

I'm not a modern MC mechanic, but I don't see anything on the 20K service schedule that would start this.

https://www.fjr1300.info/maint/20k.htmlhttps://www.fjr1300.info/maint/20k.html

Has anyone experienced something similar?

Other suggestions I can bring to my Yamaha tech?

Anything I can try out of my home shop (I'm mechanical - have tools - no diagnostic equipment)?

 

[yamafitter]

Did you have any shift error codes when this was happening? Were you only using the paddle shifter or did the problem also occur with the foot shifter? If when using the foot shifter to downshift and there is a flashing yellow light on the display there will be a shift error code also being displayed. Take note of the number and please report back.

One thing that may have happened if they did a clutch fluid change as per the factory instructions is that they have knocked the foot shifter switch out of adjustment. The switch is actually a rheostat and the voltage needs to be between 2.4 - 2.6V when the switch is in its normal position. If it is not correct you will see an Error Code 22 when you attempt to shift the bike with the foot switch. There will be no error codes when using the paddle shifter.

Here is the whole story when I had problems with the foot shifter.....

Not a Good Week

 

[willboe]

This is basically normal operation for many motorcycle transmissions. This phenomenon can occur you are pulling a clutch lever, and actuating with your foot, or using your AE paddle, or foot SWITCH. The fix is: Do not stop in 4th gear (2nd, 3rd, 5th too). If you downshift while you still have some movement, you also have mechanical rotation the allows forks & shafts to align properly. Soooo, it is operator error.

 

[RiderX]

I would argue it is not normal and bike should downshift without a blip of the throttle like the rest of ours do.

 

[yamafitter]

My understanding was that he was still rolling and the bike would not downshift. This is not normal.

I would agree that it is normal that sometimes it is not able to downshift if you have already stopped. Usually just rocking the bike a little bit back and forth solves this problem but you should have downshifted into first before coming to a stop.

 

[michaelsphoto]

Hand manual on Page 5-3 says " shift down is impossible if engine speed is too low" Or "too high"

 

[mferriter]

Mine also won't shift down more than 1 gear when fully stopped. I believe that is normal for the AE centrifugal clutch.

 

[mcatrophy]

WARNING: I'm in a bad mood, not ridden for 3 weeks or so. So, please don't anyone be offended.

Hand manual on Page 5-3 says " shift down is impossible if engine speed is too low" Or "too high"

No it doesn't, it says:

So there should be no problem down-shifting as described by the op, however low the revs.

Mine also won't shift down more than 1 gear when fully stopped. I believe that is normal for the AE centrifugal clutch.

It's not a centrifugal clutch, no way, nohow. Anyway, he was moving.

As I see it, it's possible the foot control miss-aligned (as per yamafitter above), but I don't know if that would affect finger-switch operation. However, you'd expect an SH__18, 19, 21 or 22 error to be thrown. Might be worth checking the code history, it would keep the score if it was an intermittent.

 

[cbdunn]

I would argue it is not normal and bike should downshift without a blip of the throttle like the rest of ours do.

My understanding was that he was still rolling and the bike would not downshift. This is not normal. I would agree that it is normal that sometimes it is not able to downshift if you have already stopped. Usually just rocking the bike a little bit back and forth solves this problem but you should have downshifted into first before coming to a stop.

Thanks for the feedback everyone... Good stuff -- mostly... Please read the post accurately Willboe... I was not stopping in higher gears. I wrote "Rolling toward a stop sign in 4th... I couldn't get any downshifting... even with a little throttle."

You other guys are correct. It's not normal operation and it's not operator error. I have about 17,000 miles experience with the AE. That may not be a lot compared to some, but it's enough to know how the shifting works. This behavior is brand new (only since picking bike up from service/storage) and it is definitely not normal operation. I did talk to the service advisor and they indicated they did not touch the clutch. Oil change only.

I've never seen this before... and I am downshifting through the gears as I drop speed or approaching a stop. I too have seen the (pretty rare for me) behavior where it won't shift from 2 or 3 down to 1 when already at a stop. But, for me anyway, I can usually always click through the gears. In this case, I'm rapping away at the downshift paddle as I coast and nothing is happening.

