Electrical mystery / brake lights '06 FJR

[Gene Weygandt]

I hope I can explain this in a way that's useful and clear. Bear in mind I'm no sort of tech and probably didn't ask the tech at the Yamaha shop enough questions for you to help, but here goes...First, a few weeks ago, I got a new Yamaha battery (BS BT 14B- 4 FA $78.95) installed in this '06 Gen II FJR. After a couple weeks of riding, I discovered my old Skene flashing brake lights ( prev owner) weren't flashing, but instead were on constantly. Then, that my factory brakes lights also weren't working. Took it to the local Yamaha dearship. The brake bulbs were burned out and he replaced. But then found out that they still didn't work as brake lights, but rather seemed to be on as running lights and and only worked as brake lights when the throttle was somewhere faster than idle, and maybe (sorry again) only when in gear and moving. So, he took the Skenes out and replaced the voltage regulator / rectifier (?) which did not solve the problem. As I said, I didn't ask all the Q's, and the tech just left for a vacation till next week. He'd "called Yamaha" ( no idea who he spoke to), and they said they were baffled by the phenomenon and could offer no help. I may be able to get more detailed info from another guy at the shop, but OBV any ideas or experience will be appreciated. TIA and ride safe!

 

[Rogue]

First remove/disable the Skene unit and see what they do. That takes the variable of it out and it may have died.

 

[RossKean]

Front brake light switch (subject of a recall) or rear brake pivot sticking and requiring clean and grease. Sounds like brake is on all the time. Also, check that the sockets for the brake lights are clean and not corroded. Make sure that the replacement bulbs were inserted correctly and not turned 180° .

Also remove Skene unit as suggested by @Rogue above.

 

[Gene Weygandt]

First remove/disable the Skene unit and see what they do. That takes the variable of it out and it may have died.

Thanx. I failed to mention that he did that. But I appreciate the reply!!!

 

[Gene Weygandt]

Front brake light switch (subject of a recall) or rear brake pivot sticking and requiring clean and grease. Sounds like brake is on all the time. Also, check that the sockets for the brake lights are clean and not corroded. Make sure that the replacement bulbs were inserted correctly and not turned 180° .

Also remove Skene unit as suggested by @Rogue above.

Thanx! He took the scenes out of the equation. Sorry I forgot to mention. I'll suggest the 180 degree bulb thing when he returns. I keep thinking it's something stupidsimple. You know...look for the most obvious stupid thing?

 

[RossKean]

Thanx! He took the scenes out of the equation. Sorry I forgot to mention. I'll suggest the 180 degree bulb thing when he returns. I keep thinking it's something stupidsimple. You know...look for the most obvious stupid thing?

Can't remember if the signal light is combined with the running light or the brake light. In any case, the tail light assembly contains two each of two bulb types. The 1156 is a single filament bulb with a single contact on the base and two locating pins which fit into slots in the socket are at equal heights above the base. The other bulb is a dual filament 1157 which has two contacts on the base and the two locating pins are at unequal heights. Theoretically, they will only fit one way in the socket but it just depends on how careful you are with inserting them. I have seen them forced in. See diagram. The two filaments in the 1157 are different wattages as well. (Bulbs push in and turn.)

As I mentioned above, make sure there is no corrosion in the sockets. And check out the front brake switch and the rear brake pivot!!! (Rear brake switch could also be at fault but a sticky pivot is more likely.)

 

[Gene Weygandt]

Thanx I'll suggest all this when he returns to work!

 

[Gene Weygandt]

Here's a follow-up post and I'm still in need of help. The tech at the local Yamaha shop has "tried everything [he] can think of," including two fruitless calls to Yamaha, and the brake lights still only function as running lights. I'm about 90 mi SW of Chicago and I've no idea where to turn next. They seem to have "tried everything" they can think of, and I believe conscientiously, but after four weeks of not at all fixed, I've asked them to button it up. I'm taking the bike back tomorrow or the next day, paying for the labor, and punting. I'll get a friend to drive behind me so I don't get rear-ended. But if ya got a idea.....

 

[RossKean]

Without having it in front of me with a multimeter (Volts and Ohms) to help see what's going on at the socket, bulbs and switches, I can't really help any further. Anyone who knows anything about old-school automotive electrics should be able to diagnose and fix this. The signalling system (brake and turn signals) and lights in a Gen II FJR are simple analog electronics. Bad bulb, wrong bulb, improperly installed bulb, dirty switch, broken wire, bad flasher, blown fuse, corrosion in the socket, broken/damaged socket, short circuit, or ...? No rocket science needed.

Note: This is not a motorcycle-specific problem. System (and problems) are similar to any motorcycle or automotive system going back 75 years! Old school auto mechanic might be as much help as anyone, if you know the right guy.

 

[Gene Weygandt]

Thanx!!!!! I called a guy today, and he's def "old school." fingers x'd

 

[torch]

When I got my 06 from my brother, it came to me with no left hand side brake light. Turns out the wire was pinched when someone assembled or reassembled the tail section at some point in it's past. The conductor inside was broken right at the socket.

Took me an hour to figure it out, and a half hour to fix. Much of that was removing and reinstalling the tupperware.

