AE vs Standard Clutch Pro and Con

[MayBeNewFJRGuy]

I am about to pull the trigger on a 2007 FJR AE. It has 5k miles, very decent price. I know the F's are pretty much bullet Proof, however I have heard pro and con from non FJR forums on the AE's

So I come to the world of FJ and want to Ask the Question

The AE
For AE Owners Would you get another one or revert back to a clutch?

For AE, Pro and Con of ownership ride and maintenace

Non AE
Would you get one? Why or Why Not


I am currently mounted on a Yamaha 06 R1, love it to death, but I am looking mainly for a Long haul bike and the FJ fits my category as well as I bleed Yamaha when cut. I do not have to be sold on the bike I am just looking for the experiance of ownership.

For me the FJ will allow me to start fulfilling my bucket list

 

[Justin]

Non AE

Would you get one? Why or Why Not

Because I like to shift motorcycles.

 

[rbentnail]

It's an FJR. The FJ was inferior.....

 

[FJR Bill]

Part of the enjoyment of riding a powerful motorcycle is power management. Being able to slip the clutch is one of the tools that gives me more precise control of power delivery.

Bill

 

[wheatonFJR]

I'm not sure what an F is...but the FJR is a good bike. It is not bulletproof.

Read up on the FAQs and technical sections and you will see the typical issues with various year's bikes. Me, I have a Gen 1...the only problem with my bike has been the nut between the handlebars and seat.

 

[Chuck35]

I struggled with the same question when I was bike shopping. It seems most of the people who have an AE love it. Most of the people who don't have one hate it lol

The seem to be harder to sell and bring a lower price. In the end I decided to stick with what I know and get a normal clutch.

I wish the AE had a (drive by wire) lever to override automatic clutch operation, so you could use it either way....

Thank you Wheaton for bringing the lack of clarity to my attention.

I fixed it!

 

[wheatonFJR]

I struggled with the same question when I was bike shopping. It seems most of the people who have an AE love it. Most of the people who don't have one hate it lolThe seem to be harder to sell and bring a lower price. In the end I decided to stick with what I know and get a normal clutch.

I wish the AE had a (drive by wire) lever to override automatic operation, so you could use it either way....

It's NOT an automatic!

It's an electronic clutch...you still have to shift gears. If its in 1st...it will stay in 1st until you shift out of it.

 

[tigerpaw78]

Love my 2008 AE as predicted. I'm not concerned with re-sale. I'll ride it till it's done or I am.

 

[kevin98208]

I just bought a 2008 AE. I like the clutchless system. Here in Seattle it rains a lot so the roads are wet most of the year. And it is hilly. I have found the AE to be very nice when starting out at a stop light on a steep, wet hill. Leave it in first and give it some throttle. No slipping the clutch, spinning tires and wobbling. At times I miss the clutch, and other times I think this is the greatest invention ever.

The downside is there isn't any clutch to control slow speed turns. I have been practicing using the rear brake to do the same thing. It's harder and takes some getting used to, but doable. At times I miss the clutch, and other times I think this is the greatest invenction ever.

My biggest worry about the AE is reliability. If it runs for 100k miles without issue, I will love this bike. If it breaks, I will hate it. I keep thinking I made a mistake with the AE only because I am worried it will break on me and be a nightmare to fix. The second is the resale, but as I kept my last bike 11 years, my truck 10 years and my car before that 12 years, this bike will have crap resale anyways 10 years down the road.

There is no perfect solution. If you like the bike and the AE and plan on riding it forever, then buy it. If you like to trade bikes every couple of years, I would avoid it just because resale could be tough.

 

[bgross]

INon AE

Would you get one? Why or Why Not

I enjoy my '03 more than I can say in 100 words or less, but if I needed a replacement I'd consider all available bikes and wouldn't rule out an AE. Everyone that I've heard who has an AE loves it.

 

[hvrtaxi]

I have a 2006 AE and I love it. Really love it. I went AE simply because it was the first FJR that I found that met all my criteria ( very low mileage, etc.). I would make the same purchase again in a heartbeat. The only thing I would do differently would be to get the Yamaha Warranty.

I commute a lot in DC traffic and having the AE has been awesome. Repeat. Awesome. I've been stuck in slowly moving traffic up to three hours (not awesome) that would have humbled me on a clutch. The lack of a clutch handle in heavy traffic is probably the single biggest pro for my AE. The biggest negative for me is the loss of fidelity at super slow speeds. I've taken several AMF safety classes and I find it a challenge to work 'with' the computer for clutch control. Like anything else, it takes practice.

If I was offered two identical FJRs (AE and A) it would be a really tough call. However, due to my commute I would probably get the AE but would be totally happy being a caveman again too. What a great dilemma!

 

[SailorTim]

I've only had my '08 AE for a few months, and I've not ridden any non-AE FJRs, but I carefully researched reliability issues associated with the automatic clutch before my purchase. I am reasonably convinced that the technology and engineering behind the AE are sound.

Having said that, of course it CAN fail, and if it does finding someone able to fix it could be a real trick.

 

[FJRBandit]

Without question I would buy the AE again, and again, and again! Plenty of pros discussed in other threads. Cons, other than sllloooowwwww speed turns I know of none. But you learn to overcome that with the trail brake. So that's not even a con.

As for resale, my dealer made a very reasonable offer on my 08 AE on a trade for a 2013. I ultimately decided to not buy the 2013 because the AE is not available in the U.S.

 

[MayBeNewFJRGuy]

OK you got my attention as I will be moving to Seattle with in the year (I HOPE) and knowing the weather and knowing how a Auto clutch works I would be inclined to agree with you. However, a little back ground on me. I have been riding since I was 9, I am 56 now and runnig an R1, I stepped out of the Dirt Arena as I rode a o6 450 and a 2000 426 which was my cross country race bike. Fitted with a Reckluse that bike was one hell of a bike to ride FUN FUN FUN. Engine braking is no worry as I have learned plenty running the 426 in mud slet and snow. I will definietly ride both bikes as there is an 05 (Clutch) and a 07 (AE) The bike will be used to cruise the back roads of Washington, make a run to Daytona Bike Week and the USA

Thanks for the info.

I just bought a 2008 AE. I like the clutchless system. Here in Seattle it rains a lot so the roads are wet most of the year. And it is hilly. I have found the AE to be very nice when starting out at a stop light on a steep, wet hill. Leave it in first and give it some throttle. No slipping the clutch, spinning tires and wobbling. At times I miss the clutch, and other times I think this is the greatest invention ever.
The downside is there isn't any clutch to control slow speed turns. I have been practicing using the rear brake to do the same thing. It's harder and takes some getting used to, but doable. At times I miss the clutch, and other times I think this is the greatest invenction ever.

My biggest worry about the AE is reliability. If it runs for 100k miles without issue, I will love this bike. If it breaks, I will hate it. I keep thinking I made a mistake with the AE only because I am worried it will break on me and be a nightmare to fix. The second is the resale, but as I kept my last bike 11 years, my truck 10 years and my car before that 12 years, this bike will have crap resale anyways 10 years down the road.

There is no perfect solution. If you like the bike and the AE and plan on riding it forever, then buy it. If you like to trade bikes every couple of years, I would avoid it just because resale could be tough.

 

[Riona]

I am about to pull the trigger on a 2007 FJR AE. It has 5k miles, very decent price. I know the F's are pretty much bullet Proof, however I have heard pro and con from non FJR forums on the AE's
So I come to the world of FJ and want to Ask the Question

The AE

For AE Owners Would you get another one or revert back to a clutch?

For AE, Pro and Con of ownership ride and maintenace

Non AE

Would you get one? Why or Why Not

I am currently mounted on a Yamaha 06 R1, love it to death, but I am looking mainly for a Long haul bike and the FJ fits my category as well as I bleed Yamaha when cut. I do not have to be sold on the bike I am just looking for the experiance of ownership.

For me the FJ will allow me to start fulfilling my bucket list

I've had my '09 AE for a few months now, and about 3,500 miles. My pro's and con's

Con:

* I miss the ability to slip & feather the clutch -skills I had built up over years - but I can get that on my Interceptor if I need a fix.

* A nagging worry about "one more thing to go wrong"

* Potential issues on resale, but I'm not planning on selling anytime soon, and it meant I got a deal on purchase.

Pro:

* I have early onset osteo-arthritis. The lack of clutch lever (plus the heated grips) enables me to ride in traffic, go long distances & tolerate cold, yet still be in full control of the bike. My previous bike was a Ducati Monster and I just didn't ride it if it were cold, or if a lot of stop / starts were involved (traffic, rallys, etc.). This was the reason I loved the bike from the first time I rode it. To be perfect, it would also have Cruise Control.

* While not an automatic, the clutch control computer does have some tricks - hill starts are super easy, It compensates if you start off in the wrong gear by slipping the clutch, it automatically pulls the clutch to avoid the engine stalling.

* When in spirited riding, its actually kinda fun to trip the gear change with a finger press - like driving a Ferrari ! (only faster)

* I'm vertically challenged, so its nice to be able to tip toe the bike at a traffic light with both feet, and control the gears with my hand, rather than having to get a foot up on the peg to change a gear (and yes, I should downshift before coming to a stop, but I don't, so this compensates).

I hope Yam bring the AE back for the Gen 3's ... so I have an upgrade path if/when I need it

Riona

(edited to fix typos and add comment about Cruise Control)

 

[Top_Speed1]

Wheatie hit it... It's not an automatic n u do have to both up and down shift, just no hand lever. That being said, feathering the clutch is the only disadvantage I have found. You do overcome and find other workarounds. You also have to wait for the bike to warmup before start, which may be a good thing anyway. Everything else is purrfect. Pull the trigger, u will love it... That is after u get use to the no more hand jobs.

 

[RiderX]

Hmmmm. You'll be delighted with either.

I have no issues feathering the clutch (using the throttle at slow speed).

I know of very few AEs that have had major catastrophes inside of 100k (besides idle adjustments, clutch soaks, change of clutch fluid, or adjustment of actuator arm). So I'd be confident with that. On the plus side your transmission should last "longer" as it has been expertly manipulated.

No downside to slow speed maneuver once you get used to it-- it is different.

The big negative: you really can't bump start. it is not unheard of to have Gen II charging, spiders, and other gremlins. Some of theorized it can be done, but nobody has. Hmmmm.

Get either, you'll be pleased.

 

[mcatrophy]

Just to add my (heavily biased) 2 pennies' worth.

I would not be riding had Yamaha not brought out the FJR1300AS (as it is known this side of the pond) due to an uncooperative left little finger (hence my bias).

The clutch and gearbox are virtually identical between the two models, the only difference is the shift pattern (neutral at the bottom on the AE). So the only (?) extra components to add to unreliability are the two actuators (clutch and shift) and the ECU that controls them. Any problems with the clutch itself or the gearbox itself are common to both. (I've never heard of an AE with bent shift forks or jumping out of gear, so the AE 'box is probably more reliable.)

In riding, the AE has advantages

• Impossible to stall - try moving from rest in 5th, it won't stall. (Won't accelerate very quickly, either
  
  );
• Can't miss a gear change;
• In the twisties where the ease of flicking up and down the gears quickly and reliably with just your finger, which gives (at least for me) an improved experience over the cumbersome needs of a clutch lever and mechanical foot lever;
• The ability to drop 1 or more gears very quickly to do an unexpected overtake;
• In heavy traffic;
• Enables you to safely get away with some bad practices such as changing gear mid corner;

and disadvantages

• Low speed manoeuvres (for which you have to learn a different technique);
• Inability to feather the clutch to smooth drive take-up (see comments below about throttle cam);

Some stuff mentioned such as clutch soaks may be required by manually operated or electrically operated clutches.

One of the main issues with the '06 and '07, conventional and YCC-S, is that Yamaha altered the throttle cam profile on these to give an abrupt onset of power. This can cause problems in putting on the power in corners. This is more of an issue with the AE because you can't feather the clutch to smooth power delivery. Many have put on a compensating throttle tube and/or a PCIII fuel injection modifying computer to improve things. The '08 onwards reverted to a sensible throttle cam profile (I had an '06 then a '10, the difference is chalk and cheese).

There have been some YCC-S problems. Early ones were recalled to fit a stronger actuator mount (Yamaha will still honour that recall). There have been a few error codes thrown up, some due to the well documented earthing "features" of the Gen II's wiring loom, a few due to the "extra complexity". Personally, I don't worry at all about possible failures, any more than the rest of the bike, which seems to be a pretty reliable beast. Before going on long trips I simply check tyre tread depth and tyre pressures, load up and go. (Gave up checking oil and coolant levels between services years ago - except when I'm feeling guilty about not checking

.)

Final comment: The vast majority of FJR owners seem to view their bikes as "keepers", both conventional and YCC-S. Very few YCC-S owners have said they regret the decision to have one. The usual advice to potential buyers of either is "Buy it, you won't regret it".

Oh yes, I changed from my '06 to a '10 because Yamaha were threatening to withdraw the AS from the UK market, I wanted to get the latest before they did so. In the end they didn't drop it (and are now coming out with the Gen III AS). There was nothing wrong with my '06.

 

[Top_Speed1]

..........I wanted to get the latest before they did so. In the end they didn't drop it (and are now coming out with the Gen III AS).

For you guys yes, but so far for us Amerks, nope.

I would buy another AE in a heartbeat (<-->pond version AS) in a '14 or '15 model.