Gen II alternator output

[DaveD]

Hi - does the higher-output Gen II alternator put out more juice across the whole rev range, or is just capable of producing more at higher revs?

In other words, does it put out more at idle?

 

[Zorlac]

No

 

[Peter Murray]

Hi - does the higher-output Gen II alternator put out more juice across the whole rev range, or is just capable of producing more at higher revs?
In other words, does it put out more at idle?

The AC magneto standard output is 14.0 V , 590 W at 5000 R/min. This spec came from the service manual.

 

[SLK50]

It's likely consumption at idle is greater than the alternator output.

Just powering all the various lights uses over 20% of the alternator's peak output.

IOW, sufficient idle time could result in a depleted battery although I would suspect that's not likely to happen

as bikes are meant to be ridden. LOL

Short commutes with lots of stop and go traffic could reveal a weak battery. If that's the case, use a battery maintainer

when parked overnight, if possible.

 

[SkooterG]

It's likely consumption at idle is greater than the alternator output.
Just powering all the various lights uses over 20% of the alternator's peak output.

IOW, sufficient idle time could result in a depleted battery although I would suspect that's not likely to happen

as bikes are meant to be ridden. LOL

Short commutes with lots of stop and go traffic could reveal a weak battery. If that's the case, use a battery maintainer

when parked overnight, if possible.

That's not correct at all.

At idle, my datel is showing 13.8 - 14.2V. So there is more than enough electrical surplus and the bike can idle indefinitely. And I used to do short commutes/trips all the time with never a problem. And I only have a Gen I.

 

[ChrisW]

Hi - does the higher-output Gen II alternator put out more juice across the whole rev range, or is just capable of producing more at higher revs?
In other words, does it put out more at idle?

The gen II stator is a suitable replacement for the Gen I (non-ABS)? Does the stator cover need to be changed as well?

My original Gen I stator seems to be going downhill. I need to run the heat a little lower and leave the grips off altogether at night these days.

May have a week battery at this point as well. I'm going to replace both just to be safe. I'd like to have a couple more watts at operating rpm's.

Any input would be appreciated.

 

[Ignacio]

The gen II stator is a suitable replacement for the Gen I (non-ABS)? Does the stator cover need to be changed as well?

It's not just stator that would have to be replaced, but regulator & rectifier and other fairly expensive parts. It's been talked about before and either nobody has done it....or maybe one tried.

Most go with the Electrosport as a replacement stator.

 

[Bungie]

Most go with the Electrosport as a replacement stator.

AKA: Old Smoky

 

[SkooterG]

The gen II stator is a suitable replacement for the Gen I (non-ABS)? Does the stator cover need to be changed as well?

It's not just stator that would have to be replaced, but regulator & rectifier and other fairly expensive parts. It's been talked about before and either nobody has done it....or maybe one tried.

Most go with the Electrosport as a replacement stator.

Well, the first part of Iggy's response is correct. The part about some additional parts beyond the stator is correct. But it has been done before. By at least two Gen I owners that both ran their FJRs in the last (2009) Iron Butt Rally. One is Bob St. George who had a dealer do it during the 07 IBR when his electrical system (Electorsport Stator) gave up due to a crappy install. And I'll be damned if I can remember who the second guy is. Perhaps Derek Dickson from Minnesota?

So upgrading a Gen I to a Gen II stator is doable for a cost. I have thought about doing it myself. However I have one major fear that has stopped me. I can't help but wonder if all the electrical problems Gen II FJRs have had - specifically ignition switches going and the ground spyder blocks frying, are because of the Gen II's increased stator output. I really don't want to make my Gen I electrically unreliable so unfortnately, I don't think I'll be doing that upgrade. And I think my 223k mile FJR's original stator is just starting to show some drop-off also.

As for the Electrosport - if you buy it, know that it will fry in approximately 25-40k and you'll need to replace it again.

 

[ChrisW]

As for the Electrosport - if you buy it, know that it will fry in approximately 25-40k and you'll need to replace it again.

I think it ended up costing Bob around $12K to upgrade his electrical system to an 09.

I went the electrosport route on my VFR once. I certainly didn't get 25-40K out of it. It took a bunch of other stuff out with it. I won't be going down that route again.

Looks like I'll probably just do an OEM replacement, and do the battery at the same time. I've gotten by this long with the watts...

Thanks for the info guys.

 

[ChrisW]

Looks like I'll probably just do an OEM replacement, and do the battery at the same time.

Wow! $325 at bike bandit.

