Musings of an aging FJR rider

[jmdaniel]

Here is a picture taken on the Million Dollar Highway in Colorado this past July:


On the left, my 68 year old father and on the right my 44 year old cousin. Take note, the younger and stronger man is on the GoldWing. Let me also mention we never ran off and left that GoldWing on any trip, ever. It handles well enough to keep up with our "Vacation Speed".

The first thing on my mind here is that there is absolutely no shame in riding a GoldWing. That bike is still in a class of its own, even with the BMW K1600GTL in the picture. Everybody, even non-riders know what a GoldWing is and they all recognize the prestige and cost of this wonderful motorcycle. It is really the Gold Standard by which other touring bikes are judged. Comfort is obviously fantastic but don't think that the big Honda is slow. It is faster than almost any car sold in the U.S in the 1/4 mile and it handles better than you would ever think.

As others have noted, if it falls over... It does weigh about 900 pounds and a tip-over is difficult. But, it does not fall over as far as an FJR.

I will not get into how a man should treat his wife or where her wants should fall in comparison to her husband's. That is a decision best left to each of you. I do things all the time that I know are going to irritate my wife BUT... I believe in the philosophy, Happy Wife, Happy Life.

Mrs. Redfish will not ride on a motorcycle. She just will not. I had her sit on the back of that white Hondapotamous in that picture on Labor Day. She said it was nice but refused to ride it. Completely uninterested. But... If my wife were willing to ride with me and I thought we could share just one motorcycle trip a year, there is not much I would not do to make her happy. I would buy a GoldWing so fast it would make your head spin just watching me run to the Honda dealer. In fact, if she were more comfortable, I would buy a damned Harley Davidson. Yes, I said it. If my wife would ride with me and that is what she wanted, I would happily put a big Electra Glide in my garage.

I hate to say it but I would rather bank on the proven reliability of the 'Wing than gamble on the BMW. I am sure it is a great bike and I am sure many of the issues are internet exaggerations. However, there is only one king. That is the GoldWing.

Great pic, Redfish. And I'm not saying that just because there is an '07A in it.

Came across this thread when searching for F6B. You see, I have been mulling over making a change. Not because my FJR is letting me down; except for the buzz in the bars, it's been a great bike. I sat on a F6B at the MotoGP here in Austin last year, and have had one in the back of my mind ever since. I'm 54, and the wife does NOT ride, so some of the factors mentioned as reasons to move to a GW don't apply, but still can't get that bike out of my mind. Two bikes aren't something I want to do, and my '07 won't bring much, so maybe that will keep the F6B out of reach, but I do like 'em...

 

[owsley]

I agree with the others. Get the wing, keep the FJR, best of both worlds, solo, and togetherness.

 

[LagerHead]

Do what you have to do and enjoy life. Ego is a young mans folly.

I've never heard it put so succinctly, but I echo the sentiment wholeheartedly. I know my Gold Wing days are coming, and while I am not exactly looking forward to giving up my FJR, I know I won't always be able to push the limits the way I do now. When the Wing days come, I will welcome them, because I would rather ride a Wing than not ride, and that's basically the point you are at now. Get the Wing. Enjoy the wing. Ride, ride, ride. Really it sounds like you're at the point you just need someone to help validate what you surely already know. Just be sure to wave and keep us in mind out there on the highways.

 

[David Foley]

Mrs. Redfish will not ride on a motorcycle. She just will not. I had her sit on the back of that white Hondapotamous in that picture on Labor Day. She said it was nice but refused to ride it. Completely uninterested. But... If my wife were willing to ride with me and I thought we could share just one motorcycle trip a year, there is not much I would not do to make her happy. I would buy a GoldWing so fast it would make your head spin just watching me run to the Honda dealer. In fact, if she were more comfortable, I would buy a damned Harley Davidson. Yes, I said it. If my wife would ride with me and that is what she wanted, I would happily put a big Electra Glide in my garage.

