"All The Gear All The Time Thing"

[Orient_Express]

And not all of us subscribe to the "All The Gear All The Time" thing either. There just happens to be a very vocal percentage who make it seem that way.

I ain't baggin' on anyone who likes quiet pipes or wears their Stitch into the shower and everything. Do what thrills ya. But speak for yourself, instead of stating your opinions in terms of "What folks around here think". :glare:

From A Member of The Very Vocal Percentage
The above was posted by a forum member under a different thread - I removed their name and post date simply because I don't want anyone to take this as flaming or an attack against them, personally. I'm stating my opinion as just that - my opinion - based on experience - you can take it or leave it, but I'll challenge every one of you in the end, so be ready.

(I particularly like this - And not all of us subscribe to the "All The Gear All The Time" thing either)
We all know that protective gear will not save us from every injury or death - but a helmet or armored jacket does nothing strapped to the pillion - you won't have time to put it on before you impact a car, truck, bus, guard rail, telephone pole, sign... (you choose whatever you want to hit) If utilizing this gear will prevent or lessen the severity of an injury, why not wear it?

One of the duties I perform at work is Safety Coordinator for our particular District of the company I work for. Some time ago, one of the coordinators in another area had the thrilling task of doing an accident investigation after an employee, (Rick), whom I know personally as well, fell from a ladder some 18 feet to the ground. He was not wearing a safety belt and pole strap. The accident could have been prevented had he taken advantage of "All The Gear All The Time". The employee laid in an easement for a good hour before the customer he was doing the service work for, came out to look for him. Temp was about 48 degrees with a misting rain. He could not speak nor move his arms or legs. At the hopital, he was found to have injured his spine and would paralyzed from the neck down, confined to a wheel chair for the rest of his life - bad enough, huh? But wait - there's more - here's the really good part for all you out there that "don't subcribe" as the poster above stated - the part you never even consider.

The Safety Coordinator (Gary) in the district where the accident occurred has stayed in touch with this man. Since the accident, Rick has gained some limited use of three finger on his left hand. Recently, Gary conveyed this to me.

Rick (the employee) said that he just didn't take the time to put on his belt and safety strap He said he'd done that work a thousand times before with no incident - this time he made a mistake. Rick said this:

"Ya know Gary, we take a lot of things for granted - I mean being able to get around and all. Things are sure different for me now... I can't blow my nose by myself - can't open a candy bar - hell, I can't even go to the bathroom by myself. I've become a burden to everyone. I guess the things I miss the most are - well... family things. I can't hold my wife's hand and go for walks like we used to. My daughter, she wants to sit in daddy's lap - and have me tickle her and cuddle at night like we used to... my boy is 12 now and he wants to learn about cars - and go fishing - I don't do those things anymore. If there's one thing I wish for every day - it's to be able to go back to that day - and have the chance to re-live those few minutes before the accident. I'd do things different. You tell those guys to wear their gear and if they give you some excuse, ask 'em if they wanna try out my wheel chair.

Here are the explanations during accident investigations I hear consistently:

1) It's too hot to wear that stuff

2) It takes too much time to put it on

3) I forgot

4) Nobody else does it

5)I've done that job a hundred times before and nothing ever happened

6) I don't know

You can select one of these - or add your own - hey it's your accident - so, go ahead and, "Do what thrills ya'" and by all means speak for yourself, here.

Ah the young and the bullet proof - They never consider any impact on the people that love them like their family - after all, nobody else will get hurt it's just them.

You smart ***** tell me this - what's your overwhelming reason for not subscribing to "All The Gear All The Time" - explain to me how your reason outweighs a lifetime in a wheel chair?

If you'd like - I'll ask Rick if he'll let you try out his chair...

 

[odot]

I wanna crack at that chair. I'll get it.....sooner or later...be it tomorrow or when I'm too old to walk.

 

[madmike2]

I certainly didn't expect to be sliding down a 60 degree embankment. I was just riding South on Hwy 49 to meet some FJR owners and ride through Yosemite. It was a pleasant Fall morning and I was enjoying the scenery and the roadway as I headed from Sonora and crossed over the bridge at Lake McClure. I stopped and chatted with the CalTrans guys doing some road surface repair, then continued on my journey toward Mariposa and on to Oakhurst to meet my uncle for a late lunch.

About 5 miles North of Mariposa, approaching a left turn a cruiser rounded the turn coming toward me in my lane (much like the video presented elsewhere on the forum except we were "cornering" from opposite directions). Yes, I was able to miss him as he tried to get his bike back into his own lane, but my front tire went onto the dirt shoulder...then the rear tire and the bike slid out. The FJR went over the cliff and tumbled down a boulder field about 150', I impacted on my left shoulder, slid face-down over the edge and down the gravel about 15'-20'.