 

[vzhq16]

Yeah, this shouldn't be rocket science. I'm 20 miles south of Indy so, it would be a bit of a haul for you. If you want to bring it over here, I'd like to see this for myself. I can't guarantee a fix but, I'd be willing to give it a try if your old school guy doesn't work out.

 

[Gene Weygandt]

That's kind of you and if the new "old guy" can't figure it I may try and swing down by you . BTW, I wonder if YK my BMW pal Dave Cwi who lives in Indianapolis. Anyway thanx, and ride safe!

 

[tschutter]

@Gene Weygandt
Any update on this/ Maybe a little too soon?

 

[Gene Weygandt]

@Gene Weygandt
Any update on this/ Maybe a little too soon?

Thanx for asking. The bike's back from the Yamaha "dealer," the brake lights still don't work, the flashing brake lights have been disconnected...along with the front running/fog lights (???), one of the side panels broken, and the the temp getting waaaay high almost instantly at a stop, say 8+ bars and not coming back down for a muuuuch longer time than normal. So they charged me two hours labor plus the price of two new bulbs. The tech says he spent 18 hours on it. So I said I thought two hours was more than fair. Of course at the moment I was unaware of the "extras" that had been performed. So now I believe I'll rent a trailer, drag it up to DuPage Yamaha where I made an app't ...for Oct 26, about 90 minutes away, see what they can do and then rent another trailer to bring it home since it'll likely be to cold etc to ride in November. Yee-effing-haw!

 

[RossKean]

They must have drained coolant for some reason and didn't refill? That or the thermostat is messed up. (Fans shouldn't come on in normal riding unless it is very warm and you are stopped for a longer period of time so not likely a disconnected fan/relay.)

 

[vzhq16]

No motorcycle tech would claim to have worked on any bike for 18 hours and returned it to a customer in that condition. There is no cause, need or reason to drain coolant to work on an issue with brake lights. If there were, in fact, air trapped in the cooling system, it is more likely that the temp gauge would read no or very low bars since there would be no coolant contacting the sensor. That would also cause the fans to remain off. The fact that the temp goes high when stopped and takes longer to drop once moving again indicates that the fans are not working. Since the "tech" was looking at electrical stuff, it makes more sense that they inadvertently/unknowingly/stupidly disconnected the cooling fans and failed to fully test the bike once they were "done" with it. It saddens me to see you going through this Gene, but I am convinced that whoever you've had working on the bike is an incompetent ****. I sincerely hope that whoever you take it to next is able to resolve the issues (both new and old) to your satisfaction.

 

[RossKean]

There is no cause, need or reason to drain coolant to work on an issue with brake lights.

I agree, but steam in the empty headspace of an incompletely filled cooling system can cause the temperature to register as hot.
Disconnected fans could be an issue although I find that mine rarely come on unless ambient temperatures are warm and the bike hasn't been moving at all for at least several minutes. Don't know what conditions the OP was experiencing in terms of temperature and duration. He mentioned that the temperature soared "almost immediately" at a stop so that sounds less likely to be fans. At least the root cause for that behavior should be easy to troubleshoot - radiator fill level and/or fan disconnected/blown fuse etc.
Still, they really messed up and I agree that there is nothing they could do that would take as much as 18 hours! Perfectly reasonable to change bulbs and disconnect brake flasher and auxiliary lights when troubleshooting something like this although they should have been put back the way they were.

 

[vzhq16]

I agree, but steam in the empty headspace of an incompletely filled cooling system can cause the temperature to register as hot.
Disconnected fans could be an issue although I find that mine rarely come on unless ambient temperatures are warm and the bike hasn't been moving at all for at least several minutes. Don't know what conditions the OP was experiencing in terms of temperature and duration. He mentioned that the temperature soared "almost immediately" at a stop so that sounds less likely to be fans. At least the root cause for that behavior should be easy to troubleshoot - radiator fill level and/or fan disconnected/blown fuse etc.
Still, they really messed up and I agree that there is nothing they could do that would take as much as 18 hours! Perfectly reasonable to change bulbs and disconnect brake flasher and auxiliary lights when troubleshooting something like this although they should have been put back the way they were.

Looking back on the original reason for Gene taking the bike to a "dealer" was for brake lights that were inop after a battery replacement. We'd have to guess but, since the "tech" was looking at electrical stuff, removal/disconnection of the Skene and any other accessories would be a logical place to start but, if that didn't bring back the brake lights, tracking the 12V starting at the sockets would make sense. Who knows what the "tech" did or did not do? This is one that will likely end up being what should have been a simple repair and got missed by a "tech" that didn't start with the simple stuff and now it has snowballed into a hot mess and a bike that has sustained damage. It'll be interesting to "see" what the next dealer finds. I just feel bad for Gene.

 

[Gene Weygandt]

They must have drained coolant for some reason and didn't refill? That or the thermostat is messed up. (Fans shouldn't come on in normal riding unless it is very warm and you are stopped for a longer period of time so not likely a disconnected fan/relay.)

Which seems to me to make no sense whatsoever. I can almost undersatand disconnecting the front driving lights...almost, but not the coolant. Is it too soon to say "for criminetly Petes?"