ABS Trouble

[JAB]

I have a 2015 FJR1300 ES with 26,000 miles.

Over the past year or more I have experienced some odd events with the ABS light on this bike. They occur at random times. To date, I have written these quirks off as just oddities that aren’t serious. Now I am not so sure.

On firing up and riding first thing in the AM, the ABS light stays on, even after riding for extended periods. To clear the light, I have to hit both front and back breaks simultaneously. Just doing one or the other won’t clear it.

On occasions, pulling away from a dead stop, the ABS light comes on. I swear it isn’t an aggressive acceleration.

What convinced me to bring the bike to the dealer finally was that I could make the ABS light come on at will. To get the ABS to fault, I get up to a speed of 35mph or more, then disengage the clutch and use only the back break with moderate foot pressure to slow down, the ABS light will come on every time. FYI, if I break with heavy foot pressure, the ABS won’t error. Note, I don't usually ride this way, but it was a good method to consistently show the fault to the dealer.

So, the dealer has looked at the issue and consulted with Yamaha Tech. They have adjusted the rear break light switch and now they say the light only comes on if very light foot pressure is applied to the rear only. The dealer isn’t happy with this solution and is waiting for another Gen3 FJR to show up so they can test that one to see if this situation is common with all FJR’s. That’s where we are at right now.

My question and request to the group is can you do my little test at both light and moderate rear break foot pressures and see if your ABS light comes on? Remember use only the rear break to slow, and no engine breaking. I’d really appreciate your feedback.

Thanks,

Jeff

 

[mcatrophy]

One well known FJR characteristic is that a rear brake that doesn't release properly (pedal bearing needs lubricating) will cause the ABS light to come on. It's worth checking yours releases freely.

 

[hppants]

2014 rider here. I can 100% attest that this does NOT happen with me. At almost 40,000 miles, the ONLY time the abs light comes on is when the bike is started and it stays on until Im moving 3 mph.

 

[JAB]

One well known FJR characteristic is that a rear brake that doesn't release properly (pedal bearing needs lubricating) will cause the ABS light to come on. It's worth checking yours releases freely.

I'll check that Mcatrophy, but I'm pretty sure that its not sticking. Thanks

 

[JAB]

2014 rider here. I can 100% attest that this does NOT happen with me. At almost 40,000 miles, the ONLY time the abs light comes on is when the bike is started and it stays on until Im moving 3 mph.

the cold start with not clearing after moving occurs very in frequently for me.

Do me a favor, the next time you ride, see if my 35mph rear break only with moderate and light foot pressure gives you a fault. That will be a big help. Thanks.

 

[RossKean]

Go for a short ride and DON'T use the rear brake at all. When you get back, check that the temperature of the rotor is pretty close to ambient. If warm (or hot) either the rear brake pivot is sticking (common problem as Mcatrophy says) or you have an issue with your rear brake system. I would thoroughly bleed the rear brake - including the linked lower right front linked piston.

Double check that rear pivot, even if you think it is OK. Should be dismantled, cleaned and re-greased annually. More often if you ride a lot in the rain. (Do the shift linkage on the left while you're at it.) Good luck with it.

 

[rbentnail]

Go for a short ride and DON'T use the rear brake at all. When you get back, check that the temperature of the rotor is pretty close to ambient. If warm (or hot) either the rear brake pivot is sticking (common problem as Mcatrophy says) or you have an issue with your rear brake system. I would thoroughly bleed the rear brake - including the linked lower right front linked piston.
Double check that rear pivot, even if you think it is OK. Should be dismantled, cleaned and re-greased annually. More often if you ride a lot in the rain. (Do the shift linkage on the left while you're at it.) Good luck with it.

A thought- does the 2015 have the ABS test coupler by the battery like our Gen2s do? Maybe cycling the ABS with that in conjunction with fluid exchange will help. https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php?showtopic=136000&st=0&p=834610&&do=findComment&comment=834610

 

[escapefjrtist]

'15A - ABS light has never come on other than start-up and clears every time at ~6 mph. No light ever with rear only application above 35 mph either.

I do clean / lube the rear brake pivot + bleed the rear circuit annually. For whatever reason, this FJR needs the rear circuit bled annually to keep a firm pedal...

--G

 

[JAB]

'15A - ABS light has never come on other than start-up and clears every time at ~6 mph. No light ever with rear only application above 35 mph either.
I do clean / lube the rear brake pivot + bleed the rear circuit annually. For whatever reason, this FJR needs the rear circuit bled annually to keep a firm pedal...

--G

Thanks G! I will pass that on to the dealer.

 

[JAB]

Go for a short ride and DON'T use the rear brake at all. When you get back, check that the temperature of the rotor is pretty close to ambient. If warm (or hot) either the rear brake pivot is sticking (common problem as Mcatrophy says) or you have an issue with your rear brake system. I would thoroughly bleed the rear brake - including the linked lower right front linked piston.Double check that rear pivot, even if you think it is OK. Should be dismantled, cleaned and re-greased annually. More often if you ride a lot in the rain. (Do the shift linkage on the left while you're at it.) Good luck with it.

