Group Rides

[red2kcbr]

I saw an invitation for a group ride, which was followed by a polite refusal. I'm not a fan of group riding either.

First, I'll define group as more than two bikes riding together. Two is not a group in my book. The reasons I don't care for group rides are hard to pin down. The few times I've done group rides (more than two bikes), there was a problem with pace and spacing. Then there are the differences in experience, which may have lead to the pacing and spacing problems.

I like to think I keep an intelligent pace, slow in neighborhoods and cities, and a bit more briskly in open country. When my son and I ride together, we have no issues keeping a reasonable pace. And I don't mean to say we are triple digits everywhere, but that we know when it's OK to go fast and when it's not. On a couple of our rides, a couple of his friends have come along. Later, my son told me that he won't be asking anyone along again. He had the same issues I did: pace, space, and placement.

Maybe we've just been riding together enough that we know how we will react to situations. I don't know. I was asked to join a group ride (mostly Harleys and 'wings) to Mena, AR. I've made that ride before. I just can't go that slow. No offense to Harley riders and most 'wingers, but I can't.

I'll stick to riding with him, or solo. I don't mean to be unsociable, but I don't feel comfortable riding with a group.

 

[evil_henchman]

I'm not one for group rides either. If I ride with one other rider, it's a group. Any more and it's a crowd, at least for me. To have a "successful" big group ride you have to have a pre ride meeting to set down rules and/or other "understandings" and the whole thing becomes too much like a parade. Not that that's a bad thing, just not my thing.

Dirt riding's another story. Total unrestrained hooliganism. Loads of fun for everybody unless you're stuck at the back of the pack eating dust :lol:

 

[RonBB]

I also normally politely decline group rides. I will ride with a group of 3-4 friends with whom I've ridden with individually & am comfortable with. I have ridden on the large group rides for charity and find the levels of experience and the differences in the bikes to be far too great for my comfort level. I don't do those rides anymore after seeing a 600cc Sport Bike riding on the rear wheel through a group of H-D going under the speed limit. I agree that the spacing & speed (either too slow or fast) are never quite right. I do however enjoy the fellowship at the final destination which is often a restraurant. I stay on the e-mail list of a group or two to know when & where the group will appear & then often time my arrival to be about when they arrive. I try to find a different route to get there. I enjoy the ride alone but the fellowship at the destination. I guess I just don't make a good duckling.

 

[Toecutter]

When I do commit to organizing a group ride, I figure I'm doing it as a service to the other riders, and sometimes I really push the limits of my serenity mantra doing so. In fact, on the WFO Big Dog ride I lost my patience after sweeping 15 miles the wrong direction and was about to bypass a turn to get back on track, almost causing an accident between two other riders scrambling to follow me. I guess I'm just not cut out for adult day care. I find it's impossible to lead and sweep a group of more than one, so I'll probably not be putting together any more randomly attended rides anytime soon.

Admins- please issue me a warning if I attempt to use the forum to initiate a group ride. :blink:

If I may offer a bit of advice to others wishing to ride in groups; Things would go a lot smoother if the leader and tailgunner are in radio contact.

Disclaimer- I have enjoyed the majority of every group ride I've been on so far and don't regret going on any of them. It's just that the margin of error is so small and the consequences can be so great.

 

[Randy]

Depends.

I enjoy solo rides and I enjoy group rides. I can turn it up to the best of my abilities or I can hang low, to an extent. If I'm with a cruiser crowd, I try to get up front, wick it up through the turns, then dial back to let them catch up in the straights.

If I'm on a long slab ride, no problem with groups. I prefer to lead.

When on a more hooligan type ride with a group, I usually prefer to ride sweep. Sometimes I'll go mid pack, but, I rarely lead. I don't want to set a pace that someone pushes to hard to keep up with and I don't want to be 'that guy' that holds someone up. I usually do these types of rides with people that are familiar with the way everyone rides and they know they can count on me to make sure no one gets left behind. If I'm sweep, I'll probably know if someone has problems. If I'm mid pack, I won't leave a stop sign until all behind me are present and accounted for.

 

[rontoride]

On Fridays WFO ride I got a late start and rode alone for 160 miles. Nice time, at my own pace. Coming down #50 from tahoe I met a rider (older like me) riding a valk six cyl. He said he lived near virginia city and would show me some twisties to test my skills????? Well, I followed him and I guess his ego got the best of him. After trying to leave me in the dust I was right there at the right distance behind him going up to VC when he blew two turns over the DD really bad. I backed off of him a long ways. I did not want to be the cause of him killing himself for no reason. Sat's ride was solo also up 49, 20, Kingsbury grade and was wonderful. Thank for a great time at wfo to all those who worked so hard to make it a huge success.

 

[TheAxeman]

I've just about given up on group riding for all of the reasons mentioned above. Historically my "group rides" have been with bikers who's main purpose on the ride was to get to the next bar or restaurant doing a wheelie. If we left early in the morning I would be riding with people nursing hangovers. So my choices were to go out and find a new bunch of friends or ride alone....so I ride alone. No agenda, no anxiety about somebody doing something stupid that is going to cause me to meet the pavement, and a ride is actually a ride, not a reason to go have a beer. The problem with riding alone is that when a group gathering is initiated (EOM, WFO, etc...) I tend to stay away because I know that they will mean groups of riders unfamiliar with each others styles riding technically challenging roads together. Almost a recipe for disaster it seems.

 

[chickey191]

group rides most often are a pain.

Others have stated many of the reasons - pace - distance - dependability - knowledge and confidence. Or lack of all the above.

That stated - the local shop in Fresno (Fresno BMW) used to have some pretty fair group rides. Here is how they did it.

first - maps were handed out. nothing dramatic - just a copied map with the route highlighted. Major turns were indicated - so everyone knew where they were going or could gander at the map for a quick update.

second - subgroups were formed. Fast guys out front - followed by a slower group - followed by newbies or slow riders.

3rd - an experienced or knowledgeable rider was posted with each of the slower groups (in case they got lost).

4th - the SOP for each group was that you ride your own pace. typcially after the first stop (which was within a few miles) folks would sort out where in their group they would ride - with slower riders to the rear.

5th - once in the mountains - when you came to an intersection you always either stopped or slowed until the next rider was in sight. Then you could leave and that rider would wait on the next. This way no one blew a turn or change in direction.

6th - rendezvous points were spelled out. -- each group would hold up at the rendezvous point until the bulk or large part of the following group showed up.

7th - lunch place was spelled out so that everyone could either bail out and meet there - catch up - or whatever. Anyway - you knew where most folks would end up for lunch or dinner or break.

8th - typically folks would peal off after the break on their own. Sometimes the ride would continue together, but most times folks would leave after tire kicking in the parking lot.

it was a pretty good way for a newcomer to find some tasty roads and no one really rode over their heads. It wasn't GWRRA type formation riding - rarely did anyone ride in the same lane or anything like that. Most folks learned to let someone who was pushing from behind to let them by. They would stick out a foot and pull to the shoulder to let them pass - leaving the slower riders to the rear.

9th - someone usually rode sweep.

Also - the rendezvous points and approximate times were posted for those who wanted to detour or take a different route.

It worked pretty well.

I used to ride with a GWRRA group which had some very good riders - and some less good. Other than the stopping all the time and the long breaks they took and a bunch of other stuff - I could never ride with them more than 1 hour without waving and leaving them. Nice folks, but not my style. I could never trust them after watching some do some seriously silly stuff. It is just too easy to either let testosterone take over or to follow a tail light off the road.

 

[dcarver]

My last group ride, prior to WFO Big Dog, ended up with 3 out of 5 riders killed in one accident. All by stupid decisons made by riders, not a cage. And they died hard too. All 3 riders were my friends. Think it over, select 3 of your best riding buddies, then re-read.

I swore off group riding after that. 'The best number of riders in a group is an odd number less than 2' has been my mantra since that incident, circa 1980.

Off to 2006. Hey - FJR owners are a bit older, hopefully a bit wiser. Much time has passed. I had no intention of 'staying' with the Big Dog group if *anything* made me nervous. My comfort zone is running solo.

Was very happy that our group of 8 only turned out to be a group of 4. Much easier. Our lead rider was the sportiest rider, and one of the other 3 found the pace, umm, a bit to brisk. I liked that pace and could run it safely, yet one rider, to his credit, slowed down and rode his own pace after finding it too fast. Seeing this, I decided to run sweep, the same position that led me to witnessing the death of buds in 1980. Think of the impact, the memories this had on me.

Yet, at the end of the day, all 4 riders made it back, safe and sound.

I'm especially proud of the rider who maintained his own pace, did not get sucked up into the moment, and for me too.. I faced and beat down some serious fears that day.

Thanks for listening, apologies for the diatribe.

BTW, I still prefer to ride solo.

 

[mdisher]

I too am becoming less and less fond of group rides as well.

I ride with my dad the most and to this day I still can't predict what the hell he's thinking or will do... Just when I *think* I have him figured out, he throws a curve in there.

It's definately more fun and arguably safer to ride with someone. There's visibility in pairs and it helps to have someone with you "just in case".

But respect the key word. Give each other room, blah, blah, blah.

The last thing I want is someone getting hurt trying to keep a pace they can't, and I am very familiar with trying to keep a pace I can't keep.

But...

Lead, follow or get the hell out of the way also comes to mind.

So yeah, I can take or leave group rides, mostly leave.

 

[Feejer/Weejer man]

There are many group rides scheduled in No. Ca. If you want to ride hard then group rides are a no no. If you want friendship, a nice lunch, maybe some afternoon ice cream, then these rides are great. Some of you need to stop and smell the roses, look around and see the scenery. Life and rides are enjoyable in many different ways. Not for everyone but not as bad as some describe. JMHO

 

[Toecutter]

...yet one rider, to his credit, slowed down and rode his own pace after finding it too fast...I'm especially proud of the rider who maintained his own pace, did not get sucked up into the moment...

My group had a rider who did the same thing. He seemed embarassed, but I was very proud of him, not letting his limitations take a back seat to testosterone, and happy to ride sweep behind a group travelling at a safe pace.
Thanks for sharing Don. It probably helped you a little to do it and it helped me to read it. Hopefully, it will have a lasting effect on a few of us.

 

[FlyingLow]

Good fucking grief!

This is the sort of thing that can run a person out of the hobby forever, and understandably so.

Carver, no one should ever have to bear witness to something like that. Amazing kudos to you for re-evaluating and getting back in it.

Myself, I like road trips of 2 or 3 or 4 bikes total, as long as you know and trust the guys you're with. Flying single squad is good, too, as you call all the shots and it's all you.

A recent Cycle World column, by Edwards I think, touches on this. "Ride your own bike, not someone elses".

And ride safe.

My last group ride, prior to WFO Big Dog, ended up with 3 out of 5 riders killed in one accident. All by stupid decisons made by riders, not a cage. And they died hard too. All 3 riders were my friends. Think it over, select 3 of your best riding buddies, then re-read.
I swore off group riding after that. 'The best number of riders in a group is an odd number less than 2' has been my mantra since that incident, circa 1980.

Off to 2006. Hey - FJR owners are a bit older, hopefully a bit wiser. Much time has passed. I had no intention of 'staying' with the Big Dog group if *anything* made me nervous. My comfort zone is running solo.

Was very happy that our group of 8 only turned out to be a group of 4. Much easier. Our lead rider was the sportiest rider, and one of the other 3 found the pace, umm, a bit to brisk. I liked that pace and could run it safely, yet one rider, to his credit, slowed down and rode his own pace after finding it too fast. Seeing this, I decided to run sweep, the same position that led me to witnessing the death of buds in 1980. Think of the impact, the memories this had on me.

Yet, at the end of the day, all 4 riders made it back, safe and sound.

I'm especially proud of the rider who maintained his own pace, did not get sucked up into the moment, and for me too.. I faced and beat down some serious fears that day.

Thanks for listening, apologies for the diatribe.

BTW, I still prefer to ride solo.

 

[OrangevaleFJR]

I like the social part of the group ride. Sometimes by riding with groups I learn things by watching other riders and discussing things with them.

There are certainly times in group rides that I don't enjoy myself. I have learned at those times to just let the gas off a bit and be patient.

I'll continue group rides and I have to say that each ride at WFO was with a group of idividuals that rode their own ride. I prefer riding with groups that are mostly made up of people I know, but I like to meet new people too.

I do plenty of solo riding, or solo 2up. I like to meet new people and have seen having more than one person around be a godsend:

If he hadn't hit that sharp rock, I might have :lol:

 

[Penforhire]

I go on monthly group rides (So Cal M/C Assoc. club rides, sc-ma.com). But I'm not sure they count as "group rides." We're a big group in the starting and ending parking lots but on the ride it is usually just me and one or two riding buddies (AutoCom-linked). We ride at our own pace with a given route and checkpoints (often a "poker run"). The mix of bikes is broad, probably more 'Wings than any other single model.

I hate long strings of bikes. Very rude. There is one group of 'Wings, about six, that seem to ride together and another similar group of hogs. Otherwise we seem to break down into 2-3 riders.

Is this group riding?

I've been out on a couple of Ducati club rides (friends own Ducs, not me) and they are definitely one (or two) long string of bikes. Even though they're not exactly slow I still think it rude.

 

[sparky3008]

In the past I have done group rides with Cruisers for things like Toys for Tots and for as many bikes that were all jammed together it really wasn't bad. On these rides it really isn't a speed or cornering thing, more of a watch out for the guy in front of you jamming on his brakes thing.

That type of ride isn't too bad.

I don't ride fast on the street. Now that I have a sport bike my Harley friends don't really ride with me and all of the group rides from forums seem to be either noob rides, which are dangerous in their own for obvious reasons. Or, the other group is of guys who are actually track guys and are going out to tear up the back roads.

Neither of which I want to do.

So I have a few friends I ride dirt with that I will ride street with and they know I am not out to challenge their abilities and just want to enjoy their company riding and it is always fun for me at least.

If it is pushing your nerve it is too fast and one moment of not paying attention or your mind wondering because you are over your comfort zone and it could spell disaster. You might be technically able to ride that fast but if your mind is in the wrong place slow down, be safe and go home in one piece...

Have fun out there...

 

[Groo]

I've got distinctly mixed feelings about group rides (meaning a group of 2-5 riders, not a toy/charity run....which I can't stand). In once sense, it's fun being with other riders of similar or better experience and capability... like following Ovale's lead on our Saturday ride at WFO. He knows the corners, was setting great entry speeds, and I got to feed off that and get into a great cornering "zone".

But I've also been in groups where the riders were of differing abilities, and got into the mentality that my ride was being negatively affected by others riding what I considered too fast, too slow, too carelessly, or too dangerously. In those cases, I'd have just as soon been on my own.

Bottom line, I guess for me, group riding takes a bit of luck, to find people of similar riding skill and desire. And when you find those folks, you hope they feel the same way about you.

 

[JimLor]

I too prefer solo rides, alone or with Lorie (still one bike!). I did a charity Poker run last year with about 100 HDs and if I ever even think about it again I've given Lorie an envelope to open that says, "Kill me, kill me now!" In Mar this year 11 of us from the forum (9 bikes) met in Waynesboro, VA and did a "sweet" ride into WV and back. I rode either last or close to it because Lorie and I hadn't ridden together for a while and she sometimes has vertigo issues in mountains (last weekend on the BRP she'd close the eye on the side where the dropoffs were!). Nice day and toophast did a great job leading us. Had I been alone with Lorie we'd have probably taken it a little easier, but it was a very enjoyable day with nice folks.

Lorie and I did our first overnighter on the bike this past weekend and had a really great time. I started the trip by calming myself down and saying this will take as long as it takes. I'm a retired Marine (artillery) and can be demanding when it comes to leaving on time and getting where I'm going on time. Putting that aside and concentrating on the ride was just great! I had the best ride with Lorie - both days - that I've ever had! I really enjoyed riding with her. Of course she did mention that whenever other bikes were near I'd tense up (the hunter instinct!) - but I was able to "let it go." B)

I reckon my point is that I don't like the "pressure" to keep up with a group and I also don't like not knowing the skill levels of the folks I'm riding with. I agree that a leader can feel pressure to "go fast" and folks behind feel pressure to "keep up." I think the key in a group ride is to talk it out completely before you ever put ass to seat - a "convoy brief." That way everyone knows what to expect and can agree or opt out and ride alone - or form another group.

 

[radman]

I've got distinctly mixed feelings about group rides (meaning a group of 2-5 riders, not a toy/charity run....which I can't stand). In once sense, it's fun being with other riders of similar or better experience and capability... like following Ovale's lead on our Saturday ride at WFO. He knows the corners, was setting great entry speeds, and I got to feed off that and get into a great cornering "zone".
But I've also been in groups where the riders were of differing abilities, and got into the mentality that my ride was being negatively affected by others riding what I considered too fast, too slow, too carelessly, or too dangerously. In those cases, I'd have just as soon been on my own.

Bottom line, I guess for me, group riding takes a bit of luck, to find people of similar riding skill and desire. And when you find those folks, you hope they feel the same way about you.

I'm with Groo all the way. Sat ride was about as good as it gets, good pace, minimum racing (which is fun, but not every damn ride), a ride to make group haters reconsider. I also like loner rides for all the reasons stated, but with a group like we had, one could be convinced otherwise.