I share the same problem RFH - the only bike that really interests her is the K1600 GTL Exclusive. Love the bike but, can't see riding around with arm-rests and a top-case, the 98% of the time I'm 1 up. Still looking - she also kinda likes the new Harley Ultra Limited - but not enough fortunately

 

[bergmen]

Sports and activities don't kill people, the participants do that. People think that flying, sport parachuting, motorcycling (all of which I have participated in, some more than others), etc. are dangerous. They are only as dangerous as the people engaged. Sport parachutists kill themselves, the sport does not. That is why statistcs are basically worthless when determing the "safety or danger" of a particular activity. It's up to the individual.

Dan

 

[rwortman]

Interesting. I am 57 and just sold a VFR for my "old man's bike" FJR. I don't see age and a GW having anything to do with each other. Either you like the big "full dressers" or you don't. I know some 70 and 80 something riders and none ride a Wing. Usually a fairly lightweight cruiser or ADV bike for the upright posture. A rare few ride sportbikes. The old guys I know that ride Wings and FLH's were riding them all along. I remember a Peter Egan column years ago wherein he started out on a trip riding his fairly new Road King. He had tweaked his back a few days before. The upright position was hurting his back so bad he went back and switched for his BMW sport touring bike (I forget which) and found the slight lean forward stretched is spine a bit and made the long ride possible. If you have back trouble, it is not a given that bolt upright will be more comfortable.

As far as danger goes, there are some sports that are more dangerous than others. To believe otherwise is delusion. Stuff can happen to you on the road that is out of your control that can kill you on a bike that would be survivable in a car. This is from a person that believes that most motorcycle accidents were avoidable by the rider. Some aren't. A deer can bolt out of the woods next to the road at a dead run and you have no chance to avoid it. Parachutes can fail. If you never jump out of a plane, that can't happen to you. Skiers get maimed and killed, snow shoers not so much.

 

[Bill Lumberg]

I must admit- as guy who is both in his late 40's and who is about to switch bikes, it's a dilemma. At some point, I find storage capacity/bags and creature comforts/2 up comfort occupying more of my decision making process than road performance. It's not what you ride, it's that you ride.

Eight years ago, I bought my first FJR, a brand new 2005 model. I had a number of great rides on that bike. I loved it so much that after 42,000 miles (and one Iron Butt SS1000 certificate) I could not resist the temptation to trade it for the 2013 model that now sits in my garage after a 3500 mile solo round trip to the West Coast. I got heat exhaustion on the way back in southern Arizona, thank you. It was my fault of course in a hostile environment that left little margin for error. That did not make me feel any younger or smarter.
I was 48 in 2005. I'm 56 now. I am in good overall health, and I try to work out regularly, but I am fighting a set of bad genes. Orthopedic and weight issues haunt my family, so I am swimming upstream. Time is not on my side. I am wiser than I was in 2005, thanks to many chronic errors in thinking that I have worked hard to correct. I am starting to feel my age physically and mentally despite my efforts to push back with diet and exercise.

Then there's my wife. God bless her. I love her so. She learned to ride (I mean got her license) back in 2011. She has a bike but her attitude toward riding is more one of fear than respect for the process and the machine. She sees riding as something we can do "together" not a sport or hobby she wants to pursue on her own. She likes to ride but it makes her (and me) extremely anxious. She's a great partner but it exhausts me to take her riding, with me on my bike and she on hers. We do much better two up, but not on the FJR. We have been on two trips together on the 2005 FJR. They did not go very well. Comfort issues predominated for her. She is 2 years younger than I am and while she has a far better gene pool to work with, she does not exercise at all.

Back in 2010, we flew to Phoenix, rented a Gold Wing and rode to the Grand Canyon, Zion NP etc. We had a glorious time. I loved the Gold Wing for all the reasons people love Gold Wings, she loved how comfortable, roomy and user friendly it was. It stuck with us, but I had it in mind that I could not, would not, give up my FJR. I don't want more than one bike. I did that and it's too much hassle. Several years ago, in a nod toward the conceit that I could remain young forever, I had two bikes. The other one was a Honda Blackbird. Fun yes, but a step in the opposite direction of the one I am now pondering.

You see where this is headed. I am toying with the idea of selling my nearly new FJR (now with 5,000 miles on the odo), selling her bike, and getting a true touring bike for us to use, be it Gold Wing, Victory or dare I say, K1600GTL. The obvious choice would be a Wing, Comfort and togetherness with the wife instead of storming around the nation solo on an FJR, in other words.