 

[SkooterG]

Looks like I'll probably just do an OEM replacement, and do the battery at the same time.

Wow! $325 at bike bandit.

Yup. It's a pricey mo-fo. For the best price, check Zanoti Motors.

 

[ChrisW]

The gen II stator is a suitable replacement for the Gen I (non-ABS)? Does the stator cover need to be changed as well?

It's not just stator that would have to be replaced, but regulator & rectifier and other fairly expensive parts. It's been talked about before and either nobody has done it....or maybe one tried.

I picked up an 07 stator, rotor, and reg/rec off e-bay the other night for about $250 shipped. Retail would have been about $1,100.

I contacted Bob. During the 07 IBR a dealer took all those parts off an 07 floor model and installed them on his 05. He mentioned the need to cut the wires on the old stator and buy a Yamaha connector. Not sure what that's about, but I guess I'll figure it out when the parts get here and I start pulling things apart.

I don't even remember where the R/R is on this thing. That's a good thing. My VFR had 3 stators, 4 R/R's, and 4 batteries by the time it got to the miles my FJR has on it. 88K right now.

I picked up a new OEM battery for it today too. I suspect the stator in it now is just fine, but the battery has had a hard life.

So, if anyone has a picture of a gen II R/R with it's connectors, I'd love to see it. :umnik:

 

[ChrisW]

I picked up an 07 stator, rotor, and reg/rec off e-bay the other night for about $250 shipped. Retail would have been about $1,100.

Trying to find a flywheel puller. Thoughts? Didn't even occur to me till I started piling the stuff up on the bench.

Motion pro didn't list the FJR, but the Yamaha part number for the tool shows up in a bunch of dirtbike related topics.

Looks like If I find one for the WR400 I should be good.

I'm pretty sure all the wires will be plug and play though.

 

[Zorlac]

Some pics of your adventure, if possible, would be most appreciated.

 

[ChrisW]

Some pics of your adventure, if possible, would be most appreciated.

I'll try to snap a few. I'm having a time trying to get the flywheel off without the proper tools. I'll try an impact wrench next.

Looks like I'm gonna have to dig in a little further than I expected too. There is a section of the wire harness with some significant chaffing down in the engine bay on the left side.

None of the wires appear to be damaged, but I'm going to want to repair the sheathing.

 

[dcarver]

Hi ChrisW - good project you have going.. tx for keeping us posted..

I'm not sure how valid this advice is - but one time I used a 3/8 impact and the lengthy continual hammering actually messed up the magnetic poles, and I had to buy a new piece. This was an XR600. I'm thinking hit it good and hard and *fast* then be outta there. With a 1/2" drive healthy impact wrench and pressure at 110 or so. Like I said, might have been a one-off case, I'm not a mekanic.

 

[ChrisW]

Hi ChrisW - good project you have going.. tx for keeping us posted.. I'm not sure how valid this advice is - but one time I used a 3/8 impact and the lengthy continual hammering actually messed up the magnetic poles, and I had to buy a new piece. This was an XR600. I'm thinking hit it good and hard and *fast* then be outta there. With a 1/2" drive healthy impact wrench and pressure at 110 or so. Like I said, might have been a one-off case, I'm not a mekanic.

Hey D, long time no see.

Thanks for the advice. The magnetic poles in the flywheel?

It's getting replaced but I was hoping to keep the old stuf in good shape should I ever need it.

I already had to cut the wire on the old R/R. I should be able to route the new one in alright, but it won't be the same path the other took.

Not sure what size the wrench will be. I need to go borrow if from my brother, but I'd be surprised if it wasn't a 1/2 inch.

The air is more of a concern. I'm going to borrow his portable pancake compressor. I think it will make 110 psi but probably not for long.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

I'm not sure how valid this advice is - but one time I used a 3/8 impact and the lengthy continual hammering actually messed up the magnetic poles, and I had to buy a new piece. This was an XR600. I'm thinking hit it good and hard and *fast* then be outta there. With a 1/2" drive healthy impact wrench and pressure at 110 or so. Like I said, might have been a one-off case, I'm not a mekanic.

Thanks for the advice. The magnetic poles in the flywheel?

'Struth..., the permanent magnets are susceptible to loss of power through repeated blows (realigns the molecular structure...).

Some of the Gen II's improved alternator power may come from improved permanent magnets? Many of the new 'rare earth' magnets are far superior to older permanent magnets and have helped bring alternator power up and size down.

(And, older magnet powered devices often need magnet re-energizing to help bring them up to full power.)

And..., the proper tool (read: puller) is important to success... :huh: