EOM PLANS POSSIBLY DOWN THE TUBES

[DailyCommuter]

At least I have my iPhone so I can whine about it and post this.

Here's the deal. I worked real late last night decided to take a nap before I headed home, left work this am at around 6:30. Stopped halfway home to get some gas. When I went to star the bike. Nothing. And by nothing I mean turn switch on, get the usual lights and cycle of the speedo and tach, but when I go to crank it over-nothing!

The past couple days it has been acting a little pinky, ie like the ignition switch was shitting the bed again. I had already replaced it once before the recall was official. And I'm pretty sure the new on I got was one of the new design, but I'm not sure of that. Not a big deal really because I have the brand new switch that I got under the recall sitting in the box still in my garage, I know I know. Good place for it dummy! Better place would be in the bike!) but my thought was leave the one that I paid 90 bucks out of pocket for in there til it died and when it did, no big deal I have stuff on the bike all the time that I could just cut the wires going to the switch and jump them, bingo back in business

However, being far to cocky I think I jinxed myself. After I pushed it awY from the gas pump to a nice shady spot to work on it, I fiddled with the switch for a while, to see if I could get one more start out of it, no dice, so electrical

surgery it is then! Pulled out my electric bag of tricks and my tool kit, and cut the wires connected them together and thinking I would be all set tried to turn I over, nothing still?!? WTF. That should have done it

now I'm sitting here thinking thatthe code 12 showing is something else. Last time when my switch died it threw code 12, which I already know has nothing to do with the ignition switch itself, but can be triggered by a bad contact inside of it resulting in the ECU reading a lower than normal voltage and throwing this code. Last time this happened I just took the FSM's word for it and went right after the crankshaft position sensor, I have that still in my garage too, it was the bad switch that made the code 12 pop up.

Now the problem is this if it ain't the switch, what am I looking for next? I thought I would get ambitious and take advantage of the tool kit I carry, and pull the side panels (under the rider seat) off and check the connectors, and plugs that are all hidden under the outer air filter cover, I disconnected every plug behind there, and unplugged the main ECU connector and checked them all for moisture tightness and corrosion. Didn't find anything.

So next I decided (after checking my tools to male sure I had what I needed) I aS going to remove the gas tank and get a look at the connectors under there. While I had it up I unplugged the ignition switch leads and pulled the harness out so I could splice them all back together and get my key switch working again. That's done (heat shrink tube and everything). So I proceeded to check all the visible connectors for corrosion. Couldn't find anything out of whack. Theain thing I was looking for was that notorious connector plug thatthere have been a few recent threads about there being corrosion inside the plug. Fro

what I recall that plug is supposed be located up near the bottom of the tripple tree, under the tank. I don't know if I'm blind, or the plug I have seen in the pictures is actually inside the protective cover of the wire harness and nobody mentioned that little part (I'm not doing exploritory surgery on my wire harness to find out), or if those pictures I saw were all from gen I bikes.

Either way I'm out of ideas for shot to look at, and kind of screwed cuz I can't get it home for a while with a buddy coming later today to pick me up.

So I am looking for ideas of other thongs to check, I've eliminated the ignition swith and the sidestand switch as possibilities, it's something electrical, and whatever it is it's causing the ecu to get a faulty reading making the ecu "think" it's the crank position sensor. There were a couple other things related to code 12 but they escape me right this second.

I got time on my hands and a full charge on the phone so I'd love to get some ideas from the tech/mech inclined people around here.

Thanks in advance. Chris (down but not out(yet)). Still gonna get my stubborn ass to EOM somehow. I'll be waiting for replies. Thanks gang. BTW. if you want to ring me up and help or break my balls. The cell is 617-259-4869

after thought. (wish I took some pictures to post of my bike all apart in this gas station parking lot with my tools and **** all around on the ground.