I fear I am thinking too hard about this, but I tend to see the FJR as a proxy for my desire to remain a "young man." It does everything you could ask of a motorcycle but on the long haul trips, however, between the riding position, the wind protection, and the tendency to break all speed limit laws, I sometimes just want a bike that is oriented more toward comfort and calm. I have added Heli Bars, a tall Cee Bailey wind shield, and a Corbin touring saddle. The recent trip out west took it out of me. I averaged 575 miles a day, which may be nothing to some of you (younger) guys but it's a stretch for me anymore.

I don't know why I am agonizing so much over this. I like taking my wife two up on Gold Wing, but I won't do it anymore on an FJR. She is simply not going to ride her bike anywhere long distance and I don't want to get into trailering two bikes somewhere just so she can ride her bike timidly and make me a nervous wreck at 8,000 feet somewhere in Colorado. I do want to spend more time with her on a motorcycle just not on an FJR and just not while she is riding her own bike (She scares me to death when she rides her own bike, let's just say it). I feel awful leaving her behind when I go on a long trip by myself. We are both acutely aware of how fleeting life is and we do want to spend as much time as possible together. If I needed a trip without her, say when my older brother comes to town with his bike (a very rare occurrence anymore) she would understand that and the Wing could obviously be put to good use solo.

I feel that if I give up the FJR, I am somehow surrendering something of my youth and masculinity (which time, entropy and gravity are taking from me anyway). I admit I love the FJR's ability to pass a line of six cars a time without breaking a sweat, but I also like to feel like I have not been caned at the end of the day's ride. There's no amount of farkling at my age that can overcome a family history of weight challenges and multiple hip, shoulder and knee transplants. Did I mention that I have bad genes?

Am I the only one who wrestles with these issues?

Thoughtful opinions welcomed.

Respectfully submitted....

 

[dcarver]

I say go get a KTM 1190R and see what happens.

 

[Beary]

It is interesting that are suggesting to replace the FJR for something like a GW or Harley. I have just come from the Harley world and find thd FJR much easier on my body. I have a 78 year old neighbor who in the last eight years went from a Honda 1800 VTX to a BMW 1200 rt, Harley Road King, Gold Wing all in an effort to find something that his faultering body could manage. He just invested in a Gold Wing Trike and said that is the answer.

My 57 year old GW buddy is envious of my light nimble FJR.

Beary

 

[Goodman4]

Interesting thoughts. Since I posted last year, I have been fortunate enough to be able to trade my cruiser for a 2007 Goldwing and we took it to Montana a couple months ago. I have struggled with some of the same thoughts as have been mentioned here and after a half year and almost 10K miles I'll share my opinion.

For me, my biggest surprise was that the Wing is not as different from the FJR as I expected it to be. The VTX1300 was a fun cruiser but it was the opposite of the FJR. I had to change the way I rode in almost every way as I went back and forth. That was fun for me. But I go back and forth between the Wing and the FJR and I don't even have to think about it. I have to stop a little earlier because the brakes are better on the FJR. Of course, the FJR has more acceleration, but the Wing still has plenty. I am shocked at how well the big girl corners. I totally forget I'm riding the Wing on the twisties. I was sad before the Montana trip when thinking about riding Beartooth and the other Montana roads on the Wing instead of the FJR, but I never once thought about the FJR on those great roads. I never needed more power or felt I couldn't aggressively hit a corner.

The parking lot handling is a little different, but it's a wash for me. The Wing is balanced lower so I get my feet a lot more solid on the ground, but it's also heavier so if you get a bad angle, it's harder to manage. After 3 mph you don't feel the weight at all.

The real positives of the Wing I have found to be two things: Interstate handling and passenger comfort. I don't notice much difference on the side roads between the bikes' ability to handle distance, but it just seems the Wing eats the miles on the slab. My wife gets a lot of knee pain when riding and we have got pretty good at managing it though stretching and ibuprofen. But on our 5300 mile trip she wasn't hurting at all due to the better positions she can get her leg in on the big couch. We never would have been able to take that trip if wasn't for getting the Wing. We took a day long trip on the FJR a couple weekends ago, and she said she did so much better on the Wing she only wants to go for very short trips on it now and all medium to long trips will have to be the Wing.

