ADA & Service Dogs

[mdisher]

I never cease to be amazed by the breadth and width of the knowledge and wisdom of this forum.

So, I'm looking for someone who's an expert in this area.

I've tried our local Animal Control, and other municipal departments and no one seems to know who would enforce the rules/laws regarding service animals, or more specifically someone abusing these ADA laws.

(You will get a ticket and can be arrested for parking in a handicapped parking space for instance)

The last thing I'd want to do is cause trouble for someone who has a legitimate need for a service animal, but that being said...

I'd assume somewhere, someone would be equally irritated by someone claiming to have a 'service animal' when the reality is they just want their pet at work and declares them a service animal to achieve their goal.

PM me if necessary, I'd be glad to chat with you on my dime.

-MD

 

[Scab]

The Department of Justice is responsible for enforcing laws concerning ADA. But, one would believe that enforcement would come after a complaint is filed. I would also believe the complaint would come from one denied (access) and not the one providing such.

And no, I am by no means an expert or even consider myself knowledgeable on the subject. I have only been 3rd party privy to some cases in the educational setting.

With that being said, we do have an ADA Coordinator that is in charge of all this stuff at our college. He actually did his doctoral disertation on the subject. I can ask him if you wish.

In the school setting, accomodations have to be reqested. By law, we cannot assume or ask. But, after accomodations are requested, documentation is required. (Medical diagnosis, etc.) We have even required (by law) medical diagnosis of a blind individual before we could make accomodation to change the administration of a standardized test.

 

[Scab]

Additional reading:

Service Dogs

Be sure to click on the "Federal ADA information from the Department of Justice" link.

 

[mdisher]

Thanks,

I've been to most of those sites already, about to try the ADA (again). You are correct in that all the laws are clearly aligned to protect those that need service dogs. I'm OK with that, I'm sure they (those that really need them) get hassled more than they should.

I'm somewhat amazed though that there aren't more checks and balances in place. Abuse of this looks to be fairly easy and w/o penalty since there's no one to enforce it the other way.

Again, if the need were real, and the dog were an actual service dog, we'd have no issue. But this particular dog is quite rambunctious.

-MD

 

[Jagermeister]

The second Q&A might help answer your question. From ADA.gov:



Q: How can I tell if an animal is really a service animal and not just a pet?

A: Some, but not all, service animals wear special collars and harnesses. Some, but not all, are licensed or certified and have identification papers. If you are not certain that an animal is a service animal, you may ask the person who has the animal if it is a service animal required because of a disability. However, an individual who is going to a restaurant or theater is not likely to be carrying documentation of his or her medical condition or disability. Therefore, such documentation generally may not be required as a condition for providing service to an individual accompanied by a service animal. Although a number of states have programs to certify service animals, you may not insist on proof of state certification before permitting the service animal to accompany the person with a disability.

Q: Can I exclude an animal that doesn't really seem dangerous but is disruptive to my business?

A: There may be a few circumstances when a public accommodation is not required to accommodate a service animal--that is, when doing so would result in a fundamental alteration to the nature of the business. Generally, this is not likely to occur in restaurants, hotels, retail stores, theaters, concert halls, and sports facilities. But when it does, for example, when a dog barks during a movie, the animal can be excluded.

 

[mdisher]

The second Q&A might help answer your question. From ADA.gov:

Q: How can I tell if an animal is really a service animal and not just a pet?

A: Some, but not all, service animals wear special collars and harnesses. Some, but not all, are licensed or certified and have identification papers. If you are not certain that an animal is a service animal, you may ask the person who has the animal if it is a service animal required because of a disability. However, an individual who is going to a restaurant or theater is not likely to be carrying documentation of his or her medical condition or disability. Therefore, such documentation generally may not be required as a condition for providing service to an individual accompanied by a service animal. Although a number of states have programs to certify service animals, you may not insist on proof of state certification before permitting the service animal to accompany the person with a disability.

Q: Can I exclude an animal that doesn't really seem dangerous but is disruptive to my business?

A: There may be a few circumstances when a public accommodation is not required to accommodate a service animal--that is, when doing so would result in a fundamental alteration to the nature of the business. Generally, this is not likely to occur in restaurants, hotels, retail stores, theaters, concert halls, and sports facilities. But when it does, for example, when a dog barks during a movie, the animal can be excluded.

Yeah, I get all of that... But the problem is there isn't anyone to enforce any of this.

In fact, given our litigious society these days, people are scared to enforce much of anything. The sheer mention of the 'ADA' stops a lot of people in their tracks.

I had a lengthy conversation with a person from the ADA, who clearly outlined that if the animal is disruptive, the landlord can refuse to allow it on the premises (Service Animal or not).

At which point the person who's being refused would then file a complaint with the ADA. The ADA will then investigate. But there's no way to start an investigation from the other side.

At least not currently. This is apparently a growing problem and there are changes in process to clear a lot of this up but that's not likely to happen any time soon.

If said person is actually 'hiding behind' the ADA which is what we suspect, chances are good that they won't file a complaint or pursue it. Though I can understand the landlord not wanting to take that chance.

We'll see how this all turns out, and I'll update this thread as necessary.

 

[Scab]

I had a lengthy conversation with a person from the ADA, who clearly outlined that if the animal is disruptive, the landlord can refuse to allow it on the premises (Service Animal or not).
At which point the person who's being refused would then file a complaint with the ADA. The ADA will then investigate. But there's no way to start an investigation from the other side.

That is the way I understand this thing as well. In order to win, you have to instigate a fight.

Of course, he could request documentation of the disability that the individual is claiming the service dog is accomodating... Might bolster his view of the worthiness of instigating the fight...

You know, if a person had a documented visual impairment and claimed their dog was for seeing what he could not... - Then don't bother instigating the fight. You'll lose in all probability.

However, if a person could only document COPD, (which might limit walking distance for example and warrant the use of the handicap parking spots) but then claimed they needed a service dog... - Well, I'd have to pick that fight. I'd want to see the dog give him mouth-to-mouth and demonstrate what "Service" he could provide a COPD sufferer.

 

[BikerGeek99]

For some reason, this thread reminded me of the old joke with the punch line, "What?! They gave me a chiuaua for a seeing eye dog??"

 

[radman]

[SIZE=14pt]+[/SIZE]

[SIZE=14pt]=[/SIZE]

 

[kaitsdad]

Rad, as usual, you cut right to the chase.

A very definite solution to the problem. :huh:

 

[mdisher]

LOL

I had thought of that, I don't want to penalize the dog for it's owner being an ***-hat. Really all we need to do is get the dog to bite someone then it's game over.

Now I could kill two birds with one stone if the right people here in the office could be 'bit'.

 

[ponyfool]

There are examples of people claiming a ferret as a service animal because it is a "companion" but I see a HUGE difference between a SERVICE animal and a COMPANION animal. Sadly, many businesses don't see that. I for one can't understand why places let folks walk around with their dogs, be it in Home Depot or worse, a grocery store.

 

[Scab]

Well, damn, Pony. You've got the pistol. If you can't fix this, what the hell are we supposed to do?

 

[Bustanut joker]

Well, damn, Pony. You've got the pistol. If you can't fix this, what the hell are we supposed to do?

Well ya could always Shave yer.......

Nevermind.

:jester:

 

[Scab]

Well, damn, Pony. You've got the pistol. If you can't fix this, what the hell are we supposed to do?

Well ya could always Shave yer.......

Nevermind.

:jester:

So much for your Christmas card.