I'm a left leg amputee -- so I can say with absolute certainty that I'm only using the paddle shifter.

I have seen no codes and no flashing light (except the typical light that indicates a downshift if revs are low for a selected gear).

I have the foot shifter peg removed (not the shifter arm). I suppose I can check that to see if it has been bumped, nudged, or bent. My prosthetic foot position doesn't even really allow my foot to contact the shifter arm, but I suppose I'll double check that. I've seen at least one post in Yamafitter's problem history where someone mentioned moving the footshift and paddleshift at the same time would cause a shifting problem.

I wish I had an error code... then at least I would have some idea. Since it is upshifting fine, I wonder if it's just a switch issue on the downshift side?

I'm grasping at straws. I don't know the mechanism or the electrical specs on this YCCS (AE) system. Does anyone know of a number, e-mail, or web site to get in touch with Yamaha for technical support? I've called my usual Yamaha tech but they can't even LOOK at the bike until May 13. That's too long to wait.

It's going to be at least a few days before I can test again. Believe it or not, it's actually snowing here in Minneapolis. We are expecting 2 - 4 inches tonight. What a winter!

 

[Monty]

I had this problem for awhile and finally stopped it altogether simply by not shifting to neutral when you stop and get off the bike. Just leave it in first. Don't know what causes if but this is the fix, believe me.

 

[yamafitter]

I can understand your frustration and sorry that winter hasn't left Minnisota yet. The shift error code 22 that I mentioned only shows when the foot shifter is operated. Since your foot shifter arm was removed you should never see that particular code.
It might be useful to still have the foot shifter switch checked as per FSM page 5-72 (if memory serves, I'm not at home right now to confirm the page number). When I could not shift my bike there were no shift error codes until I operated the foot shifter.
The other thing to consider is performing a clutch hydraulic fluid flush. However air in the clutch activation lines should have caused an error code. These are the two simplest things to do.
Unfortunately there are very few techs that have experience with the YCCS on the FJR. There were not that many sold and the system is usually very reliable so most shops have never worked on one.

One other cause could be a bad spider. There is a spider located under the side panel that ground some of the electrical components of YCCS. I mentioned this spider in my other post and you may want to check it.

I don't know if you had the spider recall done and I don't know how thorough the tech was when the tech inspected the wiring harness. The Yamaha factory recall does not directly address this spider and it would explain the intermittent nature of your problem.

 

[JimNtexas]

Mine also won't shift down more than 1 gear when fully stopped. I believe that is normal for the AE centrifugal clutch.

I've stop my AE in fifth gear every now and then. I can downshift more than 1 gear while stopped, at most I just rock the bike forward and back a couple of inches and it shifts just fine..

 

[mcatrophy]

I have seen no codes and no flashing light (except the typical light that indicates a downshift if revs are low for a selected gear).

I presume you mean flashing gear indicator, not light?

I've seen at least one post in Yamafitter's problem history where someone mentioned moving the footshift and paddleshift at the same time would cause a shifting problem.

I did the test: held the foot lever up (or down), then tried the paddle switch, NO GEAR-CHANGE, NO ERROR INDICATION (and vice-versa) ...

I wish I had an error code... then at least I would have some idea. Since it is upshifting fine, I wonder if it's just a switch issue on the downshift side?

... but mine would change neither up nor down if the "other" selector was held on either way.

It's going to be at least a few days before I can test again.

If you put it on its centre stand (hope you can do this safely), you can then test it, just throttle it up, run it up and down through the gears. Ignore the ABS light that will come on.

I also think you would get an error code if there was a paddle-switch wiring issue. The switch is a change-over for each position, so the computer "knows" if a wire is missing (it expects one "way" or the other to be made).

But the only error code I could find to do with the paddle switch was SH__38. The summary says:

Its diagnostic suggests an open circuit would also give this error.

May be worth looking at the wiring to the switch and its connector, also any earth "spiders".

Had my switch apart once, pic:

(Click on image for larger view)



You can find a few more possibly relevant ones using links from the larger image.