FJR: totalled

Rider: One small "raspberry", about 1" diameter, on my left waist and gravel scratches on the helmet face-shield.

Riding Gear: Shoie RF800, FirstGear MeshTek jacket, FirstGear Air Overpants 2.0, Teknic gloves, Oxtar boots.

How does one "plan" for such an event? You can't! My choice is to be prepared and attempt to mitigate the end result to the best of my ability.

Without the riding apparel I have no doubt I would have required an ambulance ride and spent hours in an emergency room having the gravel and dirt picked and scrubbed from most certain deep cuts and abrasions. Instead, I was able to ride in the tow-truck to my uncle's home (to store my bike) and have a nice dinner with my family (Uncle, Aunt, my Mother and my daughter) rather than dining on hospital food and having them visit me.

Since that time I have attended a Streetmasters Cornering Workshop (Link) and believe I would probably have saved the bike. My lane position, cornering technique and abilities are vastly changed and improved.

I wanna crack at that chair. I'll get it.....sooner or later...be it tomorrow or when I'm too old to walk.

odot, I appreciate your candor and the fact that you didn't whine about your recovery from your incident. I hope you (Actually, I hope anybody on the forum) never find out what existing in "that chair" is like. There is a certain bravado and machismo to your life-philosophy. A "swagger" in your speech. And it appears to be working for you.

The issue may be "what" alters any of our approaches to life on this orb and whether is is done in foresight or hindsight. I think Orient_Express and others of the ATGATT perspective are trying to give others foresight based on their hindsight. But, as in all things FJR in particular and motorcycling in general, YMMV.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

And not all of us subscribe to the "All The Gear All The Time" thing either. There just happens to be a very vocal percentage who make it seem that way.

I ain't baggin' on anyone who likes quiet pipes or wears their Stitch into the shower and everything. Do what thrills ya. But speak for yourself, instead of stating your opinions in terms of "What folks around here think". :glare:

From A Member of The Very Vocal Percentage
The above was posted by a forum member under a different thread - I removed their name and post date simply because I don't want anyone to take this as flaming or an attack against them, personally. I'm stating my opinion as just that - my opinion - based on experience - you can take it or leave it, but I'll challenge every one of you in the end, so be ready.

(I particularly like this - And not all of us subscribe to the "All The Gear All The Time" thing either)

Orient, you may get a few to take up the cudgels against (or, with) you on the 'gear' thing, I don't know? But, I think you'll get alot more response for this comment:

Orient Express wrote: Just an FYI here.The people who hang out on this forum have a real distaste for the "loud pipe" thing.. i.e "Loud Pipes Save Lives" crap..

The members here believe that to save lives, riders should be wearing protective gear and refining their skills... We stay away from the "weekend Hell's Angel" mentality, and want no part of the unshaven thundering herd or bad ass biker image.

Please don't presume to speak for me.....this is a forum for and about the FJR motorcycle and your opinions are yours -- I may, or may not, agree with them. But, I wouldn't want anyone thinking I ascribe to someone else's opinions just by being a member of this board.

I think this is the issue of concern, here?

 

[OrangevaleFJR]

I didn't used to wear all the gear. The only thing that changed my mind was reading other people's experiences, witnessing what happens to people when they slide across pavement, gravel and plants without gear and then saw the same thing happen to a guy fully geared up. I never crashed when I was wearing jeans, tshirt, sneakers etc. I just looked, learned and made a decision to wear gear.

One argument I had was the heat. I found out that the mesh gear keeps you cooler than when you just have a t-shirt on...it blocks the sun. Maybe the dry Sacramento heat has something to do with that, but the bottom line is that the heat from the sun and the bike now have a layer of insulation keeping it out.

I'll ride with anyone and I don't think anyone is smarter or dumber one way or another. I don't want to leave my skin on pavement so I wear gear. I don't want a bug in my face so I wear full face helmets (one at a time). I like my life, so while I certainly take chances to experience joy, I have my limits and everyone gets to draw their own line.

 

[Ignacio]

The above was posted by a forum member under a different thread - I removed their name and post date simply because I don't want anyone to take this as flaming or an attack against them, personally. I'm stating my opinion as just that - my opinion - based on experience - you can take it or leave it, but I'll challenge every one of you in the end, so be ready.

