New Cans, More Fuel?

Yamaha FJR Motorcycle Forum

Help Support Yamaha FJR Motorcycle Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Richouse

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 21, 2007
Messages
452
Reaction score
38
Location
Southaven, MS
I just put on a set of Two Bro's cans and I'm just wondering if I should adjust the fuel mixture some (make it a little richer). I know FJR's come a little lean and these cans are not going to help that any. I did a test ride and didn't note any popping or detonation (pinging) and it was about 100 degrees out. I did the Barbarian jumper mod on my last FJR but I guess I really didn't need it because it always had stock cans. I'm really not interested in a juice box or PCIII right now. I'm just curious what others have done with the fuel mixture when putting on after market cans???

 
I just put on a set of Two Bro's cans and I'm just wondering if I should adjust the fuel mixture some (make it a little richer). I know FJR's come a little lean and these cans are not going to help that any. I did a test ride and didn't note any popping or detonation (pinging) and it was about 100 degrees out. I did the Barbarian jumper mod on my last FJR but I guess I really didn't need it because it always had stock cans. I'm really not interested in a juice box or PCIII right now. I'm just curious what others have done with the fuel mixture when putting on after market cans???
I have the CF cans with the small inserts. At first there seemed to be a little loss of low end power with a definet increase on top. Once the FI system adapted all was good. Just be sure to have the TB sync.

 
Once the FI system adapted all was good.
The FI system can't adapt to intake/exhaust changes, except for when in closed loop mode (idling, cruising). Any changes you "noticed" over time in acceleration was probably due to you adapting to the new exhaust.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Once the FI system adapted all was good.
The FI system can't adapt to intake/exhaust changes, except for when in closed loop mode (idling, cruising). Any changes you "noticed" over time in acceleration was probably due to you adapting to the new exhaust.
You may be correct. But within 50-100 miles it definetly improved.

So the FI system adapts at altitude and hot or colder temps I bet sustem can adapt with exhaust changes.

 
Once the FI system adapted all was good.
The FI system can't adapt to intake/exhaust changes, except for when in closed loop mode (idling, cruising). Any changes you "noticed" over time in acceleration was probably due to you adapting to the new exhaust.
You may be correct. But within 50-100 miles it definetly improved.

So the FI system adapts at altitude and hot or colder temps I bet sustem can adapt with exhaust changes.
Nope it is not going to happen. It will not adjust to new cans. You need to believe people who know a little about the FJR and FI in general. Your improvement was from you adapting to the sound and difference they make to better breathing, not the ECU doing anything. It is pre programed with algorithms based on voltage readings and set points. It does not auto tune or adapt.

 
Once the FI system adapted all was good.
The FI system can't adapt to intake/exhaust changes, except for when in closed loop mode (idling, cruising). Any changes you "noticed" over time in acceleration was probably due to you adapting to the new exhaust.
As Pickles correctly stated, the FI will not adapt to the extent you think it will. You're confusing the fixed mapping of the FJR with FI systems that have mass air flow sensors that are actually aware of increased flow through the engine and adapt by providing more fuel. Most slip ons provide little power increase on stock engines and have little impact on fuel maps that are correct to start with. Full exhaust changes almost always require fuel map changes.

 
So the consensus is I DON'T need to adjust the fuel any since I put just a set of cans on??? I know the FJR is a little lean from the factory and I know adding some free flowing cans will make it a little leaner. I just don't want to do some damage, although it may take a while, by having a too lean mixture. All I was going to do is bump the fuel up by doing the Barbarian jumper mod, this is just to easy. I am by no means an expert on FI systems so that is why I'm asking here... I know it won't hurt to add some fuel but if it won't hurt it at all by leaving it stock then why make my gas mileage go down some????

Thanks...

 
I know the FJR is a little lean from the factory and I know adding some free flowing cans will make it a little leaner. I just don't want to do some damage, although it may take a while, by having a too lean mixture. All I was going to do is bump the fuel up by doing the Barbarian jumper mod, this is just to easy. I am by no means an expert on FI systems so that is why I'm asking here... I know it won't hurt to add some fuel but if it won't hurt it at all by leaving it stock then why make my gas mileage go down some????
No. Changing cans doesn't change the mixture....that continues to be the point most folks are rightly making. It's a closed loop system that adjusts mixture based on readings from the O2 sensor....different cans don't change that mixture. It will stay the same amount of "little lean". If it didn't have an O2 sensor...then it could be an issue.

