Flickering LCD Display

[Dr. Jekyll]

My 2007 FJR has an LCD display that flickers when it idles. It's the only time it does that. My bike has extra load on hte electrical system that I know of save for the HID light upgrade but from what I've heard that's supposed to actually reduce the strain. Could this be a battery or alternator problem? ANyone experience something similar? Thanks!

 

[scubatech]

Check your ground spiders just in case. They usually start with a warning like this. The lights should be steady at idle if set at 1000-1100.

 

[fjr mississippi]

+1 on the ground spider

 

[ionbeam]

Quick hit 'n run reply, I may have overlooked something obvious in this quick reply. The LCD back-light flickers or the actual LCD alphanumerics flicker?

Whenever there are electro-farkles installed there is an opportunity for install errors... When was the last time your display did NOT flicker? --or-- When did the flickering start? Had you done anything to your FJR on or about the time the flickering started?

If it is the back-light that flickers you really need to check the voltage at the battery with a volt meter and then check switched ignition voltage. Having done that:

If the battery is stable but the switched ignition voltage flickers check to see if the ignition switch recall has been done. If the battery voltage flickers, check the battery terminals to ensure they are clean & tight, and that the rubber terminal protectors are not caught up in the terminal joint. If the ignition switch recall has been done and the battery terminals are tight then the next likely suspect would be the ground spiders. If the battery terminals are tight and the battery voltage flickers the problem will be at the Main Power connections on the starter relay or a problem with the charging circuit.
If the alphanumerics are flickering and the battery and ignition voltages are stable you are looking at a connector problem feeding the Meter Assembly or the connection at the Meter Assembly.

 

[Patriot]

mine is not really a flicker per se

While testing my AVCC in the dark after install,

WFooshee pointed out the dark right side of the screen ('04 Gen I) that lights up and goes dark over time

It's a flaky illumination bulb back there we thinks

It's been over a year and mostly it's lit, but not always...comes and goes irratically

 

[JamesK]

mine is not really a flicker per se

While testing my AVCC in the dark after install,

WFooshee pointed out the dark right side of the screen ('04 Gen I) that lights up and goes dark over time

It's a flaky illumination bulb back there we thinks

It's been over a year and mostly it's lit, but not always...comes and goes irratically

Your GenI uses incandescent bulbs for back-lighting, but the GenII uses LEDs, so the OPs problem is different to yours Patriot.

 

[Dr. Jekyll]

Quick hit 'n run reply, I may have overlooked something obvious in this quick reply. The LCD back-light flickers or the actual LCD alphanumerics flicker?

Whenever there are electro-farkles installed there is an opportunity for install errors... When was the last time your display did NOT flicker? --or-- When did the flickering start? Had you done anything to your FJR on or about the time the flickering started?

If it is the back-light that flickers you really need to check the voltage at the battery with a volt meter and then check switched ignition voltage. Having done that:

If the battery is stable but the switched ignition voltage flickers check to see if the ignition switch recall has been done. If the battery voltage flickers, check the battery terminals to ensure they are clean & tight, and that the rubber terminal protectors are not caught up in the terminal joint. If the ignition switch recall has been done and the battery terminals are tight then the next likely suspect would be the ground spiders. If the battery terminals are tight and the battery voltage flickers the problem will be at the Main Power connections on the starter relay or a problem with the charging circuit.
If the alphanumerics are flickering and the battery and ignition voltages are stable you are looking at a connector problem feeding the Meter Assembly or the connection at the Meter Assembly.

It's the back lit panel not the characters. Can't really say as I just noticed it today, haven't really checked it out before. My ignition switch recall was completed last month.

 

[JamesK]

My 2007 FJR has an LCD display that flickers when it idles. It's the only time it does that. My bike has extra load on hte electrical system that I know of save for the HID light upgrade but from what I've heard that's supposed to actually reduce the strain. Could this be a battery or alternator problem? ANyone experience something similar? Thanks!

