Abs Confusion

[Skippy]

Whoa, strong words from a ******' New Guy.., especially when debating such an emotional weak topic like ABS brakes. And SKIPPY, which road is it that I am suppose to remove my dangerous ***? It appears that you neglected to list your location in your personnal profile. I want to make sure that I avoid you, your family, your friends and your road.

Cabbage looking I may be, green I am not, there is a chance, however small that having 35 years of motorcycling experience under my belt, I may not be as new as you may think.

Just because I am not a post whore, does not make me a newbie, or, as this board is merely weeks old, we would all be considered as such.

Now, I will be the first to admit that experience on the road and tracks around the world does not qualify me as an expert in all aspects of ABS, the Internet however, does allow me, and you, the chance to voice our opinion.

If you are one of those that I referred to in my original post then ALL ****** roads pertain to you, and you should allow Darwins rule to kick in a little early and save some poor family the agony of losing a loved one because of your lack of ability.

And you are correct, this is a particulary weak topic, let's start an oil or tire thread

Skippy

 

[teerex51]

@FJRZON - Don't know about Honda, but one of the Europeans listed on the other board that FJR's will only be available in the ABS flavour for 2006 model year. Don't know if this is fact, but interesting nonetheless!

European sales of the Feejer this year are reported to consist 90% of ABS models.

In view of the non-ABS model's twilight, such bikes are heavily discounted by dealers B) .

So, no matter what our (strong) opinions on the subject are, this is the way the market is going. I do not suppose Mommy Yammy will make exceptions for the US of A. Soon there'll only be ABS models to be had and the value of pre-owned non-ABS ones will presumably take a hit. :dribble:

Have a safe weekend's riding

Stef

 

[Bounce]

Loosen the pinch bolt on the foot brake lever, pull the level straight off, rotate the lever downward BY ONE TOOTH ONLY, and re-install. Tighten the pinch bolt back up to spec.

Ditto here. It only took about 4 "events" where the rear end broke loose WAY to easily (imo) for me to remember that old trick about moving the brake pedal.

Works like a charm. There are times since then when I've gotten close to over braking the rear, but it's more predictable and like other bikes I've had. Very rare iow and usually a problem with road surface (tar snake or paint in the rain, etc.).

Again, not unlike many other bikes I've had.

 

[EastTNFJR]

Just to add my .02 worth, Mine has ABS , have had 3 bikes with ABS, and 15 without over the years. I like the idea of more control on wet or slick surfaces and that is why I got it. Pure personal preference and no I don't ride any more agressive because of the ABS.

The one thing I haven't seen advocated in this thread is to practice hard braking from every speed range in which you ride. How do you know how long it will take to stop from 70-80 mph? Practice this stuff and when the situation comes up for a rapid stop (hopefully not a panic stop..don't like the word..LOL) you will have some idea of how the bike responds on the brakes whether you have ABS or not. Just make sure some cage isn't on your butt. OK now I'm gonna find an oil thread or something like that...... B)

John

 

[Bounce]

ABS is just another thing to go wrong just when you don't need it to, adds $1k to the price of the bike for about $250 worth of parts, and further complicates an already complex piece of mahinery.
If it is condidered a safety part then it should be fitted to all bikes as standard, otherwise, why build the "unsafe non ABS models?

When buying parts you have to make sure you get the "ABS" fitted parts!!

If it is saving your butt on more than one occasion, then you may consider taking your dangerous *** off my road and go back to a cage, or a Hardley Driveable (HD) before you crash into me or my family & friends.

If it is saving you on gravel covered roads or corners, then use your noggin before you roll into a corner knowing that there maybe gravel on the inside from a recent rain storm.

Or if you live and or ride near TWO then gravel from the idiots that are delibrately trying to down a motorcyclist.

If it is saving you from coming into a corner too hot, slow the heck down, you are riding beyond your capabilities, or at least take it on the track and learn how to scrub speed with lean angle and trail braking.

Using a mechanical item to compensate for a lack of riding skills is another fine example of poor judgement from both the manufacturer and the purchaser.

And yes, I had the choice, and yes, I chose one without.

Skippy (ABS less and proud of it man)

Luddite much?

:akido: :fan: :innocent:

 

[Old Dog]

Helmets? Who said anything about helmets.

C'mon Old Dog, keep up man.

My point was that technology is relative and helmets are technology also. So are air bags, seat belts, ABS, etc. We employ these technologies in moving vehicles hoping to decrease our chances of injury or death. I don't think most of us blindly rely on these things but knowing they are there can help.

If an individual doesn't want to pay for such things or doesn't believe they need them I can respect that. What I can't respect is people spewing out mindless ******** with no logic to back it up.

-r

You don't get my point. Here, I'll break it down for you. If you're at a busy steet crosswalk and the "Walk" sign lights up do you just blindly take a stroll across the road without looking first? Maybe you do. No one's ever ran a red light before have they? Always trust the sign man, they're always right. Jesus! you are dense aren't you? You read waaaay to much into my comment. When things get too easy, people get sloppy. Got the idea now? I didn't think so.

 

[HIGHLANDER]

Riddle me this skippy one!

How many times has ABS caused an accident ?

How many times has it saved an accident ?

Not worth getting your panties all bunch up over this guys. Discussion over in the logical brain. :blink:

 

[throttlejockeyTJ]

Folks Folks Folks. The Link that convienced me about ABS is below. I think the link should be pinned. It is a real world test of ABS & NON ABS bikes in water over manhole covers, sand and gravel. In perfect conditions non ABS with expert rider can stop a few feet shorter. In the suck conditions the ABS bikes can stop over 100 feet shorter. The test is in 92 and ABS has improved since then. TJ

https://www.ibmwr.org/prodreview/abstests.html

:argue: :haha:

 

[radman]

I am old enough, and have been in the biz long enough, to recall similar discussions rising from the advent of; disc brakes, electronic ignition, fuel injection, radial tires, automatic transmissions, ac, cassette stereo, fm stereo, cd stereo, cruise control, split brake hydraulic systems, rack and pinion, all wheel drive, steering wheel vs tiller...(threw that in to see if yur payin 'ttention ). ABS works, it's proven, relatively simple as systems go, and affordable. A no brainer.

 

[JREW]

A while back I was in a 2 wheeled vs 4 wheeled vehicle panic situation because the ***** riding the 2 wheeled vehicle (that was me), was not paying close enough attention to his surroundings. The front brake ABS did not activate, but the rear did slightly. Would I have stopped in time without it. Yes. Did it provide some measure of safety in this situation, I think so. When I got my bike I was not looking for ABS, but fell into one do to someone backing out of a PDP. At the time I read up on it, and decided it sounded like a good idea. Do I ride more over the top now because of ABS, no, but I'm glad I have it. ABS is a personal choice.

 

[XLR8]

You don't get my point. Here, I'll break it down for you. If you're at a busy steet crosswalk and the "Walk" sign lights up do you just blindly take a stroll across the road without looking first? Maybe you do. No one's ever ran a red light before have they? Always trust the sign man, they're always right. Jesus! you are dense aren't you? You read waaaay to much into my comment. When things get too easy, people get sloppy. Got the idea now? I didn't think so. black eye.gif

I don't get the tone. There's no need to be unpleasant.

-r

 

[Karmak]

At least one more? Despite being a fng, I've had a lot of bikes in over 35 years of riding, including turbos and nitrous set-ups and have had to stop quickly in numerous situations too many to count...with no ABS. However, this is the reason I went the extra grand-I don't know personally how it will work, or not. But I asked myself how will I feel, or second guess myself if I go down with the wife on the back and she gets hurt. Maybe it would make a difference, maybe not. But, I don't want to contemplate the question at all if the situation comes to pass. I am not saying that anyone who doesn't see it that way is wrong. If an accident occurs with a non ABS, who knows if it would have mattered. I just don't want to ask myself.

 

[radman]

There was an "incident" at CFO. Tomnap went down, went straight when he shoulda gone right. There were two distinct tire tracks just before the pavement started getting chewed up by the bike which was no longer in motorcycle mode. Now, so far, Tom hasn't said (to me anyways) what went down, he had little to no memory of the period immediately preceding the crash. But to look at the scene, ABS could very well have saved the day. His didn't have it. From what the tracks said, the bike locked and got crossed up, exactly what ABS would have prevented.

 

[norcal]

My '92 BMW K75S has ABS. I have 35k mi. on it without using it, except to see how it works and that it is working. When it's wet and rainy I slow down, likewise when cross traffic is around I keep very alert to possible situations.

Bought the FJR without ABS to save some $'s and not have the extra complexity to maybe fix one day.