Second afterthought. There's hope for Harley Guys. One Actually came over to check on me and ask if I needed any tools or anything, and asked me if I knew what was wrong. When I started talking to him about the ECU, trouble codes, bad current, and my ignition switch- his eyes just kinda glazed over and rolled back in his head a little though. Nice of him to stop and ask me though. I do the same for anyone everychance I get, fix flats whatever I can do. So I'm hoping my balance is high today in the bank of KARMA, cuz I need to make a withdrawl bigtime

 

[DailyCommuter]

Btw sorry for all the spelling mistakes. It's hard to type out a big post like that and be able to see it and edit it all correctly before posting

 

[DailyCommuter]

Update: I'm home. She's in the garage, and thank you for the three phone calls I've gotten already with suggestions to look at. I'm about to star taking crap apart at home with my real tools and hopefully will be able to post some good news in a little while. If you call I probably won't be able to grab the phone right away, but I will call you back when I can if nothing else just to thank you for taking the time to try to help. Stay tuned. I'll het it figured out , and let everyone know what it was when Im done. Thanks again if you reply to this thread I'll get an email on my phone, which is probably the best way to get in touch for the next few hours. Thanks once more

 

[twistedcricket]

I didn't notice it in the posts so far; have you had the ignition swtich recall done? Looks like you were going after that as a culprit.

Also, don't check fuses IN the holder. Pull them.

reset the ECU connector? (you've done that recall too, right? )

 

[DailyCommuter]

I have the tank off, checked all kidnds of connectors again, still can't find that big problematic one from the other threads....was able to remove the remote preload adjuster (now that i have the "home" tool kit so I could get my hands down on the two connectors going into the voltage rectifier in front of the rear wheel, those gave me trouble once before. That wasn't it.

I took the new ignition switch off my shelf to just plug it into the harness and try cranking it or at least clear the code, (can't start it cuz the tank is completely off) I think I'm onto something. At first with the new switch, no changes code 12 still in the display, couldn't clear it with the kill switch. Went out of diagnostic mode and turned the key, and kill switch on and just held the starter button. For about 5 seconds. Nothing, but then while still holding it code 12 disappeared from the display and the guages cycled their lights and needles again. Next time I hit the starter button. Voilà. Cranked over. I'm going to fiddle with it a bit longer and see if I can duplicate the problem hooking the old switch back into the harness. I'm not a dealer shop here so I ain't gonna crank it over once and just declare victory and call me to say your bike is all ready to be picked up. I have a thousand plus miles between me and EOM and I want to be 110% sure that WAS the problem. Not just some fluke that it turned over after I changed the ignition switch. 

I'll check back in later on and give an update again see if I find anything else out

 

[BkrK12]

Check the PCIII ground

 

[DailyCommuter]

I haven't had the "recall" done. To clear it up a little. The original switch in the bike died. Brown wire pulled away from the switchplate inside the switch. I bought a new switch from the dealer prior to the recall becoming official. That's the one presently in the bike and the one that I think failed today. The third switch in the mix is the brand new one still in the box that was the "recall kit " switch. So I am going to install the brand new "recall kit" switch in the bike today with the hopes that IT was the problem. I am also going to replace the battery, as the one in the bike right now is the original, only two years old I know, but I have also read that these batteries don't seem to last as long. So I'm going to replace it just to eliminate it as a possibility.

Also. To clarify how the code occurred today. It was not immediate. I turned the key flipped the kill switch, held the brake and pushed the start button. You could push the start button a million times at that point and it wouldn't throw the code, what causes it to throw the code is if you hold the start button in continuously for too long, and I knew that ahead of time, because it's the same way it happened to me last time, nevertheless I held the start button in saying " c'mon one more start. I k ow ya got 1 more in you" I just held it in to long waiting for the bike to crank. After that period of time the code 12 gets thrown out, and basically from that point you're locked out of cranking it over or starting it until you clear the code.

Still with me. Good. The catch 22 to code 12 is. You can't clear the code using the diagnostic mode like you can most of them. To clear it you need to correct the condition that caused it, and then crank the bike over to clear it. So back and forth like the chicken and the egg, you can't crank it til you clear the code, and to clear the code you need to crank it over

Think I'm nuts? check the FSM. It says, and I quote

on page 8-66 fault code 12 crank position sensor, symptom no normal signals are recieved from the crank posi sensor. Unable to start. Unable to run.

Then... On page 8-78 a page dedicated to fault code 12. The reinstatement method is cranking the engine

it's a funny situation because a little low voltage or current to the right sensor tricks the ecu into reading it as a faulty cps.... And prevents you from turning it over....then you need to turn it over to clear the code.

