ignition disabler "chip key"

[Nanahanman]

I just bought a 2006 1300 with the ignition disabler system that requires a chip key.

As I understand it, this is a European and Canadian addition that those in the US don't have.

There is a red coding key that comes with the ECU ( I don't have one) and that allows the ECU to be coded to the ignition key.(Really!?!?)

Not, as in cars, where the key coded to the ECU.

This poses 2 problems. The first is that you can't have 2 keys coded to the same bike at the same time, allowing for a "spare" to be available.

Second, as I don't have the "red" key, if I loose the keys, I have to purchase a new ECU at substantial cost as Yamaha can't sell me a replacement "red" key.

If I were to loose my keys in somewhere Alaska while on tour, I'm screwed!

All this info came from a reputable dealer who called the Yamaha rep while I was at the shop.

OK, and now the questions.

1 -Is this information correct?

2 -Can the ECU be "hacked" to defeat the ignition disabler?

Around here, they don't steal bikes by starting your bike a driving away, they pick them up and put them on trucks.

 

[iboldguy]

I have the same model, your info is mostly correct. However I have two 'black' keys and one 'red' key to my bike. When I got the bike I was handed the red key separately and told never lose this or it will be really expensive to replace the ECU. I guess the idea is that you hope a knowledgeable thief spots the bike and realizes it wll cost him to start it - stripping it is another matter.

 

[@rjen]

Correct on the two black keys. You can have two black keys coded at the same time (but no more than two!), wether the keys are coded to the EU or vice versa I do not know, but you need the red key to perform the coding sequence. If you are missing the red key, you may have a challenge, but fear not: there are ways:

At least in holland, this company offers a service to create / program a new red key. The only thing you need to do is send them the ECU and the keys...

https://www.carmo.nl/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=4106&sort=20a&language=en

Should be possible in other parts of the world, right?

 

[Chuck35]

I wonder if you could install a USA ecu and be done with it?

 

[Queensland Ken]

You can get a key copied, they can code the chip.

However you need a proper "master" key to reprogram the ECU if you loose a black key.

You can disable the lost key by reprogramming the spare black one.

Even if someone finds your black key and tried to start the bike, the ignition will turn but nothing happens.

 

[mingo]

To the OP, the info is correct. I purchased a Gen 3 FJR and the dealer went to great lengths to explain how important the red key is and how it's used to program new keys.

I never understood why Yamaha removes the immoblizer from US bikes??

 

[str8]

I think anti-theft devices have been law in Canada since 2007. USA does not have this law. This is where you can run into problems importing a new bike from the states. Some vehicle inspectors in Canada might catch it, some might not.

 

[Queensland Ken]

Funny thing here in Australia.

Most police forces from the various states put their FJR's up for auction after about 2 years.

Soo many are sold without their red keys, a lot of buyers get stung.

I was talking to a few dealers here and they will not trade on an ex-cop bike and offer $3,500 less on a fjr without the red key.

It costs $3,500 to have the ECU and locks changed on the bike, mind you we get totally ripped off here on spare parts.

Even to have the high altitude surge fix performed, in January, the dealer needed the master key to reprogram the ECU / immobiliser.

 

[Nanahanman]

You can get a key copied, they can code the chip.However you need a proper "master" key to reprogram the ECU if you loose a black key.

You can disable the lost key by reprogramming the spare black one.

Even if someone finds your black key and tried to start the bike, the ignition will turn but nothing happens.

As I understand, that is correct.

However, I want to know if there can be 2 keys that will work on the bike at the same time.

As I don't have a red key, I am in a bind.

Will be calling the dealer that sold the bike to the PO.

 

[Donal]

You can get a key copied, they can code the chip.However you need a proper "master" key to reprogram the ECU if you loose a black key.

You can disable the lost key by reprogramming the spare black one.

Even if someone finds your black key and tried to start the bike, the ignition will turn but nothing happens.

As I understand, that is correct.

However, I want to know if there can be 2 keys that will work on the bike at the same time.

As I don't have a red key, I am in a bind.

Will be calling the dealer that sold the bike to the PO.

The simple answer is yes. Bikes (in the UK) are supplied with 2 black keys and one red key.

 

[Queensland Ken]

As I understand, that is correct.However, I want to know if there can be 2 keys that will work on the bike at the same time.

As I don't have a red key, I am in a bind.

Will be calling the dealer that sold the bike to the PO.

All 3 keys will work, the red master and the 2 blacks.

It means that someone could very well start your bike with the missing master key.

Apart from reprogramming the ecu, say after getting it replaced like I did, the altitude surge fix, I haven't heard of anyone needing it to reprogram other keys to the immobiliser.

You are supposed to keep the master safe. A few people know where I keep mine, just in case I'm on a tour somewhere.

 

[Nanahanman]

So I did a bit more digging and found a post from a guy in Australia that had the key code copied onto another chip key (or fob)

I called my local locksmith and he thinks it can be done.

As it's not the Yamaha key that is used, I might end up with a fob or chip key that will need to be on a key chain with the non chip copy of the original key.

As chance would have it, he had just attended a locksmith conference that addressed motorcycle systems.

Will post results.

 

[Queensland Ken]

Yep, you can get the chip code coppied as such but it can't act as a master.

Not that I wouldn't think you would ever need it, touch wood.

Most good automotive locksmiths have the device.

 

[str8]

Interesting. So you're saying I can get the key code copied onto another device, even though it is not an actual key. I could then attach said device on the bike, hidden, somewhere near the ignition and I could use any old key that was cut to match the existing key?

This might not be a bad idea, as I am always worried that on a road trip my key could some how inadvertently get its code erased. The FRJ owners manual recommends keeping these keys away from things like strong magnets, probably like the kind that attach a lot of tank bags.

 

[Nanahanman]

SOLVED!...for under $80

The locksmith was able to read the chip code from my original Yamaha , black, ignition key then "burn" that data onto a "fob".

As long as the fob is on the ring with the new, non chip key copy, the bike ECU recognises it and will start.

Done and tested.

$20 for the key to be cut and $50 for the fob.

Thanks Yamaha for not knowing or telling me this.

 

[fossilrider]

Sure is nice to have a Gen 1 without all these issues.

 

[wfooshee]

To be fair, it's not Yamaha's job to know what's available to the locksmith aftermarket.

Personally, not having the red key to deliver with the bike would be a dealbreaker. "No red key? Then I need 2,000 off your price to pay for the stuff I'll have to replace someday."

 

[Queensland Ken]

SOLVED!...for under $80

That's good news, I think they charge about $100 here to copy it.

This might not be a bad idea, as I am always worried that on a road trip my key could some how inadvertently get its code erased.

I have a few friends that know where I keep the master key, just in case I'm on a road trip. Wouldn't even think about taking it with me.

Mind you I have never heard of any one needing it.

My mate, new to the FJR, was using his red key until a dealer "told him off"

Sure is nice to have a Gen 1 without all these issues.

In Australia Gen 1 bikes do have an immobiliser, all bar the 2001 I think ?

 

[Nanahanman]

To be fair, it's not Yamaha's job to know what's available to the locksmith aftermarket.
Personally, not having the red key to deliver with the bike would be a dealbreaker. "No red key? Then I need 2,000 off your price to pay for the stuff I'll have to replace someday."

That sounds reasonable.

However, that pre supposes that I knew there was such a thing and understood how it worked.

I did quite a bit of reading of reviews and problem that owners posted about this model year and learned of a few things to look out for but didn't see anything pertaining to this anti theft system.

Not one mention.

This is the first bike I have ever purchased that had an ignition disabler ( and I have purchased quite a few) and I knew nothing about the Red Key.

Coding the ECU to the key and requiring the Master Key , in my opinion, is a clumsy way to achieve the results.

It seems an odd way to code ignitions considering the car industry is the opposite.

Can you imagine if they did it this way for cars?!

There would be a bunch of lost red keys hiding in that place where those single socks go and the screws you drop and seem to vanish

Anyway, all good now.

Live and learn.