I "might" be a little more comfortable on the Wing, but not much. I have the stock seat on the Wing and use an airhawk cushion. With my RDL seat, I am very comfortable on the FJR and don't need the airhawk.

So it probably sounds like I'm a Goldwing fanboy and I should sell the FJR from those points. But I'm not. The odd thing is I'm still in love with the FJR and I just "like" the Wing. It's not that it's an old man's bike. I think that's stupid. I'm an analytical guy and pride myself on function above style. That's a good thing, since I have no style. So I should love the Wing. But the FJR whispers dangerous things to me with all that power at my fingertips. That's where that stupid FJR grin everybody talks about comes from. I live and work in a fairly small town, so my commute to work is a fun 20 minute ride without any traffic. I take the FJR 98% of the time. I think the FJR will be the best bike I've ever owned, and I'm not in a hurry to downsize even though I've thought about it.

I was mad at the Goldwing for the first couple months for some screwy reasons mostly because I didn't know what to feel. I thought I was buying a luxury vehicle that would have a totally different feel than the FJR. But now I don't think it's a luxury vehicle. It performs like a sport bike for the most part. Luxury cars (though I've never owned one, I admit) have everything you could want but I had to buy more farkles for the Wing to take a trip than I did for the FJR except for the seat. The Goldwing is a very efficient and well engineered sporty LD bike.

We ride for different reasons, but most of us ride for the experience of the ride, not just the destination. I experience more of that on the FJR. Sometimes I feel like I'm in a car on the Wing because of the smoothness of the 6 cylinder engine. I'm more relaxed. That's good for long trips, but not as much fun the rest of the time.

So that's my experience. I agree with those who have said there is not enough difference in the Wing to make it a good switch if you are struggling with the weight of the bike because of aging issues. Back issues are all different, so it's possible one might be significantly better for you, but that is an individual thing and very height and build specific. For the passenger, that is a different thing. If you ride two up a lot and you want to extend your miles, our experience is that it makes a LOT of difference. And for me, her enjoyment is worth way more than the price of the bike even if I'm not in love with it, because the trips are so much better with her.

 

[ndivita]

Interesting thoughts. Since I posted last year, I have been fortunate enough to be able to trade my cruiser for a 2007 Goldwing and we took it to Montana a couple months ago. I have struggled with some of the same thoughts as have been mentioned here and after a half year and almost 10K miles I'll share my opinion.
For me, my biggest surprise was that the Wing is not as different from the FJR as I expected it to be. The VTX1300 was a fun cruiser but it was the opposite of the FJR. I had to change the way I rode in almost every way as I went back and forth. That was fun for me. But I go back and forth between the Wing and the FJR and I don't even have to think about it. I have to stop a little earlier because the brakes are better on the FJR. Of course, the FJR has more acceleration, but the Wing still has plenty. I am shocked at how well the big girl corners. I totally forget I'm riding the Wing on the twisties. I was sad before the Montana trip when thinking about riding Beartooth and the other Montana roads on the Wing instead of the FJR, but I never once thought about the FJR on those great roads. I never needed more power or felt I couldn't aggressively hit a corner.

The parking lot handling is a little different, but it's a wash for me. The Wing is balanced lower so I get my feet a lot more solid on the ground, but it's also heavier so if you get a bad angle, it's harder to manage. After 3 mph you don't feel the weight at all.

The real positives of the Wing I have found to be two things: Interstate handling and passenger comfort. I don't notice much difference on the side roads between the bikes' ability to handle distance, but it just seems the Wing eats the miles on the slab. My wife gets a lot of knee pain when riding and we have got pretty good at managing it though stretching and ibuprofen. But on our 5300 mile trip she wasn't hurting at all due to the better positions she can get her leg in on the big couch. We never would have been able to take that trip if wasn't for getting the Wing. We took a day long trip on the FJR a couple weekends ago, and she said she did so much better on the Wing she only wants to go for very short trips on it now and all medium to long trips will have to be the Wing.

I "might" be a little more comfortable on the Wing, but not much. I have the stock seat on the Wing and use an airhawk cushion. With my RDL seat, I am very comfortable on the FJR and don't need the airhawk.