Anyways I'm off to get a new battery before the shop closes, and then I'll put the blnew switch in permanantly, along with the battery, and another item I can't mention here.... And hopefully case closed on this one. I simply held the starter button in for too long in a weak battery situation, or a faulty/dirty ignition switch situation, and fed the ECU bad information and tricked it into thinking the cps was bad. I think this'll all be fixed up and back together in a few hours, then I can get to stuff I wanted to do this morning, like my new lights, and so e small maintanence items...

 

[Bustanut joker]

Well Chris, Ya see what happens when ya mess with me?

Now, I want you to write this down three hundred times," I will refrain from bustin' Busts Balls for he is the Master.. Then pm me the lines B)

I'll see about lifting the jihad on yer scoot when you finish.

:jester:

 

[DailyCommuter]

Ya know. You were the first one I thought of, when I was guessing who'd help, and who'd bust balls! Guess which category you were in? :finger:

 

[DailyCommuter]

Check the PCIII ground

Hi Dan, I did, easiest to get to. Not it though. Solid and clean

 

[Bustanut joker]

Ya know. You were the first one I thought of, when I was guessing who'd help, and who'd bust balls! Guess which category you were in? :finger:

Bet you was necked when ya thought that weren't ya? Perv.

Somebodys gotta look out fer you Klowns...

:****:

:jester:

 

[Fred W]

Sweet! Glad to hear that it was just the ignition switch. I had visions of other bad stuff when you described the symptoms.

After you get done putting the switch in you'll be in good shape to skoot off to Johnson City. Damn good thing that this didn't happen on the road 1/2 way there (with your Recall ignition switch sitting in a box at home) I'd say.

I think your Karma is actually on your side today.

Now, when you get back, maybe you'd like to make a donation to the Brody relay relief organization?

 

[DailyCommuter]

Things are looking good, bike looked a lot worse an hour or two ago, but now it only looks like this...

Now where the he'll did I put that ECU down.... Hmmmm

 

[DailyCommuter]

My day started on a 3 hour nap last night in the front seat of my work dump truck. I worked until 3:30 AM from noon the day before. Made it half way home. Stopped for gas. Bike decided to quit right then and there. Tore down the bike halfway in the parking lot of the gas station looking for a problem, waited 2 and a half hours for a ride from my best friend Rick. Got the bike home. Tore it all down again, and then some (see picture in last post) now here I am in my garage sitting on the floor smoking the days last cigarette(really gotta quit these things) 18 hours or so later

replaced the ignition switch, bought a brandy new battery(just cuz I felt like getting screwed by a dealer today) oh yeah $140 for the f*****g battery. But he'll who cares it's only money. New battery installed, every accessable electric connector, pulled apart, inspected, cleaned, lightly greased, reassembled, new "nameless part" you know that funny black box under the riders seat that the main ECU harness plugs into (don't ask any questions about that one please), installed the HID conversion kit that I ordered the other day (what a mother f'er that was, not exactly a bike specific wire harness but well made nonetheless). Put the entire bike back together..... And

[SIZE=36pt]TA DAaaaah![/SIZE]

now I am going to bed. I am exhausted, this is no shape to be in the day before a saddlesore 1K. see you all down at EOM. thanks to everyone that helped today. Especially Bustanut Joker. Without his kind words of encouragement, and helpful sugestions along the way I doubt if I'd have come this far. Thanks pal. :****:

 

[FJR-RemingtonRider]

Glad you back up and running.

Ride safe to the EOM.......

 

[painman]

Glad to hear you got things straightened out (even if BustANut was pokin ya, (pun intended), and your going to EOM now. You can't pass these events up as they only happen once in a life time even if it is once a year....and plus 10,000 on Freds idea of donating to Brodies harness fund if you haven't already. It is a quality piece and will take the load off that new ignition switch and your mind as well. Take care, Painman. <><

 

[Bustanut joker]

Hey Chris.. No problem man :rockwoot:



:lol: :lol:

:jester:

 

[ahchiu]

Chris,

I'm glad you got it fixed, I was one of the callers, I still think the battery had something to do with it, glad you got a new one, I had problems with my 06 battery after only 2.5 years, have a safe trip to EOM.