I do practice hard braking and have locked the rear wheel on the FJR many times. The harder the fronts are applied the easier the rear loses traction. Have yet to skid the front brake. When the rear skids the tails doesn't go into a fishtail and out of control. It takes practice to modulate the rear for sure.

Alert awareness and practice, in my opinion, are more valuable than ABS systems.

 

[Woodstock]

Alert awareness and practice, in my opinion, are more valuable than ABS systems.

Who said they were mutually exclusive??

Why do some (not neccearly you) people think that if you say you like ABS and think they're a great safetly feature, that means you have to leave part of you brain at home when you ride.

I've also never locked up my tires with an ABS (other than a test). That doesn't mean I'm not really happy to have it _if_ I need it. I certainly practive braking so that I won't need it, but that doesn't mean it's not good to have as a backup.

 

[Just Plain Dave]

Being as I opened this can of worms I must admit I did get some insight as to everyone’s opinions.

I now know (or think I know) ABS is beneficial if you ride when it’s wet, (I don’t) ride in sand, (not me) spend any time in gravel, (no way Jose) drive a bit fast or possibly follow a little close. ( I stay with the traffic, but I always have lots of room between me and any moving object in front of me) They may also come in handy when that rare one in a million unexpected thing pops up. When I first began riding (a Cushman Eagle in the early 50’s) I was told to analyze what everyone around me was doing and determine what move they could make to kill me. Then count on them to do just that. It has worked pretty well so far.

When I started this thread I said I was a bit confused. I still am.

Thanks to all of you for your opinions.

 

[Woodstock]

I'm sure there are some people who ride differently with ABS so that they depend upon it.

I also suspect that some people overstate what would have happened without ABS (for example, every time it kicks in, doesn't mean "it saved me", people have locked up a wheel without wrecking)

Me, it's just one more 'backup'.

(ps. you may not intentionally ride in wet, sand, gravel, whatever), but you also might find yourself in those conditions suddenly, without expecting it)

 

[FJRmogul]

ABS ABS ABS ABS!!!

Next :bye:

 

[Just Plain Dave]

I'm sure there are some people who ride differently with ABS so that they depend upon it.
I also suspect that some people overstate what would have happened without ABS (for example, every time it kicks in, doesn't mean "it saved me", people have locked up a wheel without wrecking)

Me, it's just one more 'backup'.

(ps. you may not intentionally ride in wet, sand, gravel, whatever), but you also might find yourself in those conditions suddenly, without expecting it)

Sounds right to me. There was one time in 73 or 74 I was just completing a 3 day 1200 mile trip with my brother. As we got to Seguin, God moved an ocean above us and pulled the plug. Little brother had just bought a Kawasaki Z1 900 and I had a Honda CB750, no windshields, no rain gear. We were drenched :Snorkle: in approximately 37 milliseconds and hated it so bad :angry03: that neither of us has been caught in the rain since then. Of course it does get a little boring just riding around in my yard. :search: If the sky is really clear :super1: I venture out and circle the block I live on. Sometimes two or three times.

It's a good life. :beach:

 

[Woodstock]

I'm sure there are some people who ride differently with ABS so that they depend upon it.
I also suspect that some people overstate what would have happened without ABS (for example, every time it kicks in, doesn't mean "it saved me", people have locked up a wheel without wrecking)

Me, it's just one more 'backup'.

(ps. you may not intentionally ride in wet, sand, gravel, whatever), but you also might find yourself in those conditions suddenly, without expecting it)

Sounds right to me. There was one time in 73 or 74 I was just completing a 3 day 1200 mile trip with my brother. As we got to Seguin, God moved an ocean above us and pulled the plug. Little brother had just bought a Kawasaki Z1 900 and I had a Honda CB750, no windshields, no rain gear. We were drenched :Snorkle: in approximately 37 milliseconds and hated it so bad :angry03: that neither of us has been caught in the rain since then. Of course it does get a little boring just riding around in my yard. :search: If the sky is really clear :super1: I venture out and circle the block I live on. Sometimes two or three times.

It's a good life. :beach:

:clap: :clap:

I used to avoid rain like the plague, well, more than the plague, since I've never really gone out of my way to actually avoid the plague. More like I just hope... Well, anyway,.... with reasonable gear (I just use FirstGear overpants and a Technic jacket), I stay pretty dry, and the FJR handles just fine in the wet.

I probably wouldn't venture out in a complete downpour, but the Seattle rain doesn't really bother me too much anymore.