 

[yamafitter]

If you decide to pull apart the paddle shifter please be advised that there are some spring loaded parts on the paddle section that will launch themselves upon disassembly. Don't ask how I know this. All I will say is that is was not pretty and I may have uttered a few curse words. There is no parts breakdown of the paddle assembly so you can't order individual parts for the paddle shifter and the entire assembly is expensive. I think it might be best to treat this as a non-user serviceable item as they say in the electronics business.

 

[cbdunn]

This forum is awesome. Of all the forums I use -- this forum is the most helpful and robust! I can't thank you all enough for the troubleshooting help and advice. Not having to start from scratch and recreate the wheel is huge.

I will definitely report back to the discussion with findings as I proceed and a summary when it is resolved.

I agree this is not a user-service item. I've replaced brakes, exhaust, engines, transmission, and done minor electrical work in my "first" vehicles when I was in my 20s. But, things were simpler (cars/trucks) then, and I had more free time (and less $$ to spend on mechanics). I'll leave this to the professionals with the right diagnostic equipment and training.

This information is a great starting point for troubleshooting with my tech. I know him fairly well and he's laid back and open to rider feedback. ...and I'll tell him I got the info from my "friend that also has an AE" (no Internet-Forum stigma)...

Doctors and mechanics love Internet diagnoses and home remedies!

 

[cbdunn]

I have seen no codes and no flashing light (except the typical light that indicates a downshift if revs are low for a selected gear).

I presume you mean flashing gear indicator, not light?

Correct... flashing gear indicator. Sorry I wasn't clearer.

If you put it on its centre stand (hope you can do this safely), you can then test it, just throttle it up, run it up and down through the gears. Ignore the ABS light that will come on.

I said I'm an amputee... I'm not handicapped!

Check out waterskiing picture below. That was 7 months after amputation. (You can't see the prosthetic; it's behind the ski).

I'm 2 years 4 months out now. More adventures to come!

 

[mcatrophy]

...

I said I'm an amputee... I'm not handicapped!

Check out waterskiing picture below. That was 7 months after amputation. (You can't see the prosthetic; it's behind the ski).

I'm 2 years 4 months out now. More adventures to come!

Didn't mean to insult you, not my intention at all. I did once give some help to a guy who'd lost his left arm and had an FJR1300AS (as the AE is known here), his problem was doing stuff on the bike with one hand (plus occasional "Please hold this, dear" to his better half)! He had a lot of trouble manoeuvring the bike, I guess I was reading across to you. Sorry

.

But the test is still valid

.

Oh, your picture didn't come through.

 

[cbdunn]

I just tested on the center stand as you suggested. I warmed the bike to normal operating temperature (4 bars) and ran through the gears:

First: With foot shifter, several times. No problems. No codes.

Second: With paddle shifter. I ran up and down several times. There were hesitations, but I was able to get it to shift if I waited a second or two between shifts. There were only a times when it would just not downshift and I had to apply the rear brake... throttle blip... clunk... then it would downshfit.

Finally: I was able to get a code. It appeared for a few seconds. I "think" it was Sh__47. But, I wasn't sure. I ran the gears several more times and got a second light and code. This time I am sure the code was Sh__45.

I can't find my Owner's Manual right now... it's buried in a shelf somewhere in this office. Any ideas on these codes? Are these in the OM?

Does anyone have a digital copy of a 2007 FJR Owner's Manual?

I also think you would get an error code if there was a paddle-switch wiring issue. The switch is a change-over for each position, so the computer "knows" if a wire is missing (it expects one "way" or the other to be made).
But the only error code I could find to do with the paddle switch was SH__38. The summary says:

 

[cbdunn]

No offense taken. Thank you. Not sure why the picture didn't come through.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xepe23f3fd3ciyl/15_7Months-Waterski1.JPG

...

I said I'm an amputee... I'm not handicapped!

Check out waterskiing picture below. That was 7 months after amputation. (You can't see the prosthetic; it's behind the ski).

I'm 2 years 4 months out now. More adventures to come!

Didn't mean to insult you, not my intention at all..., I guess I was reading across to you. Sorry

.

No offense taken