A thought- does the 2015 have the ABS test coupler by the battery like our Gen2s do? Maybe cycling the ABS with that in conjunction with fluid exchange will help. https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php?showtopic=136000&st=0&p=834610entry834610

I’ll ask the dealer if they tested the ABS this way. Thanks for calling this test jumper method out. i Have a high respect for this dealer service dept.. I hope they already did this test. They said they tested the ABS.

 

[HaulinAshe]

This problem as you describe it sounds very concerning to me. Because my gut says there is a side-play or alignment problem. The slight pressure of rear brake only is causing a shift of rear wheel or rear brake components to induce a sensor variation.

I would check ALL the rear axle components for things like the spacer washer. Check the caliper arm assembly carefully. Make sure the pivot bolt at the front is the proper size and some ******* at the dealer didn't substitute a 6mm bolt in its place during a tire change. Basically make sure the wheel, wheel bearings, spacers and various securing bolts for the rear wheel and rear caliper assembly are all correct and there's no play/slop anywhere.

And check for any metal or sludge buildup on/around both ABS sensors. It only takes a tiny bit of metal to significantly change the response of an ABS sensor. For some reason they aren't agreeing with each other.

 

[hppants]

*** - I tried to induce the fault with the rear brake only method (and played around with all sorts of combos) the other day. No dice. Nothing. ABS light on at start up, start rolling and about 3-5-ish mph, it goes out and stays out.

Also, some time ago I rolled over a paved levee at about 60 mph to discover a COW in the middle of the road 200-ish feet from the top of the levee. I grabbed and stomped both brakes to full capacity. I already knew this, but for such a heavy bike, the FJR stops when you need it. I noted that the ABS was working as I felt the pulsing in my foot for sure. Can't recall feeling the pulsing in my right hand though. While it didn't lock up, the rear tire was swinging an inch or two each way as I slowed. I shut it down way before the cow (maybe 25-30 feet to spare). Of course the cow could care less. After I slowed, she just started walking across the road right in front of me toward the fence separating the field where her sisters and aunts and others were eating.

No ABS light then either.

 

[JAB]

*** - I tried to induce the fault with the rear brake only method (and played around with all sorts of combos) the other day. No dice. Nothing. ABS light on at start up, start rolling and about 3-5-ish mph, it goes out and stays out.
Also, some time ago I rolled over a paved levee at about 60 mph to discover a COW in the middle of the road 200-ish feet from the top of the levee. I grabbed and stomped both brakes to full capacity. I already knew this, but for such a heavy bike, the FJR stops when you need it. I noted that the ABS was working as I felt the pulsing in my foot for sure. Can't recall feeling the pulsing in my right hand though. While it didn't lock up, the rear tire was swinging an inch or two each way as I slowed. I shut it down way before the cow (maybe 25-30 feet to spare). Of course the cow could care less. After I slowed, she just started walking across the road right in front of me toward the fence separating the field where her sisters and aunts and others were eating.

No ABS light then either.

Thank you SO MUCH HPPANTS ! This is the conclusive report I was looking for. I'll report back once the dealer gets this sorted out.

Jeff

 

[JAB]

Update: According to the service manager, they have been back and forth with Yamaha tech support and still haven't been able to solve the problem. Service manager says that this is "a very rare problem" and so far it has everyone stumped. He says that the next level of Yamaha tech support are "product specialists". They are trying to get up with him now. Sounds like this guy is in some Shinto Monastery on top of a mountain somewhere.

Hasn't been too big a burden so far. The weather has been positively crappy till now. Its starting to warm now and I'm going to get impatient soon.

Hope to God the extended warranty is paying for all this trouble shooting time!

JB

 

[SmashVol]

Good luck and that is quite the quandry. Keep us updated on what is found.

 

[JAB]

Last Update: The Yamaha "product specialist" has not returned phone calls from the dealer service manager. Since I have an extended warranty that goes to 2020, and I'm assured that there is no safety issues, I decided to bring the bike home. I'll run it this season and bring it back to get it fixed this coming winter. Maybe at that point, the Yamaha people and the dealer service department will not be as busy.

There will be a "Yamaha demo day" next month. The regional sales rep should be there. I plan on having a conversion with him about the poor response from Yamaha. Maybe I can get some results through him.

To be continued later...................

 

[dave k]

Here are my thoughts what if abs doesn't sense front wheel rotation abs throws error code, being how this can be cleared with

heavy braking with front and rear at same time make me think to check front brake light switch, sensor, or air in front brakes

I only say this is because if run thru gears on center stand you get a abs code while rear wheel is moving and front is not

stop rear wheel movement abs light goes out. just my 2cents

 

[Fred W]

Going back to what Haulin Ashe suggested, have you confirmed that the parts and spacers on the rear axle are in the right places and properly torqued? I can see where the rear abs sensor wouldn’t sense wheel rotation if things were not properly installed. It isn’t hard to get it right, but it also isn’t all that hard to get it wrong.

 

[JAB]

Thanks Fred W,

Now that I have the bike back, this weekend I went through all the above recommendations that everyone suggested. It all checks OK.