Rumors of a Honda Supersport apparently false

[SockMonkey]

I've been studying this photo over at another site. My initial thought when I first saw the photo was, "damn, that's a big transmission", until I realized that I was looking at the entire motor (minus the heads). A forum member commented in a separate thread that they felt this new transmission would add weight, but after seeing this photo I doubt that will be the case. This is one very compact unit.

Now that I've wrapped my mind around the overall configuration, my immediate concern goes to serviceability for those of us that like to take care of our own rides. A transmission rebuild will be nothing short of brain surgery, and a clutch job may be akin to a heart transplant; it's about as complex as anything I've ever seen on a bike. More to the point, your friendly neighborhood Honda dealer's shop monkeys will have them some learnin' to do (they who find it hard enough to service more "conventional" fare...).

I have to admit that Honda has my complete attention on this one, though. I am really interested to see what the bikes this unit goes in are capable of. We shall see...

 

[RadioHowie]

I've been studying this photo over at another site. My initial thought when I first saw the photo was, "damn, that's a big transmission", until I realized that I was looking at the entire motor (minus the heads). A forum member commented in a separate thread that they felt this new transmission would add weight, but after seeing this photo I doubt that will be the case. This is one very compact unit.
Now that I've wrapped my mind around the overall configuration, my immediate concern goes to serviceability for those of us that like to take care of our own rides. A transmission rebuild will be nothing short of brain surgery, and a clutch job may be akin to a heart transplant; it's about as complex as anything I've ever seen on a bike. More to the point, your friendly neighborhood Honda dealer's shop monkeys will have them some learnin' to do (they who find it hard enough to service more "conventional" fare...).

I have to admit that Honda has my complete attention on this one, though. I am really interested to see what the bikes this unit goes in are capable of. We shall see...

I just finished up some extrapolation based on the bore size of the V-4 and the resulting size of the motor, fore and aft and side to side, (I couldn't extrapolate a height without the heads) and with just a little grinding, that sucker will fit RIGHT in a FJR frame!

 

[wfooshee]

Our own Constant Mesh posted this on our own forum earlier this A.M.

Apparently nobody likes him because there are 0 replies over there.

 

[MotorToad]

Motorcyclist has a couple of pages on the bike this month. Apparently it's more CBR-XX/VFR than ST/VFR, which is good. I still would rather have a '00 VFR with a liter engine, though. :-\

The rear cylinders are on the inner halves of the crank throws to make it narrower, and the front head uses Unicam from the dirt bikes to make room for the radiator and such.

 

[SockMonkey]

I've been studying this photo over at another site. My initial thought when I first saw the photo was, "damn, that's a big transmission", until I realized that I was looking at the entire motor (minus the heads). A forum member commented in a separate thread that they felt this new transmission would add weight, but after seeing this photo I doubt that will be the case. This is one very compact unit.
Now that I've wrapped my mind around the overall configuration, my immediate concern goes to serviceability for those of us that like to take care of our own rides. A transmission rebuild will be nothing short of brain surgery, and a clutch job may be akin to a heart transplant; it's about as complex as anything I've ever seen on a bike. More to the point, your friendly neighborhood Honda dealer's shop monkeys will have them some learnin' to do (they who find it hard enough to service more "conventional" fare...).

I have to admit that Honda has my complete attention on this one, though. I am really interested to see what the bikes this unit goes in are capable of. We shall see...

I just finished up some extrapolation based on the bore size of the V-4 and the resulting size of the motor, fore and aft and side to side, (I couldn't extrapolate a height without the heads) and with just a little grinding, that sucker will fit RIGHT in a FJR frame!

And which shall henceforth be known as the Yamahonda VJR 1200 RH Edition. In one fell swoop, you've just answered everyone's wettest dreams about the next-gen FJR; you've given it more horsepower (~190HP); you've given it 6 speeds; and you've given a proper nod to both camps - the clutch and AE guys. Nice work..!! :lol:

Hopefully though, the damn thing won't be silver, black or blue...

 

[RadioHowie]

I just finished up some extrapolation based on the bore size of the V-4 and the resulting size of the motor, fore and aft and side to side, (I couldn't extrapolate a height without the heads) and with just a little grinding, that sucker will fit RIGHT in a FJR frame!

And which shall henceforth be known as the Yamahonda VJR 1200 RH Edition. In one fell swoop, you've just answered everyone's wettest dreams about the next-gen FJR; you've given it more horsepower (~190HP); you've given it 6 speeds; and you've given a proper nod to both camps - the clutch and AE guys. Nice work..!! :lol:

BTW, I'm gonna run MY version's cams with sprockets 'sted of chains. :thumbsupsmileyanim:

Hopefully though, the damn thing won't be silver, black or blue...

Nope.....deep, DEEP red....think I'll call it "Black Cherry". Whaddya think?

oooh-oooh-oooh.......Candy Lime Green!

 

[SockMonkey]

What's concerning me deeply is that all of the Honda propoganda I've been receiving about this new bike is coming out of Honda UK, compliments of the FeelV4 website. I'll be "less-than-gruntled" if this launches in Europe first and doesn't find its way to the US until 2011. Not that I necessarily have any intention of buying a new bike next year (not until 2012, actually), but I'd like to follow the trials and tribulations of a US customer base for 2 years before making the decision of whether to buy one.

As an aside, the latest video that's been added to the FeelV4 website definitely leaves the impression that the resulting bike is going to be a super (hyper?) sport-tourer. The 3 primary design drivers were (paraphrasing) 1) a sports bike than can tour, 2) character, and 3) a feel of quality (interestingly, I've heard very similar statements applied to design drivers behind Honda's Acura car line...). One of the more telling comments made by the bike's project leader in this video is that the overarching statement they used to define how the bike was to be used by a rider was, "taking a ride to get lunch 300 kms away from home". It's not that you can't do this on practically any bike (though perhaps some more so than others), but within the context of what's being said in the video, you immediately get a sense of where this is going. And in my opinion, the Acura analog may be the most accurate.

 

[escapefjrtist]

This new Honda is very interesting. I can't wait to get more detailed information on it...and see if it really is going to imported. Who says the kid needs college, right?

--G

 

[dcarver]

Maybe Honda will get it right?

/ducking

 

[Toecutter]

Maybe Honda will get it right?

Which should put a glut of used Blackbirds on the market!

 

[Podman6262]

What's concerning me deeply is that all of the Honda propoganda I've been receiving about this new bike is coming out of Honda UK, compliments of the FeelV4 website. I'll be "less-than-gruntled" if this launches in Europe first and doesn't find its way to the US until 2011. Not that I necessarily have any intention of buying a new bike next year (not until 2012, actually), but I'd like to follow the trials and tribulations of a US customer base for 2 years before making the decision of whether to buy one.
As an aside, the latest video that's been added to the FeelV4 website definitely leaves the impression that the resulting bike is going to be a super (hyper?) sport-tourer. The 3 primary design drivers were (paraphrasing) 1) a sports bike than can tour, 2) character, and 3) a feel of quality (interestingly, I've heard very similar statements applied to design drivers behind Honda's Acura car line...). One of the more telling comments made by the bike's project leader in this video is that the overarching statement they used to define how the bike was to be used by a rider was, "taking a ride to get lunch 300 kms away from home". It's not that you can't do this on practically any bike (though perhaps some more so than others), but within the context of what's being said in the video, you immediately get a sense of where this is going. And in my opinion, the Acura analog may be the most accurate.

You are so right!

 

[Hudson]

This new Honda is very interesting. I can't wait to get more detailed information on it...and see if it really is going to imported. Who says the kid needs college, right?
--G

Gotta agree with George. I also read the Motorcylist blurb and the sidebar about the ST1300 replacement; gee, this combo seems like a decent competitor to the C14 and ZX14, not to mention the FJR.

The VFR looks most interesting indeed.

 

[Constant Mesh]

"A new VFR large-displacement sport bike equipped with the new transmission will be released in Europe and North America in 2010, with sales to commence in Japan at a later date."

https://world.honda.com/news/2009/2090908Du...sion/index.html

 

[BugR]

Dual Clutch, 1st, 3rd, 5th on the inner shaft, 2nd, 4th & 6th on the outer shaft

 

[Spook]

looks wonderful but the only thing I can think is when it goes Tango Uniform it really goes Tange Uniform. Also how much strength is there in the multiple shafts this has to have.

 

[quicksilver]

What would be the benefit of two clutches?

More compact gearing setup? Seems like any benefits are lost in having the 2nd clutch there with it's size and weight.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

looks wonderful but the only thing I can think is when it goes Tango Uniform it really goes Tange Uniform. Also how much strength is there in the multiple shafts this has to have.

What would be the benefit of two clutches?More compact gearing setup? Seems like any benefits are lost in having the 2nd clutch there with it's size and weight.

There are a few more pieces involved -- given a Tango Uniform situation...

But, there are (strength) benefits to the set-up. The next gear has aready been pre-selected and is just sitting there ready to be used when needed -- as opposed to (like the FJR's box) the next gear being selected with the load applied while it is happening.

The Honda's system may be alot easier on shift-dogs -- since they'll be selecting 'un-loaded' gears...

 

[Fred W]

Actually, it's the same as how the Formula 1 auto shifters and BMW's automotive SMG paddle shifters work.

Having the 2 clutches allow you to pre-engage the next sequential gear as CM just said. Then when it's time to actually shift gears the clutch of the next gear begins to engage as the last one disengages. So shifting is far smoother with less interruption of power. No need to disengage clutch, then shift, then re-engage.

 

[Spook]

looks wonderful but the only thing I can think is when it goes Tango Uniform it really goes Tange Uniform. Also how much strength is there in the multiple shafts this has to have.

What would be the benefit of two clutches?More compact gearing setup? Seems like any benefits are lost in having the 2nd clutch there with it's size and weight.

There are a few more pieces involved -- given a Tango Uniform situation...

But, there are (strength) benefits to the set-up. The next gear has aready been pre-selected and is just sitting there ready to be used when needed -- as opposed to (like the FJR's box) the next gear being selected with the load applied while it is happening.

The Honda's system may be alot easier on shift-dogs -- since they'll be selecting 'un-loaded' gears...

I can see your point but I still think there has to be weakness in the shafts.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

I can see your point but I still think there has to be weakness in the shafts.

The mainshaft on the FJR is hollow (as it is on many motorcycles) and hollow shafts are good'n strong -- maybe an engineer can step-in here with some stats.? Anyway, the only different shaft is the, co-axial, outer mainshaft which is supported by ball bearings and a sleeve bushing (std. fare) -- while the inner mainshaft is supported to the outer mainshaft by needle-roller bearings (the shafts actually share support).

While the shafts, themselves, may be strong -- there is more complication. That can probably be offset by the less impact on the gear-dogs?

What's important is that this technology affords fully-automatic shifting (something that will probably be necessary -- to continue to sell motorcycles? ).