And yes......adding fuel (aka lowering the fuel to air ratio) likely would result in some mileage change. Yamaha has generally set it up to be the most fuel efficient.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
No. Changing cans doesn't change the mixture....that continues to be the point most folks are rightly making. It's a closed loop system that adjusts mixture based on readings from the O2 sensor....different cans don't change that mixture. It will stay the same amount of "little lean". If it didn't have an O2 sensor...then it could be an issue.

And yes......adding fuel (aka lowering the fuel to air ratio) likely would result in some mileage change. Yamaha has generally set it up to be the most fuel efficient.
I know that the ecu doesn't change the amount of fuel based on the exhaust setup. But, Option 1: a more free flowing exhaust lets more exhaust out therefore letting more air in. Now since the ecu doesn't apply more fuel, more air in and same amount of fuel in means a leaner mixture... Or, Option 2: does the ECU recognize, based on the O2 sensor reading, that more air is coming and adjust the fuel (not because of the cans, just because its reading a little lean) and bring the mixture back up to what it is set to???

It is one of the two options I explained here right??? which One???? First option: I need to add some fuel to the mix. Second option: I don't need to mess with anything...

Am I right here??? or do I totally not understand this FI system?? which is quite possible, but I'm here to learn....

 
Option 3 - You need to stop thinking about this so much.

When in closed-loop mode, within reason the ecu will use the O2 sensor to adjust the fueling to the specified range. Theorhetically*, you can 'adjust' that range, but you only want to do that with the use of an Exhaust Gas Analyzer or some other similiar type of exhaust sniffing equipment.

* - This has not been confirmed, I believe the dude who told me this.

When in open loop mode, the ecu provides fuel based on a table developed by Yamaha which assumes a certain amount of airflow through the engine. So yes, if you change the airflow enough then changing the fueling would be best, or perhaps even necessary.

But does adding slip-ons 'open' up the system increasing airflow? Conventional wisdom around here is 'NO'. Adding slip-ons or a K&N filter does not appreciably change airflow characteristics if any at all. That's not been proven, but is the general consensus. The consensus is that the catalytic converter is the primary restriction in the system.

Folks have modified the airbox with varying results, and there are systems out there that replace the stock header (and cat) that seem to offer slightly more power (airflow) but perhaps at the expense of torque.

Regardless, Yamaha seems to know what they are doing and designed a pretty good system with regards to airflow. Not much you can do to change it or improve on it appreciably imho.

As for the Barbarian Jumper, if you do that your are just SWAGing. Not all FJRs are created the same. Though most FJRs tend to be somewhat lean, how do you know you don't have a rich condition in stock form?

So no, you don't need to do anything regarding fueling just because of adding slip-ons. You may *want* to do something with your fueling if you think your FJR is running excessively lean. Either with, or without slip-ons.

Clear as mud?

Ride more, stress less.

 
I decided to pull a spark plug today and have a look at it. Since the bike has 1300+ (1000 mi. with 2 Bros.) miles on it I figured that the plugs would have some signs of how the mixture is. Sure enough, just as I though. The plug looked clean and the tip was as white as a piece of paper. Showing a lean condition. I did the Bar. Jumper Mod and checked the settings and all 4 cylinders showed 0's. I bumped them all up to 7. I'll run them a while then check a plug again and see what the change did...

 
I had done the BJM and moved all my cylinders from their preset of 10 to 17. I did it for fun as the bike ran great stock but it is smoother in the lower rpms and doesn't have that very slight lean shudder to it when rolling on the thottle in the low rpms. I have since added slip-ons and have not touched it, bike runs great.

And to clarify the FI thing - the bike will only compensate for more air flow when in closed loop mode and listening to what the O2 sensor reports back on the A/F ratio, which is pretty much only when idling and when steady cruising with under 10% throttle. Much above that and the bike runs on the base maps developed by Yamaha engineers as described above combined with the Air Intake Temp sensor and the Barometric Pressure sensor - and none of those have any clue if more or less air is moving through the air box (no MAF sensor).

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Top