auto cam chain tensioner

[harlonbrando]

I bought a new 07 fjr and after about 400 miles noticed a ticking noise between 2500-4000 rpms. Worried I had the dreaded valve tick that plagued the gen 1 models I contacted my local dealer with the concern and he said it may be the cam chain slack making the noise. I was told to get on the throttle hard a few times and that will take up the chain slack. So I did, I heard this loud ratcheting noise and then the ticking I was experencing between 2500- 4000 rpms quieted. I'm thinking I wont need to purchase the yes warrenty now. I was suprised at how hard you have to get on the throttle to invoke the auto tensioner. I do have a question about motor oil. I know it has been addressed in other topics but I cant find reference to whether I can use mobile one synthetic that I use in my auto or if I have to buy the motorcycle specific mobile one? I know my dealer claims the auto syn oil will cause the clutch to slip, but will it really?

 

[Ignacio]

Do yourself a favor and search on +friction +modifiers about the oil....to understand why car oils shouldn't be used in motorcycles and that your dealer is right in this case.

 

[TruWrecks]

You can use MX4T Mobile 1, but not auto Mobile 1. The wet clutch will slip with the auto oil. Mobile has also re-labeled the MX4T to Racing 4T, and raised the price a few dollars. I was recommended to use Spectro Platinum4 Motorcycle SAE 10w50 by a trusted motorcycle mechanic. He runs it in his race bike, and has no ill effects with the wet clutch.

Others are using 15w40 for diesel. They are also having good results.

If you're going to use synthetic, get one specifically for a motorcycle with a wet clutch.

 

[Graham Downunder]

There are lots of thoughts about oil for bikes .My thought are good quality diesel oil is probably better as it is designed for high shear loads of diesel engines . Most motorcycles these days use the engine oil to lubricate the gearbox as well as the engine , but most oils that are designed for engines are designed only to lubricate the engine not the gearboxes.Gearboxes produce high shear loads that car engines do not ,but diesel engines do ,so I think you get better gearbox lubrication and less destruction of the oil's lubricating qualities with diesel oils . This is important the longer the oil is in the engine, the less it's lubricating ability is .Remember wear on a motorcyle gearbox is just as expensive as wear on an engine to repair, so regular oil changes with good quality oils AND filters is important.

 

[markjenn]

Just to add a contrarian POV, there's never been even a hint of data that using a diesel oil has any benefit whatsoever in a bike. Further, the notion that gearboxes "shear" the oil and reduce viscosity has been debunked several times.

If you want to play it safe, put in a MC oil of your choice. But many of us have had good luck (sometimes 200K+ miles of good luck) with quality synthetic car oils such as M1 15W-50 and Shell Rotella T Synthetic 5W-40.

Mostly motorcyclists worry about oil WAY too much. Put in virtually any quality motor oil of the proper viscosity and change it regularly and the chances you'll have any problems are virtually nil.

- Mark

 

[Reg# 43897]

I'm not sure that I follow the last post. It is said that HDEO's do nothing special for a wet clutch bike application yet Shell RTS is a way to "play it safe." Shell RTS is very much an HDEO. I use it in both the FJR and my diesel Jeep. It's one hell of a robust oil and a terrific value using Shell's tough XVHI Group lll base stock. There are indeed many car applications for it but I wouldn't simply call it a "car oil" .

I do not believe that I have ever read anything credible that debunked the notion that gear boxes shear down oils (probably more accurately put: shear down long-strand polymers such as are found in lesser-grade oils' viscosity-index improvers). I believe that a gear box is particularly hard on oil. Can you link me to where this debunking has been established? As I said, I really don't believe it but am always looking to learn new things.

John.

 

[jestal]

Just to add a contrarian POV, there's never been even a hint of data that using a diesel oil has any benefit whatsoever in a bike. Further, the notion that gearboxes "shear" the oil and reduce viscosity has been debunked several times.

I don't think anyone has ever put forth the idea that using a "diesel" motor oil would create any sort of "benefit" in a motorcycle engine. What has been stated is that the current crop of Rotella/Delo/Delvac "diesel" oils are perfectly acceptable for use in a motorcycle engine and are a very viable alternative to very expensive motorcycle specific oils and/or Yamaha branded oils. The engine can only work so good, like it was designed to work. What sort of extra "benefit" that could be realized from ANY oil (meaning above and beyond successful normal operation) is questionable to me.

As far as data to support this, I guess we will have to relay on the "data" published on the oil containers....specifically the API performance specifications that the "diesel" oils meet that indicate their performance specifications easily match the motorcycle specific oils and that they do not contain friction modifiers. And, the hundreds of users of the Rotella/Delo/Delvac oils in motorcycle engines. If those oils weren't completely capable in that usage there would be serious complaining going on given the large number of users.

Keep in mind that the "diesel" moniker is overstating the fact a bit. The Rotella/Delvac/Delo oils are simply excellent motor oils that meet the highest API performance specifications for gasoline AND diesel engines. They are often referred to as "diesel" oils to differentiate them from the numerous shelf oils that have the ILSAC starburst symbol "for gasoline engines" with the appropriate dose of friction modifiers thrown in for fuel economy. To meet the highest performance diesel specifications the oils must have additional anti-wear and anti-oxidant package concentrations....i.e..ZDP...which end up exceeding the gasline API standards by a considerable amount. Do not confuse the current crop of Rotella/Delvac/Delo oils with older diesel specific oils of 20 years ago that were NOT suitable for use in many gasoline engines.

I would agree that there is way too much ado over oil and far to much obcessing over it. As long as the oil doesn't contain the friction modifiers found in specific ILSAC rated "gasline engine" motor oils it will probably work reasonably well in a wet clutch motorcycle engine.

The gear box may not shear down the oil nearly as much as some think but it certainly does have much more metal-to-metal contact or sliding contact than many other parts inside the engine itself. This requires additional levels of ZDP , conveniently found in the Rotella/Delo/Delvac oils. I believe much of the gear box "shear down" effect on oil viscosity came from decades old testing on older types of oils with non-synthetic viscosity improver packages. That would be the infamous SE/SF rated oils of the late 70's and early 80's. Those oils would easily shear down when gear loads were involved....along with causing all sorts of other long term problems with ring belt deposits. The synthetic VI packages used in all of todays oils are pretty much immune to this phenomenon and eliminate any shearing down of the oil viscosity. I think the "debunking" is not of lack of shear loads in gear boxes but confusion regarding different oil viscosity improver types over the years. People saw the viscosity loss in tests 20 years ago and don't see it in tests today so they assume the data from before was suspect and that they have "debunked" the idea. You debunk by repeating the same test, not by testing with a product 30 years better that is immune to the problem.

Given that there are many motorcycle and FJR engines reaching some very high miles with few, if any reported engine or oil related failures is pretty good data that most of the oils on the market will work pretty darned good. It is hard to go wrong. If you want to spend more $$ for synthetics and/or motorcycle specific oils then have at it. No harm, no foul. Just don't expect any miracles and realize that the Delo/Rotella/Delvac oils will work fine whether in a diesel or gasoline engine.

 

[sprint_st]

You can use MX4T Mobile 1, but not auto Mobile 1. The wet clutch will slip with the auto oil. Mobile has also re-labeled the MX4T to Racing 4T, and raised the price a few dollars. I was recommended to use Spectro Platinum4 Motorcycle SAE 10w50 by a trusted motorcycle mechanic. He runs it in his race bike, and has no ill effects with the wet clutch.
Others are using 15w40 for diesel. They are also having good results.

If you're going to use synthetic, get one specifically for a motorcycle with a wet clutch.

I'll let Jestal do the in depth commentary on this, but just about everything stated in the above quote relating to Mobil 1 is 100% wrong. Do some homework somewhere other than the motorcycle forums and judge for yourself.

 

[jestal]

I bought a new 07 fjr and after about 400 miles noticed a ticking noise between 2500-4000 rpms. Worried I had the dreaded valve tick that plagued the gen 1 models I contacted my local dealer with the concern and he said it may be the cam chain slack making the noise. I was told to get on the throttle hard a few times and that will take up the chain slack. So I did, I heard this loud ratcheting noise and then the ticking I was experencing between 2500- 4000 rpms quieted. I'm thinking I wont need to purchase the yes warrenty now. I was suprised at how hard you have to get on the throttle to invoke the auto tensioner. I do have a question about motor oil. I know it has been addressed in other topics but I cant find reference to whether I can use mobile one synthetic that I use in my auto or if I have to buy the motorcycle specific mobile one? I know my dealer claims the auto syn oil will cause the clutch to slip, but will it really?

BTW.....I am a bit surprised at any "racheting" noise associated with the cam chain tensioner. If you heard something then that is not what it was..... I cannot believe that you would hear any sound associated with the cam chain tensioner given that it is buried inside the engine, down inside the frame and bathed in oil.... And it has no idea what the throttle opening or RPM is. It simply looks at chain slack and if there is some it will adjust and not if there is none. Nothing to do with RPM. Another braindead dealer starting rumors.

To answer your question more specifically about oil. Look at the oil bottle. If it has a starburst ILSAC symbol on it avoid using it in a wet clutch device. ILSAC oils rated "for gasoline engines" in the starburst logo have friction modifiers to improve fuel economy in auto engines. The wet clutches in bikes do not like the friction modifiers in high doses. Use oil without the friction modifiers. Normal Mobil 1 is an ILSAC oil "for gasoline engines" and contains friction modifiers. Not the best choice. The Rotella/Delo/Delvac "diesel" oils are NOT ILSAC rated oils with friction modifiers which is why they are excellent for motorcycle engines....and most any other engine out there. The 15W40 version of those oils is available most anywhere in gallon jugs. Sams had Delo by the case for $52.00. That is 6 gallons. Beats the heck out of any other comparible oil at any price.

 

[Bounce]

You can use MX4T Mobile 1, but not auto Mobile 1. The wet clutch will slip with the auto oil. Mobile has also re-labeled the MX4T to Racing 4T, and raised the price a few dollars. I was recommended to use Spectro Platinum4 Motorcycle SAE 10w50 by a trusted motorcycle mechanic. He runs it in his race bike, and has no ill effects with the wet clutch.
Others are using 15w40 for diesel. They are also having good results.

If you're going to use synthetic, get one specifically for a motorcycle with a wet clutch.

I'll let Jestal do the in depth commentary on this, but just about everything stated in the above quote relating to Mobil 1 is 100% wrong. Do some homework somewhere other than the motorcycle forums and judge for yourself.

+1. I have 5 bikes and well over 200,000 miles on M1 15w50 (without the star burst logo) - all with wet clutches none with clutch slip. The first 2 were converted with about 42,000 miles on them at the time of conversion and neither slipped as they neared the 100,000 mark at the time of sale. One was and 1983 model sold in 1993 the other was a 1984 model sold in 1999. All the others were converted to M1 15w50 after an initial 3000 mile break in period.