So it probably sounds like I'm a Goldwing fanboy and I should sell the FJR from those points. But I'm not. The odd thing is I'm still in love with the FJR and I just "like" the Wing. It's not that it's an old man's bike. I think that's stupid. I'm an analytical guy and pride myself on function above style. That's a good thing, since I have no style. So I should love the Wing. But the FJR whispers dangerous things to me with all that power at my fingertips. That's where that stupid FJR grin everybody talks about comes from. I live and work in a fairly small town, so my commute to work is a fun 20 minute ride without any traffic. I take the FJR 98% of the time. I think the FJR will be the best bike I've ever owned, and I'm not in a hurry to downsize even though I've thought about it.

I was mad at the Goldwing for the first couple months for some screwy reasons mostly because I didn't know what to feel. I thought I was buying a luxury vehicle that would have a totally different feel than the FJR. But now I don't think it's a luxury vehicle. It performs like a sport bike for the most part. Luxury cars (though I've never owned one, I admit) have everything you could want but I had to buy more farkles for the Wing to take a trip than I did for the FJR except for the seat. The Goldwing is a very efficient and well engineered sporty LD bike.

We ride for different reasons, but most of us ride for the experience of the ride, not just the destination. I experience more of that on the FJR. Sometimes I feel like I'm in a car on the Wing because of the smoothness of the 6 cylinder engine. I'm more relaxed. That's good for long trips, but not as much fun the rest of the time.

So that's my experience. I agree with those who have said there is not enough difference in the Wing to make it a good switch if you are struggling with the weight of the bike because of aging issues. Back issues are all different, so it's possible one might be significantly better for you, but that is an individual thing and very height and build specific. For the passenger, that is a different thing. If you ride two up a lot and you want to extend your miles, our experience is that it makes a LOT of difference. And for me, her enjoyment is worth way more than the price of the bike even if I'm not in love with it, because the trips are so much better with her.

Very well said. Great post.

My latest dilemma is that two up with the wife ain't what I thought it was going to be, and yet the Gold Wing provides amenities and comfort I really like as a solo mount without sacrificing too much of the FJR thrill factor. I look back and realize I spent considerable time and money making my previous FJRs more like the Gold Wing, and while my Gold Wing is not farkle-free, it really is the long distance tourer benchmark with little no modification necessary. (This is not the time or the place to debate the merits of the Gold Wing versus other touring bikes or to measure the FJR against other sport touring mounts). No, I am not trying to make the Gold Wing more like the FJR.

The FJR is simply more visceral and raw than the Gold Wing, which is not surprising, but as someone else has said I am sure, when I am 500 miles from home after that first leg of a multi-day long ride, and when I look back into the parking lot, the Gold Wing is a thing of turn-key beauty, ease, user-friendliness, relief and comfort.

I will never use a CB radio, and the datedness of the audio controls and sound system compared to the world of Bluetooth radios, intercoms and helmet speakers, make me wonder what Honda Powersports is thinking but I can live with those things and have found workarounds. I tolerate these things on the Gold Wing.

That big six cylinder powerplant is very forgiving of rider inputs and, my word, does that thing pull.

The FJR is a mechanical stallion and I still lust for one but I just don't want more than one motorcycle. The Gold Wing is handsome, dependable machine - a two wheeled Lexus - while the FJR as you say "whispers" to you in the way a Mustang GT might. That usually heightens the risk of a speeding citation.

On balance, you're right that there is not that much difference between the two bikes except at the margins. One thing I do and will always miss is the feeling of being out in the middle of nowhere on the FJR on a two lane road, coming up behind a line of a few cars and simply easing the throttle on the bike and experiencing the line of cars vanish behind me. It really is quite something. My brother, a die-hard HD Road King pilot, still marvels at the FJR from our several long rides together, but then his jaw dropped too at the performance feats of the 2003 Blackbird I had up until a couple of years ago.

Bottom lining this, I think I am going to keep the Gold Wing for a while.

Meanwhile I am trying to learn more about the Second Law of Thermodynamics and its application to the human condition.

Ride safe.