I am with Ionbeam's second suggestion, assuming you have not been bitten by the Ground Spiders, and given your location you could simply be experiencing corrosion in the terminal blocks/connectors. You didn't mention if the main/all connectors have ever been inspected for corrosion and dielectric grease applied to prevent corrosion from setting in. I speak from a little bit of experience on this since my '07 had the misfortune of spending it's first 3 years of life being based in South Flori-duh. During my Ground Spider elimination work I went through all the connectors and did find a few with varying degree of corrosion, even though they had not started causing any problems yet.

 

[Dr. Jekyll]

My 2007 FJR has an LCD display that flickers when it idles. It's the only time it does that. My bike has extra load on hte electrical system that I know of save for the HID light upgrade but from what I've heard that's supposed to actually reduce the strain. Could this be a battery or alternator problem? ANyone experience something similar? Thanks!

I am with Ionbeam's second suggestion, assuming you have not been bitten by the Ground Spiders, and given your location you could simply be experiencing corrosion in the terminal blocks/connectors. You didn't mention if the main/all connectors have ever been inspected for corrosion and dielectric grease applied to prevent corrosion from setting in. I speak from a little bit of experience on this since my '07 had the misfortune of spending it's first 3 years of life being based in South Flori-duh. During my Ground Spider elimination work I went through all the connectors and did find a few with varying degree of corrosion, even though they had not started causing any problems yet.

Point well taken. I did a cursery inspection previously but I'll take a closer look and apply such grease while I'm at it. I'll also have to consider the ground spider solution, I assume I just purchase those home made kits under the group buys? Thanks.

 

[ionbeam]

Your GenI uses incandescent bulbs for back-lighting, but the GenII uses LEDs, so the OPs problem is different to yours Patriot.

Wowzer, JamesK is on the money here. There is no way, at any time that a LED should flicker. I can't imagine a scenario where all of the the Meter Assembly works correctly but the LEDs that illuminates it flickers. Unless you are seeing flickering from overhead florescent lights reflecting on the gauges I can't explain the flickering beyond a Meter Assembly failure. Did you see the flickering under daylight or outside at night? Even bad ground spiders shouldn't cause flickering. Baffled for the moment.

 

[Dr. Jekyll]

Your GenI uses incandescent bulbs for back-lighting, but the GenII uses LEDs, so the OPs problem is different to yours Patriot.

Wowzer, JamesK is on the money here. There is no way, at any time that a LED should flicker. I can't imagine a scenario where all of the the Meter Assembly works correctly but the LEDs that illuminates it flickers. Unless you are seeing flickering from overhead florescent lights reflecting on the gauges I can't explain the flickering beyond a Meter Assembly failure. Did you see the flickering under daylight or outside at night? Even bad ground spiders shouldn't cause flickering. Baffled for the moment.

Outside at night, I usually ride during the day, when it's at idle it flickers when the throttle is rolled on it doesn't. I usually ride during the day that's why I haven't noticed it until now.

 

[ionbeam]

General purpose LEDs typically operate between 1.2 and 1.8 volts when 100% on. One trick to control the light output of a LED is to feed it a square wave. If the wave is faster than 60 cycles per second (Hz) you can't see the flicker. If the LEDs on the Gen II meter assemblies are being regulated by a slower square wave I would have expected to see this flickering mentioned before. This brings us back to checking the voltage at the battery posts and the switched ignition voltage while the display is flickering to see if it is low or unstable. Next steps dependent on these results.

Any other Gen II owners see flickering LEDs at night, at idle?

Edit: By all means, send me a ticket and I'll be on the next flight out with my oscilloscope. We will get this all sorted out and repaired as necessary.

 

[Dr. Jekyll]

General purpose LEDs typically operate between 1.2 and 1.8 volts when 100% on. One trick to control the light output of a LED is to feed it a square wave. If the wave is faster than 60 cycles per second (Hz) you can't see the flicker. If the LEDs on the Gen II meter assemblies are being regulated by a slower square wave I would have expected to see this flickering mentioned before. This brings us back to checking the voltage at the battery posts and the switched ignition voltage while the display is flickering to see if it is low or unstable. Next steps dependent on these results.

Any other Gen II owners see flickering LEDs at night, at idle?

Edit: By all means, send me a ticket and I'll be on the next flight out with my oscilloscope. We will get this all sorted out and repaired as necessary.

Holy crap my head just exploded! :blink:

I'll look into the voltage.

