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I find the level of risk in country two laner riding to be much less than in dense city riding, and though I may die on an isolated country road, I find your country road/city commuting comparison analysis amusing and faulty.
"I believe the rural twisties can be a lot more dangerous than urban riding; well, certainly more dangerous than riding on the freeway, when everyone is going in the same direction."

To clarify, I don't actually think rural riding is more dangerous than riding on city streets, but as noted above, I do think it's more dangerous than riding on the freeway. And by more dangerous, I mean that freeways have low likelihood* but very high consequences, and twisties have moderate likelihood with equally high consequences; so twisties win in my book.

But no, urban city riding is absolutely the most dangerous. I mean, how does this sh*t happen?! Was the Harley rider speeding? Did he really not see or anticipate that Jeep? How was this possible??? I want to know because otherwise it just feels like death just reaches out and smacks us down and there's nothing we can do about it. Would I have been killed in the exact same scenario if it had been me and not that guy? Am I smarter, more experienced, more careful, slower? Or we're all just f**ked if we're unlucky enough to run into Mr. Jeep? <--unintentional pun.

*Albeit higher than years past, which of course is the point of this whole thread. Maybe that makes them as risky as twisties.

 
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James I am sure you are trying to say something, and it might be an interesting discussion point, I'm just not sure what it is.

If you don't want to ride any particular route, don't do it.

It's not really that hard.

 
Everybody doesn't ride with their brights on? I didn't know that.
No kidding! A few months ago, a young Lakeland cop got all pissy and hollered at me at an intersection for having my brights on. It was about 4:30 in the afternoon....about 3 hours from dusk....so it's not like I was blinding anyone.

I told him to "**** off". I was mentally daring him to do something about it, but he rolled up his window and turned right.
I always ride with my brights on. They see me coming and that's the purpose. :)
 
Everybody doesn't ride with their brights on? I didn't know that.
No kidding! A few months ago, a young Lakeland cop got all pissy and hollered at me at an intersection for having my brights on. It was about 4:30 in the afternoon....about 3 hours from dusk....so it's not like I was blinding anyone.

I told him to "**** off". I was mentally daring him to do something about it, but he rolled up his window and turned right.
I wonder if he would have even noticed you at all if you didn't have them on. Howie, they're still upset about not having sexcapades at the station house anymore. :)

 
My reasoning there (after having been crowded / threatened by cell users many times) is that the drunks know they are impaired and try to keep a low profile. The cell phone wackos think they are the only ones on the road.

At least cell users / inattentive drivers seem to be a lot more common here.

 
My reasoning there (after having been crowded / threatened by cell users many times) is that the drunks know they are impaired and try to keep a low profile. The cell phone wackos think they are the only ones on the road.At least cell users / inattentive drivers seem to be a lot more common here.
In spite of my sarcasm I completely agree with you. The cell phone zombies are certainly the most prevalent form of danger on my commute every day. I use all sorts of words in my helmet to describe them.
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Many of us simply don't understand the scope of this new animal we face. It's not that we don't KNOW about it, it's just that too many riders don't realize just how much of this is going on around us. Times are changing, and though most of us don't have this problem, way too many younger drivers do.

Cell phones... as wonderful as they are, the advent of texting and tweeting and etc. have gradually and irreversibly changed the risk we face on the roads each day. I have a smart phone, just like many of you guys. As we all know, there is a huge difference between simply talking on a cell phone and texting while driving. The average cell user sent 700 texts per month in 2012 vs. about 200 back in 2007 and only 35 in the year 2000. Times are a changing. I send and receive, I don't know, maybe 10 texts per day, non of which takes place while driving. But this is not the case with way too many drivers, especially the tech savvy younger generation. Many states have recognized this problem and are enacting new laws in an effort to curb this rapidly growing dilemma, but it appears that they are only achieving mixed results.

As a teacher, cell phones are a constant issue in my classes. Though students always set their phones to "vibrate," I can still hear them go off in many cases. I watch to see my little munchkins try every way imaginable to look at their phones without being caught. But just like too many drivers, when they're looking at their phones, they're not noticing what's going on around them while they're reading that text. And before they know it, I'm standing in front of their desk holding my hand out to request that they hand over the phone.

So I lecture, and I warn, and I am consistent with the consequences, but every day of the year I have to deal with it. I've often asked myself, "Why?" Why is this such a problem? Actually, the answer is quite simple, but few would guess that it could be so simple, as we ourselves have cell phones, but don't have this problem. Many of my kids, and many in the general population, are addicted to their cell phones. When that thing vibrates, they can't stand it. It doesn't matter if they're in class facing the teacher's consequences, or in traffic facing the danger of killing somebody. Most of my kids can't last more than about 15 seconds, even though they know they risk losing their phone or getting that dreaded teacher - phone call home. They MUST look to see who's texted them. I've watched this grow gradually worse for many years now. Texting was kind of rare years ago. But the last couple years, it's really taken off, seems like just about EVERY cell phone user has texting.

So with this in mind, there's a whole new level of danger on the roads each day, and I don't think it's going to change, laws or no laws. And even our bright headlights and flashing hyper-lights are no match for this new menace: the cager busy texting while driving.

Gary

darksider #44

 
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To expand on what Gary said, I just don't "get" texting. Nothing and I mean absolutely NOTHING can be said in a text that can't be said faster and more efficiently in a phone call. I've tried explaining this to my kids AND my wife, but they always give me the same excuse...."sometimes you can't, or shouldn't, talk so I use texting as an alternative." Even though I've tried to explain it to them they don't get it...if your are some place where you can't, or shouldn't be talking, you shouldn't be texting either.

Recently came home from work and my youngest stepdaughter was sitting on one end of the couch and her boyfriend at the other end, both madly texting away on their phones. When I asked them, you won't believe it, they were texting each other. Six feet away and texting. My wife, who refuses to grow up, admit she's damn near sixty, and tries to emulate her 20-something daughters, will text me from the living room rather than walking to my man-cave to talk to me. My solution to the texting insanity? I don't respond to them. I don't text...and I don't reply to them. I've told everyone in my personal sphere-of-influence 'DO NOT TEXT ME EVER! I WON'T REPLY, I WON'T RESPOND, I WON'T EVEN READ YOUR TEXT!"

Sure, no solution to the encapsulation and dumbing-down going on in the world, but I'll be damned if I'm gonna have anything to do with it. I've even ignored texts from some of my buds here on the forum. Told them the same thing...if you wanna communicate, call and let's talk like adults. But all that's gotten me, so far, is several drunken 3am phone calls from Bustanut Barry and Bikergeek Andy.

THEM I told "go ahead, text me!" :rofl:

 
It isn't the texting that's the problem, it's the misuse of the technology.

Text messages are intended to be used much like email: You can read and respond to a text message LATER, when it is safe/convenient to do so, unlike a phone call, which is an immediate communication.

I think the problem is those younger humans who are born into this technology, are also born into a culture of instant gratification. They don't know how to simply wait, or defer a task for a while.

If you have children, please do them, and the rest of us, a favor, and teach them patience -- how to simply take a moment or two to just wait for a while, before engaging in an activity, particularly a pleasurable one

We all could use a bit of mindfulness in our lives.

 
But I want to pass that string of cars on front of me now!
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Thank God, Mark finally said something which made some sense in this fecking thread! If full FJR throttle won't fix it, nothing can! jes' sayin' and nuff said, ese!

 
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Many of us simply don't understand the scope of this new animal we face. It's not that we don't KNOW about it, it's just that too many riders don't realize just how much of this is going on around us. Times are changing, and though most of us don't have this problem, way too many younger drivers do.Cell phones... as wonderful as they are, the advent of texting and tweeting and etc. have gradually and irreversibly changed the risk we face on the roads each day.

So with this in mind, there's a whole new level of danger on the roads each day, and I don't think it's going to change, laws or no laws. And even our bright headlights and flashing hyper-lights are no match for this new menace: the cager busy texting while driving.

Gary

darksider #44
All of that is true but I REFUSE to let the stupidity of others prevent me from enjoying riding my motorcycle. Obviously, you feel the same way since I know you still commute on your FJR.

To expand on what Gary said, I just don't "get" texting. Nothing and I mean absolutely NOTHING can be said in a text that can't be said faster and more efficiently in a phone call.
Recently came home from work and my youngest stepdaughter was sitting on one end of the couch and her boyfriend at the other end, both madly texting away on their phones. When I asked them, you won't believe it, they were texting each other. Six feet away and texting.

...if you wanna communicate, call and let's talk like adults.
Howie you make your living in Radio correct? I am fairly certain you must have a far greater appreciation for the spoken word than the average American. I agree that the power of the properly spoken word is a wonderful thing. I much prefer that to a text message.

With regards to the stepdaughter/boyfriend texting from 6 feet away... What happens when it is time for them to uhhh... I mean, how can you be intimate over the phone?

It isn't the texting that's the problem, it's the misuse of the technology.
Text messages are intended to be used much like email: You can read and respond to a text message LATER, when it is safe/convenient to do so, unlike a phone call, which is an immediate communication.

I think the problem is those younger humans who are born into this technology, are also born into a culture of instant gratification. They don't know how to simply wait, or defer a task for a while.
Instant gratification? Well I agree and we all feel a need for that sometimes. Which is why I fully understand Wheaton's post below:

But I want to pass that string of cars on front of me now!
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That is why we ride motorcycles like the FJR, INSTANT! RIGHT NOW ACCELERATION! It is almost as though you can bend space and time with just a twist of the wrist. I am here now but I want to be there... The FJR can do that for you.

 
Instant gratification? Well I agree and we all feel a need for that sometimes. Which is why I fully understand Wheaton's post below:

But I want to pass that string of cars on front of me now!
biggrin.png
That is why we ride motorcycles like the FJR, INSTANT! RIGHT NOW ACCELERATION! It is almost as though you can bend space and time with just a twist of the wrist. I am here now but I want to be there... The FJR can do that for you.
New York State Troopers don't seem to be able to grasp this and I got the ticket to prove it.
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My reasoning there (after having been crowded / threatened by cell users many times) is that the drunks know they are impaired and try to keep a low profile. The cell phone wackos think they are the only ones on the road.At least cell users / inattentive drivers seem to be a lot more common here.
I think there's more to it than they think they're the only ones on the road and #$%*& everyone else!--If you ask these people who refuse to not text or talk and drive, they will tell you that the studies are BS--they are perfectly in control when they are doing it, able to pay attention to their driving and talk / text. That to me is the scary part.

 
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