 

[pcarnut]

Late to the party here but thought I'd just put this out for future reference if nothing else. I'm on my third FJR and overall it's the best do everything bike I've owned. But, for about a year and a half I owned an ST1300. At 720 lb. it is no light weight but it was a great interstate hauler and could still do this twisties very well. It was actually a little more comfortable for LD riding than the FJR. I looked at it as a Gold Wing Lite. Food for thought if the GW gets too much. As a side note it is nice to see a guy putting in the effort to make his wife a part of his interests. Good on ya.

 

[bowtie39]

Even later to the party.....have to agree with above poster. Had a '14 FJR ES for 950 miles and sold it. Picked up a 07 low mileage ST1300 and after adding a couple items find it better suited to me. Comfort, power and it does run the curves well enough for my taste. I do miss the CC but am about to fix that with a MC CC. It's a bike lost in time I suppose but I'm on my time these days. Will turn 62 tomorrow btw

 

[Teehaml]

Just read through this thread. Sounds like your made the right decision there ndivita. Ride safe, be happy, enjoy life and take care of yourself.

 

[jmdaniel]

Late to the party here but thought I'd just put this out for future reference if nothing else. I'm on my third FJR and overall it's the best do everything bike I've owned. But, for about a year and a half I owned an ST1300. At 720 lb. it is no light weight but it was a great interstate hauler and could still do this twisties very well. It was actually a little more comfortable for LD riding than the FJR. I looked at it as a Gold Wing Lite. Food for thought if the GW gets too much. As a side note it is nice to see a guy putting in the effort to make his wife a part of his interests. Good on ya.

I've been waiting for a ST refresh, well, forever...

 

[Bounce]

Honda was late to the party with their 1300 since day one.

I was looking at it seriously while I watched the PDP window on the first wave of FJRs was closing... quickly. I couldn't wait any longer so put down my FJR PDP deposits (2002). Honda still hadn't even announced pricing when my FJR came in. When they did, it cost more and didn't bring anything justifying the price difference. There's been more than once where I had to thank Honda for their lack of focus on the ST.

In the current generations of ST bikes, Honda has become what Kawasaki was with the 1000 Concours; an absentee landlord.

 

[pcarnut]

Honda was late to the party with their 1300 since day one.
I was looking at it seriously while I watched the PDP window on the first wave of FJRs was closing... quickly. I couldn't wait any longer so put down my FJR PDP deposits (2002). Honda still hadn't even announced pricing when my FJR came in. When they did, it cost more and didn't bring anything justifying the price difference. There's been more than once where I had to thank Honda for their lack of focus on the ST.

In the current generations of ST bikes, Honda has become what Kawasaki was with the 1000 Concours; an absentee landlord.

Yup, very true. They seem to keep missing the boat. Had high expectations for the VFR1200 and couldn't believe it when they put a small fuel tank on it basically killing any hope of appealing to sport-touring riders. I wonder if they have just given up on the ST crowd.

 

[bowtie39]

There are 31 flavors for a reason

 

[ctfjr]

Well ND, I'll throw in my $.02 here too.

I'm also 68, as a previous poster is. I bought my fjr 6 years ago - primarily for LD riding. My previous 2 bikes were Wings. I put about 140K on the last one & 125K on the 1st. Great rides for what they are. At 62 I was hankering for a sportier ride that I could get into the turns with. The FJR has really been a lot of fun for me. I guess its about finding the ride that's right for you NOW. It doesn't have to be your last bike - I'll probably be buying a new bike next year.

I remember the conversation I had with my wife in '05. I wanted to take a few weeks & do a solo run to Alaska. My comment to her was, "I don't know how many more years I will be able to do it". Well, here I sit now with ESRD (end stage renal disease - kidney failure) and am doing home dialysis, every day. My riding now is pretty much limited to day trips or if I stretch it to 2 day rides. No more west coast runs, GNP or Deal's Gap for me. But I'm ok with that because I did them. There are no guarantees - seize the day!

 

[Grimmster]

Congrats on making the decision that's right for you, for the right now, and is right for all concerned in your household.

If I were to consider abandoning (gasp!) the FJR for 'more tour - less sport' I think I'd take a hard look at the CTX1300.

Definitely not in the ST realm, but looks more 'roomy' for 2, starting to see the after market upgrades for its deficiencies, and is definitely not from the cookie cutter style or genre department.

I just like bikes that are good all-arounders, are reliable, and not what 51% of the populace are riding...