Anyone ever changed the clutch plates on an FJR?

[FuzzyRider]

Seeing as I toasted the friction plates by slipping the clutch while revving the piss outta the motor I've found my clutch slipping in 4th or 5th gear at full throttle anywhere at or above 3,000 RPM. So, the question is how tough of a job is it to replace the friction plates? Any special tools needed for the job? Any links to information about the job?

Thanks

 

[ionbeam]

Man, that suxs Fuzzy. If the plates are indeed bad that makes you one of the very few to kill the clutch.

There was a number of bikes that left Yamaha's with clutch problems that didn't show up until 1k miles or later. While your symptoms sound a little different, it may be worth having it checked out. Your '07 should still be under warranty, no? You may not want to mention your little clutch slipping episode to the dealer though

So, what were you doing?

 

[FuzzyRider]

Man, that suxs Fuzzy. If the plates are indeed bad that makes you one of the very few to kill the clutch.
There was a number of bikes that left Yamaha's with clutch problems that didn't show up until 1k miles or later. While your symptoms sound a little different, it may be worth having it checked out. Your '07 should still be under warranty, no? You may not want to mention your little clutch slipping episode to the dealer though

So, what were you doing?

Thanks Alan,

I do have to take my bike in for the ECU fix anyway. I might just mention my slipping clutch to the servicetech and see what happens.

As for what I did, well, let's just say that I was trying to go as slow as my Harley friends. <_<

I was practicing "slow racing" - actually a lot of fun - where you try to be the LAST person to cross the finish line without putting your feet down. Anyway, you have to achieve the right touch where you're slipping the clutch, holding the rear brake, and keeping the revs around 2,000 RPM. As everyone knows the FJR has a touch throttle so, while I was getting the technique down I would occassionally rev to 4 or 5K while braking and slipping the clutch. It's doesn't take much time under those conditions to really eat the cluch.

 

[HaulinAshe]

Have not been there, done that on the FJR, but I have put in a million clutches on other bikes. Sounds like you may have glazed the plates moreso than worn them. Just a thought in case the clutch plates come up being mega-$$$...

Get someone to lightly glass bead the plates then try them again.

 

[Just Chris]

It's no trouble @ all especially if you have the shop manual for the torque specs & patterns.

I took the clutch plates out of my '06 & soaked them for 36 hours in an attempt to resolve the lurching when 1st shifting into gear when cold.

As long as you don't need to remove the clutch drum, all you'll need to do is remove the large cover on the right side to access the clutch assembly.

You'll need to get a new gasket for the cover, but other than some normal tools you shouldn't have any problems.

Good luck.

Chris

'99 BMW K1200LTC Basalt (Starship Enterprise) with 142k

'03 Unigo Silver

'06 FJR1300A with 15k

 

[FuzzyRider]

Yeah, friction plates are about $10 each and clutch plates about $8 each. There's quite a few of 'em but I don't think it'll run much more than $100 for parts.

 

[IndianaTom]

Not being the sharpest hammer in the tool box, I still don't understand the 'soaking'. If it's a wet clutch, isn't it always soaking? Or does it get soaked in something other than oil?

...here's another thought. if the wet clutch is sorta dry when there is no force on the clutch lever (plates all squished together, no one touching the clutch lever) would putting a big rubber band on the clutch lever for 36 hours allow the clutch to soak in its own juices?

(Yea, I read that sentence 4 times, and can't seem to help it make any more sense)

 

[Windjammer]

I'd be really surprised if you fried the clutch while slow racing. Very good odds it's glazed instead. The FSM should have wear limits for plate thickness so you'll know what's up. I'd go in and measure before buying parts. I put a clutch in a Concours once, thinking that with 50K miles it MUST need one, especially since I rode it hard. Took it apart and found almost no wear - wasted my money on the clutch plates I'd already bought.

Good luck!

 

[HaulinAshe]

Not being the sharpest hammer in the tool box, I still don't understand the 'soaking'. If it's a wet clutch, isn't it always soaking? Or does it get soaked in something other than oil?
...here's another thought. if the wet clutch is sorta dry when there is no force on the clutch lever (plates all squished together, no one touching the clutch lever) would putting a big rubber band on the clutch lever for 36 hours allow the clutch to soak in its own juices?

(Yea, I read that sentence 4 times, and can't seem to help it make any more sense)

You are right, it makes no apparent sense, but it does make a huge difference. New clutch plates (fiber ones) must be pre-soaked before use. Sometimes it does work/help to clean used fiber plates and then re-soak them in oil. Overnight is typically recommended. I target 24 hours pre-soak, as my years of experience with motorcycle clutches has never shown anything more than 24 hours to make a noticeable difference in clutch performance or clutch life.

Releasing the pressure plate tension does not do the same thing because often times plates are stuck or "paired" together and do not allow oil to completely cover the surface. The idea is to saturate the exposed fiber areas with oil so there are no "dry spots" anywhere on the fiber plates.

I prefer to clean used plates(fiber and metal) with Kerosene or Charcoal Lighter Fluid, dry them thorougly, buff with brass bristle brush or glass bead blaster, then pre-soak(fibers only) for 24 hours in engine oil.

If you have access to a compression spring tension gauge, you will be surprised at the differences in clutch springs. I probably replace more springs than clutch plates.

 

[angus]

I know it may sound like Snake Oil but. The last time I had a slipping clutch I added a cup of Marvel Mystery oil to crankcase. Rode a couple of hours changed oil slip was gone.

 

[PapaUtah]

Clutch work on these is a snap. Only special tool needed is the giant vise grip with the ring to hold the clutch basket to get the Jesus nut loosened or tightened. You can make you own holder out of a piece of 1x6 pine board instead of buying the special tool. Mine is hanging on the wall. Have used the board method on many a Venture. Sorry Mssr Ashe, no springs in the FJR clutch pack. The FJR has the same diaphram style clutch as the Venture. The Venture unit is easily replaced with a spring type Barnett unit, but I am not sure they make anything for the FJR yet. So we’re probably stuck with factory components.

 

[HaulinAshe]

Clutch work on these is a snap. Only special tool needed is the giant vise grip with the ring to hold the clutch basket to get the Jesus nut loosened or tightened. You can make you own holder out of a piece of 1x6 pine board instead of buying the special tool. Mine is hanging on the wall. Have used the board method on many a Venture. Sorry Mssr Ashe, no springs in the FJR clutch pack. The FJR has the same diaphram style clutch as the Venture. The Venture unit is easily replaced with a spring type Barnett unit, but I am not sure they make anything for the FJR yet. So we’re probably stuck with factory components.

I'm glad somebody that has been into a FJR clutch spoke up. Can you tell I've NEVER been into mine and hope I don't have to??? Went back and edited my post because I just realized that I was sounding like some kind of self-proclaimed FJR clutch expert. Nope! Done a few thousand of other bikes but no FJR yet.

 

[PapaUtah]

I always enjoy your posts Jeff. No shot intended. I just didn't want some noob heading off to try and find parts or tools that don't exist for or are not needed for the FJR. If Barnett ever does make a kit for the FJR I will drop it in the next day, although the factory unit is pretty stout. The Barnett pieces are a piece of machined artwork that never gets seen after its installed...but you get to experience it every time you pull in the clutch. They are pretty much bullet proof and are found in just about every hopped up VMax I have ever seen. I talked with them when I was Living with the Harley-Dites this summer. The FJR is not on their radar.

 

[madmike2]

I talked with them when I was Living with the Harley-Dites this summer. The FJR is not on their radar.

Well, that says something about their opinion of the FJR clutch. There simply is no "need" for them to build one, or the market is so small it wouldn't be worth their while.

Solution: A lot of FJR owners need to start burning up their clutches....

 

[PapaUtah]

The FJR clutch is the same basic design used on other Yammie products. The Venture/VMax clutch is slightly smaller in diameter than the FJR unit, a few millimeters different. The Venture clutch had to withstand 104hp/84 ft/lbs of torque trying to drag a 815lb bike plus rider around. It did a fairly good job. I think the slightly larger diameter FJR clutch and less weight to overcome makes it a pretty reliable unit. Reports of clutch failure here have been relatively rare when you consider the installed base.

 

[FuzzyRider]

So the basic procedure is to pull the cluch cover, pull the cluch basket (making a piece from wood to prevent the basket from turning while loosening the nut?), pull the clutch plates out of the basket, put the new (pre soaked for a day in oil) clutch plates in, then reverse the process to assemble? That sounds do-able.

 

[PapaUtah]

To do the plates you do not need to pull the clutch basket. You can R&R the plates by simply removing the cover then unbolting the pressure plate. No reason to pull the clutch basket unless you have a bushing problem on the basket...which I highly doubt you have.

Should you need to...here is a pic of my Jesus nut removal clutch basket holder. Yeah, I know...it looks like ****...but it works and it cost $1.29 to make.

 

[FuzzyRider]

To do the plates you do not need to pull the clutch basket. You can R&R the plates by simply removing the cover then unbolting the pressure plate. No reason to pull the clutch basket unless you have a bushing problem on the basket...which I highly doubt you have.

Thanks again for the info - this is the reason I love this forum so much.

OK, looking at the parts catalog it looks like the prodcedure is:

1) Remove the 10 clutch clover bolts

2) Remove the 6 pressure plate bolts

3) Remove the pressure plate 2 (the smaller outer ring), clutch spring, clutch spring housing, and pressure plate 1 (the real pressure plate)

4) Pull the fiber friction plates and metal clutch plates out of the clutch basket

5) Replace friction and clutch plates in the same order they came off

6) Replace pressure plate/clutch spring in the same order they were removed and the same alignment with respect to each other and the clutch basket

7) Replace the 6 pressure plate bolts

8) Remove old gasket from clutch cover and crankcase mating surface

9) Apply gasket sealer to new gasket, align dowl pins, put clutch cover back on and tighten 10 clutch cover bolts (8 ft. lbs.)

So, the remaining questions:

1) Should I replace the metal clutch plates (the bike only has 8,000 miles) or just the fiber friction plates?

2) Should the friction plates be soaked in oil for a whole day prior to installation as some have suggested?

3) Is there any trick to aligning and getting the clutch cover back on like there was on my FZ1 which had the clutch disengagemetn rod through the clutch cover (FZ1 has a cable clutch) or does the hydraulic clutch make it as easy as putting the cover on and tightening the bolts?

Oh yeah, and why does MamaYama have 3 different friction plates? The outer and inner friction plates are different from the middle ones.

 

[HaulinAshe]

1) Should I replace the metal clutch plates (the bike only has 8,000 miles) or just the fiber friction plates?2) Should the friction plates be soaked in oil for a whole day prior to installation as some have suggested?

Oh yeah, and why does MamaYama have 3 different friction plates? The outer and inner friction plates are different from the middle ones.

1. Only way to know for sure is a visual inspection to see if they are discolored or scored/scarred. My guess is probably not.

2. Uh, yeah!

X. Good engineering. The outer and inner friction plates take a very different abuse and conditions than the inner ones. On clutches that do NOT use different inner/outer fibers, you usually wind up replacing perfectly good inner plates just to repair the inner/outer two.

3. Somebody else will answer that one.