 

[Patriot]

ionbeam[/b]' timestamp='1298597467' post='831411']

Holy crap my head just exploded! :blink:

that happened first time I read an ionbeam post in this topic

I figured I'd stick it out as a member of this forum, so never did put the top of my skull back in place :lol:

 

[mcatrophy]

General purpose LEDs typically operate between 1.2 and 1.8 volts when 100% on. One trick to control the light output of a LED is to feed it a square wave. If the wave is faster than 60 cycles per second (Hz) you can't see the flicker. If the LEDs on the Gen II meter assemblies are being regulated by a slower square wave I would have expected to see this flickering mentioned before. This brings us back to checking the voltage at the battery posts and the switched ignition voltage while the display is flickering to see if it is low or unstable. Next steps dependent on these results.

Any other Gen II owners see flickering LEDs at night, at idle?

Edit: By all means, send me a ticket and I'll be on the next flight out with my oscilloscope. We will get this all sorted out and repaired as necessary.

Might we not be over-thinking this?

At idle, according to my voltmeter my battery voltage certainly varies rapidly.

LEDs, if driven simply by a series resistor from the ignition supply, will be receiving a similarly varying current, hence brightness. Although not as sensitive as incandescent lamps to their current, they are much more responsive in terms of a rapidly varying current. I can't see from the wiring diagram whether the LEDs are driven directly or from a stabilised supply.

I suspect the OP's symptoms may just be this, and he's not noticed before, either because his idle speed has changed a little or because the ambient lighting conditions have changed.

Let's be sure there really is a problem before encouraging him to start stripping the bike.

Just my 2p's worth.

 

[ionbeam]

...Any other Gen II owners see flickering LEDs at night, at idle?...

Might we not be over-thinking this?

At idle, according to my voltmeter my battery voltage certainly varies rapidly

Just my 2p's worth.

Yes, you are right. My last question should have been my first question.

mcatrophy, you have rapidly varying battery voltage, confirmed by your volt meter. Does your LED back-light flicker? Does your voltage flicker whole volts or just fractions of a volt?

 

[mcatrophy]

...

mcatrophy, you have rapidly varying battery voltage, confirmed by your volt meter. Does your LED back-light flicker? Does your voltage flicker whole volts or just fractions of a volt?

I haven't noticed backlight flicker, but I've not looked for it. Had I seen it, I probably would have dismissed it as irrelevant, knowing that the voltage inevitably varies when charging is marginal. I've certainly noticed light output varying on other vehicles under marginal charging conditions.

As for how much the voltage varies, it's very difficult to quantify with my voltmeter, recognising that it updates about 4 times a second, each reading being an average of 64 instantaneous readings taken during that period. The display indicates just a few tenths of a volt, I would guess it might be getting on for a volt peak to peak.

Even under moderate charging conditions the voltage isn't stable - but that's the subject of a NEPRT

.

It really needs an oscilloscope to get a true indication, unfortunately since my retirement I don't have easy access to one. I'll have to try to borrow one now the question has been raised.

Next time I start up, I'll certainly have a careful look at the display. If I notice anything, I might even try a video ...

 

[RadioHowie]

Next time I start up, I'll certainly have a careful look at the display. If I notice anything, I might even try a video ...

A video would be cool, but what FPS would you shoot it at?

If you shot at 23.976 frames per second, as opposed to 25 frames per second, (what you Limeys use) you might prevent the video from catching the flicker. However, if you've got access to an HD camera, shoot at 60 frames per second to avoid the FPS from syncing to, or hiding, the flicker...IF the flicker is occurring around 24 to 30 Flickers per second.

:blum:

 

[ionbeam]

Next time I start up, I'll certainly have a careful look at the display. If I notice anything, I might even try a video ...

A video would be cool, but what FPS would you shoot it at?

If you shot at 23.976 frames per second, as opposed to 25 frames per second, (what you Limeys use) you might prevent the video from catching the flicker. However, if you've got access to an HD camera, shoot at 60 frames per second to avoid the FPS from syncing to, or hiding, the flicker...IF the flicker is occurring around 24 to 30 Flickers per second.

Holy crap my head just exploded! :blink: