Lost the headlights this morning 07 FJR

[bajaleo]

Update: Today I removed and inspected all remaining spiders. No burning or black marks on any spiders or connectors. Only the S8 spider and connector had some corrosion. I applied carbon conductive grease to all spiders and reconnected them. I also checked coupler 3 and it looked fine.

I started the bike and had working headlights! Yay!

I'm not getting too excited yet, as I had working headlights after replacing the headlight relay, which I initially thought had failed, and the following morning I had NO headlights again. Now I'm not so sure that the relay was my problem.

If I get the bike put back together tonight, I plan to ride to work tomorrow morning (5:30 a.m.), assuming I have headlights.

More to come.

Thanks everyone,

Leo

 

[bajaleo]

Update: Sunday, after having working headlights, I started to reassemble the bike. I stopped after attaching each part to start the bike and check for working headlights.

All was fine until I began to install the left side lower fairing. I loosely hung the panel with one plastic rivet and one screw.

I started the bike, and NO headlights. WTF? I then shook the loosely attached panel and the lights came on. Aha! Loose connection somewhere. Off came the panel. Started the bike and shook the $hit out of all the connectors to try to get a headlight flicker but no luck. By then I was sick and tired of working on the bike and went to bed.

Last night I got after it again. Started the bike and got headlights, preceeded by a flicker. Turned the bike off, restarted and NO headlights. Shook all the connectors and couldn't get them to come on.

Going to try to look at them again tonight.

Is it time for me to start testing wires with a meter?

Any advice how to start this process or any advice in general? Is there something I'm missing?

Thanks,

Leo

Still not riding.

 

[bajaleo]

Forgort to mention that while I was twisting and turning wiring and connectors, I also started banging on the nose of the fairing and was able to get the lights to flicker and come on.

 

[ionbeam]

I didn't see any mention of the mileage on the bike. I have helped troubleshoot several >50k mile Gen II FJRs with radiator fan and headlight problems that turned out to be a wiring problem. At the high current pin of the headlight/fan relay the wires inside the insulator sleeve were burned right where it went into the socket. The wires looked acceptable from the outside but when checked with a meter while under load showed the problem. The fan/light problem usually started out being intermittent. If you get to the bottom of the barrel with your troubleshooting do consider this as a possible cause.

 

[SLK50]

From all indications, my money's on the spider behind

the left front turn signal.

 

[RossKean]

From all indications, my money's on the spider behindthe left front turn signal.

I agree that one is a fairly likely candidate or possibly the connector I had trouble with - https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/158418-itsy-bitsy-spider/?hl=itsy . I am, however, a little puzzled with the lack of other symptoms. In most cases, a spider bite (or other grounding issue) results in multiple oddities such as on-but-dim high beam indicator, turn signal indicators both on (but dim), windshield retract problems, non-functioning horn etc. A poor or intermittent power connection somewhere as opposed to a toasted ground return seems to be a better fit for what the OP has observed. Anyway, I will be interested to see the final cause (and fix).

 

[bajaleo]

RossKean, SLK50,

I wish that I had found that spider burned, but it looked fine. And as per my previous posts, all spiders have been checked and are coated with conductive grease.

I didn't see any mention of the mileage on the bike. I have helped troubleshoot several >50k mile Gen II FJRs with radiator fan and headlight problems that turned out to be a wiring problem. At the high current pin of the headlight/fan relay the wires inside the insulator sleeve were burned right where it went into the socket. The wires looked acceptable from the outside but when checked with a meter while under load showed the problem. The fan/light problem usually started out being intermittent. If you get to the bottom of the barrel with your troubleshooting do consider this as a possible cause.

ionbeam, the bike has 42k miles on it. I will be checking these relay sockets. Thanks for the tip.

Still not riding, and pissed about it.

Leo

 

[SLK50]

Bajaleo, I had bad contact for one wire to the spider clip.

"Playing" with the spider would cause the headlights to go

on and off. I could restore power for awhile but it would

eventually quit again.

I permanently fixed it by cutting out the spider and soldering

all the wires together.

Before you finish buttoning up your bike take another long

look at that spider before ruling it out.

 

[bajaleo]

Thanks SLK, good advice.

OK! I spent the last hour removing the tupperware and loosening the fairing. I didn't take it completely off, just lifted it up and out with some tie downs hooked to the garage door. I started twisting and shakin' all over, and I think I found my problem.

This connector was forward of the battery. Not sure what all goes through it, but I'll bet the burnt has something to do with the headlights.

How to proceed with a repair?

Leo

 

[mcatrophy]

...

This connector was forward of the battery. Not sure what all goes through it, but I'll bet the burnt has something to do with the headlights.

How to proceed with a repair?

Leo

Looks like the feed to the headlight dip relay.

You'll never repair the connector without replacing the inserts, I doubt you could easily get them. In any case the copper of the wire will be burnt and probably wouldn't re-crimp satisfactorily.

I'd put the connector back together, strip insulation from the wire either side, solder a wire from one to the other, tape it up. If it needs undoing again, cut and re-solder. I'd avoid crimp-on splicers, particularly with the relatively high current of the headlights.

There will be those who say solder will go crystalline with the vibration. Not my experience.

 

[ionbeam]

Looks like the feed to the headlight dip relay.
You'll never repair the connector without replacing the inserts, I doubt you could easily get them. In any case the copper of the wire will be burnt and probably wouldn't re-crimp satisfactorily.

I'd put the connector back together, strip insulation from the wire either side, solder a wire from one to the other, tape it up....

This is what I was trying to say about the wire being damaged inside the insulation. Mcatrophy offers a good fix for the burned connection. You may be able to find a new connector and pins at Eastern Beaver but you would still have to cut back the wires until you find good copper. Several of the people with burned fan/headlight relays 'fixed' their problems just as Mcatrophy details.

 

[HotRodZilla]

Ok...That's not a spider. What the Hell causes that??

 

[Niehart]

The first thing I would do is check with the Yamaha dealer and see if that is covered under the spider recall.

 

[Fred W]

That is "Coupler 5". The green wire that is scorched is the wire that runs 12V power from the output side of the headlight on/off relay to the headlight dimmer (high/low) relay. The only things that wire should be powering would be the two headlights and the high beam indicator in the instrument cluster. (unless someone tapped into one of the headlight wires for some added farkles?)

The reason that connector would over heat is either the load (current) through the pin was excessive for the contact area, or the contact's resistance was too high, resulting in excessive heat at the normal load current. On high beams (worst case) you would be drawing just over 110 Watts of power to the headlights, so about 8 amps of current running through that little contact. That is why people advise never just tapping into these wires for added lighting or other farkles. The connectors are already carrying a lot of current for their pin sizes.

Using a bypass wire, as previously described by mcatrophy, would seem to be the most reliable way to fix this. You could add an electrical connector in your bypass wire to retain the ability to disconnect the connection, should the need arise, but that would be adding another potential future failure point, and honestly the need to disconnect is pretty unlikely. Probably better off just keeping it simple and soldering the wire around the connector like already advised.

 

[RossKean]

+1

When the ground failed in my "Coupler 3", I cut the wires off back to good copper and soldered a bridge wire across the coupler. Unless you can get the right pin/socket, this is your best solution. Even if you have them, you would still have to splice in a short length of wire since you would have to cut off some to get back to unburned copper - Yamaha doesn't seem to leave any extra.

It's nice when you find an actual "smoking gun" that can be fixed rather than wonder if it's going to come back!

 

[bajaleo]

That is "Coupler 5". The green wire that is scorched is the wire that runs 12V power from the output side of the headlight on/off relay to the headlight dimmer (high/low) relay. The only things that wire should be powering would be the two headlights and the high beam indicator in the instrument cluster. (unless someone tapped into one of the headlight wires for some added farkles?)That is why people advise never just tapping into these wires for added lighting or other farkles. The connectors are already carrying a lot of current for their pin sizes.

Nothing tapped into this wire.

All I can think of is that:

A: I generally commute on this bike every day. On my way home in the afternoon, while lane sharing on the I5 in traffic, I turn on my high beams for added visibility. I leave them on until I get out of traffic, sometimes 20 minutes or so.

Should running my high beams for this amount of time each day be a problem?

And B: The bike has lived near the beach for the last 3-1/2 years, although always in the garage overnight. I have not noticed any excess corrosion anywhere on the bike.

Another question. Shouldn't I bypass the connector completely for that run of wire? I don't think I want any current going through that pin pair anymore.

On a related topic, I am following the thread regarding led replacement headlight bulbs.

https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/162439-led-4-emitter-h4-buy/

At the moment, the reduced wattage required is appealling to me!

Thanks for all the help guys.

Leo

 

[Intech]

The wiring is rated to carry the full load which is high beams, so how long you run them doesn't matter. However, running at the higher current means there is more potential to find a corroded or faulty connection.

On the bypass, unless I read it wrong, I think the suggestion is a complete bypass of the faulty connection to where good copper is found. Even if you didn't the current would take the path of least resistance, which would be the bypass.

 

[Harald]

It's nice when you find an actual "smoking gun" that can be fixed rather than wonder if it's going to come back!

Amen to that! I fix electronic gizmos for a living and hate sending something out for service unless I've found that "smoking gun" or at least a "smoldering gun."

Looks like the problem was finally found after persistence in troubleshooting.

 

[RossKean]

Not much difference in wattage between the high and low beams. On an H4, one filament or the other is on and the geometry of the beam is a function of the filament position and the shield in the bulb. In short, the use of the high beam should make no difference.

 

[bajaleo]

Last night I bypassed the connector with a short piece of wire and reassembled the bike. It might be my imagination, but the headlights seemed brighter to me. Best of all, I was able to ride in to work this morning.

My original post was on February 13, and today is March 26 so for the last 41 days or so I've been trying to solve this issue.

Many thanks for all the help guys.

I'm riding now!

Leo

P.S. A little part of me wanted it to be a bad spider so I could put that cool ground spider graphic in my signature. Maybe I should be careful what I ask for!