Your notion of trying to keep the poster anonymous is sweet, but foolhardy. It only takes about 11 seconds to find that post using the Search feature and let people put things in context from what seems like another thread of debate.

Orient Express wrote: Just an FYI here.The people who hang out on this forum have a real distaste for the "loud pipe" thing.. i.e "Loud Pipes Save Lives" crap..

The members here believe that to save lives, riders should be wearing protective gear and refining their skills...

Hmmm....the points seem to contradict each other a bit. Wanna clarify?

 

[Silver Penguin]

Like many who post here, I have my own reasons for being an ATGATT devotee. I do respect that as adults, we are free to make our own choices. It's my body - I should choose what I do with it. But there are a few other considerations:

Your right to make choice regarding gear can make the difference between you arriving at that family dinner, or someone's cell phone summoning them away from the table to your bed side, in the ER. With gear, you would have arrived a little late, and scruffy looking. Without gear, dinner was delayed while they waited..... and waited.... and then didn't eat because they were sick with worry.

Your treatment for infection which arose from the road rash has increased your health insurance premium. And mine. But it was your choice to ride without gear.

The rookie cop who wrote the report on your horrendous injuries still has nightmares about all the blood. But it was your choice to ride without gear.

All riders are exposed to dangers on the road. It's a well known fact that good gear can save your life. Without gear, you could die or perhaps worse - the living hell of a persistent vegetative state. Your loved ones could be changing your diaper for the rest of your life. Nutritious drinks will be poured into your feeding tube. You may have enough brain cells left to know this, or you may not.

The above expressions are my opinions. As you can see, I feel strongly about this issue. I do respect that other are entitled to hold different opinions.

Jill

 

[twowheelnut]

(Aw, WTH! We haven't had a good knock-down-drag-out in a long while!)

Yep, I'm with Orangie. After my get-off in April, I've upped the level of confidence in the protection my gear provides. Slammed my helmet on the gravel, dug my jacketed and CE armor protected shoulder and arm into it, as well. Had I been in lesser gear or no gear, it would have be mighty ugly (some would say, 'uglier', in my case). I now wonder, had I been wearing one of those chest and back protectors, maybe I would have dodged the busted ribs and holed lung, too. Like seat belts, I won't get underway without the gear. Period.

But, hey, do what you wanna do. Just remember this: When your avoidable death occurs when you run your bare skull into a telephone pole and that action hurts my privilege to ride, then I'm going to be the one standing in front of your grave, pissing on your headstone. That's just me.

 

[Silent]

I use to ride in a ball cap and T shirt. Then they inacted the helmet law in CA. I feel odd without one now, I even wear a full face in states that have no helmet law, reguardless of temps. Since those younger days, I've had a few owies (mostly my screwups

) and am a beliver in ATGATT. Most recently, I played George of the Jungle and bounced off a tree. Broken shoulder blade, broken collar bone, 3 broken ribs, and a lacerated liver. Yup, good gear kept me from the long dirt nap, and I fully realize that. I won't even go to the corner store w/o my gear anymore.

 

[odot]

When your avoidable death occurs when you run your bare skull into a telephone pole

Something tells me head butting a telephone pole will result in death regardless.

 

[twowheelnut]

When your avoidable death occurs when you run your bare skull into a telephone pole

Something tells me head butting a telephone pole will result in death regardless.

There you go again... Always picking nits.

 

[Kevin Daly]

Ok my 2c,

First, i forgive those who say "dont speak for us" in one breath and "we..." in the next. Everyone is guilty of both sooner or later.

Second, anyone who has crashed with 1) none, 2) some and 3) all the gear can tell irrefutably, after correcting for differences in speed conditions etc... "PROTECTED PARTS ALWAYS FAIR BETTER THAN UNPROTECTED" It is actually kind of interesting to see frame sliders on a bike whos rider is in jeans and a Tee; messed up priorities??

So i tend not to listen to the squids that argue for any reason against ATGATT. The problem with squids is that they ar too niave to know thier just plain dumb; its like kids arguing with their parents (if they only knew how stupid they sound). OE, the arguments against ATGATT are nothing more than a rationalization to be LAZY. "Its too hot" is a bunch of crap! As my pappy used to say "Take it like a man" (sorry ladies... isnt my saying but it gets the point across)

On the other hand I personally feel that it is important that people like OE MM and SP (for example) continue to reitterate ATGATT So CHeers to you all!! :drinks: (after the ride of course). And a special :drinks: to TWN, i'll be pee in along side ya (as long as you lookin up)

 

[madmike2]

Orient Express wrote: Just an FYI here.The people who hang out on this forum have a real distaste for the "loud pipe" thing.. i.e "Loud Pipes Save Lives" crap..

The members here believe that to save lives, riders should be wearing protective gear and refining their skills... We stay away from the "weekend Hell's Angel" mentality, and want no part of the unshaven thundering herd or bad ass biker image.

Erm...does that mean I have to remove Holeshots from my FJR in order to agree with OE about ATGATT? :blink:

Uhm...and do I have to stop threatening idjit cagers en tell'enem ahm gonna nuckle ther haid iffen they keeps actin stoopid? :dribble:

...unshaven thundering herd...have you seen pictures of me? :huh:

 

[painman]

Ok, I'll put my chip shot in. The only thing I worry about is like the dude in the wheel chair I would be a burden to my loved ones. That would bother me so I would rather be put out of my misery. So I owe it to them to wear ATGATT. Seems like the more I ride the more I respect the road, another reason for me to wear the gear. But if its my time then I'm ready. PM. <><

 

[Fencer]

I stopped and chatted with the CalTrans guys

You stopped and chatted with California Transvestites?

[SIZE=18pt]WARNING THE FOLLOWING LINK IS VERY GRAPHIC[/SIZE] (UNDERSTATEMENT OF THE YEAR)

AN ATG CRASH

You can see an Arai helmet and I think Alpinestars leathers.

I wear my gear, my decision,

I also subscibe to the notion of "don't speak for me" (unless I ask you to)

 

[Orient_Express]

The above was posted by a forum member under a different thread - I removed their name and post date simply because I don't want anyone to take this as flaming or an attack against them, personally. I'm stating my opinion as just that - my opinion - based on experience - you can take it or leave it, but I'll challenge every one of you in the end, so be ready.

Your notion of trying to keep the poster anonymous is sweet, but foolhardy. It only takes about 11 seconds to find that post using the Search feature and let people put things in context from what seems like another thread of debate.

Orient Express wrote: Just an FYI here.The people who hang out on this forum have a real distaste for the "loud pipe" thing.. i.e "Loud Pipes Save Lives" crap..

The members here believe that to save lives, riders should be wearing protective gear and refining their skills...

Hmmm....the points seem to contradict each other a bit. Wanna clarify?

It was another thread - toatally unrelated to this post - that's what I said. BOLD added above.

Sorry - don't get the contradiction you're referring to... loud pipes don't save lives is the point and what I stated.

Again - you are all free to choose what you want to do with ATGATT - I DO NOT SPEAK FOR ANY OF YOU - ONLY MYSELF,

If I gave the impression that I was a voice for any of you on this forum or for this forum, I apologize as that was not the intent. I have no ownership in the FJR Forum - that belongs to some one else. I'm a member, and nothing more.

I take this safety thing very seriously and personally - maybe I should lighten up, but I've seen enough people injured for no good reason other than their image - like the guy who did not wear his hard hat because it messed up his hair.

Just remember this, like me, most of you have family that cares deeply about you - get yourself home in one piece... alive and well.

<end of rant>

Now... about those good excuses....

 

[Kevin Daly]

I stopped and chatted with the CalTrans guys

You stopped and chatted with California Transvestites?

[SIZE=18pt]WARNING THE FOLLOWING LINK IS VERY GRAPHIC[/SIZE] (UNDERSTATEMENT OF THE YEAR)

AN ATG CRASH

You can see an Arai helmet and I think Alpinestars leathers.

I wear my gear, my decision,

I also subscibe to the notion of "don't speak for me" (unless I ask you to)

WTF is this supposed to prove/suggest?? ATGATT isnt going to save you if you head on at 175 MPH? Geeze lesson learned, I'll go back to riding neked :dribble:

...on the other hand, I typically dont ride at 175 mph. Lets face it, being a squid is not just about the gear; its about the mentality. It is the recognisition that your made of meat and that there is a physical limit to what your body can do, gear just extends that range a little making riding as reasonable speeds safer.

PS i would love to know that that dude was doing when he became steaks

 

[Orient_Express]

... not just about the gear; its about the mentality

EXACTLY MY POINT - Just couldn't figure out how to put it...

 

[dbvolfan]

Never subscribed to the AGATT on my motorcycle until reading about some of the experiences on here. I got to thinking that my helmet has saved my arse many times in races involving my road bike (pedal power that is) and that the bike should be no different.

I dont care if it is 93 degrees like it was this week, I now ride with my gear on. Those who choose not to wear it certainly have that right and I am not into trying to debate it. I just wonder how many after the fact have had 2nd thoughts about what coulda,woulda, shoulda been?