Thinking of coming back....

[Spook]

not only that but damn expensive too. Went to get a new key for one of my vehicles had keypass built into the key cost damn near 100 buck and an hour of time to get a freakin key.

 

[BBAR]

Well I guess I'll chime in on this subject since I have a little experience on the subject. I have owned two Concours(C10)'s (which I still own one, a 1986), a 2008 Concours14 and a 2010 FJR. So take what I have to say with a grain of salt.

The older Concours was a great bike when designed. Even to this day, the original C10 is a very capable bike. Even though it is a 25 year old design. But it's not truly on par with the FJR and C14. But it's a great bike that can be had for cheap. But this thread is more about the newer bikes. But like the original C10, the FJR is an older design that has been updated in 2006. The C14 was a brand new design in 2007 as a 2008 model. The FJR has had the bugs worked out over the years that resulted in an outstanding motorcycle. The C14 is still in the phase of working out problems.

The C14 has had problems with quite a few things. But in fairness, quite a few of them have been flawless bikes. The more well known problems have to do with things like: KIPASS, The TPS (tire pressure sensor), drive shafts, brake rotors, panniers that fly off the bike and so on.

The KIPASS is a system the people either love or hate. It allows you to leave a fob in your pocket and not take the key out of the bike. The problems arise out of a few things. The main thing being a sticking actuator switch. When this switch sticks, the ignition will be stuck in between functions. So your stuck there unless you know the couple of methods of resetting the switch. One has you cutting up the wiring harness and installing a bypass reset. Another has you taking the plastic off the bike to disconnect a connector and reconnecting it quickly the turning the switch within seconds. The third involves beating on the switch housing with a rock! My C14 was plagued with KIPASS problems right from the start. Kawasaki would not replace any parts. After three years, they finally confirmed my failures. Instead of replacing parts, they chose to clean and lube the parts that were failing when the parts were clean and lubed being brand new! I sprayed lube into the actuator frequently to keep it functioning. But in the end, that wouldn't work either.

Other KIPASS troubles involved bad electronics on the first bikes. People losing the fobs which costs hundreds of dollars to replace and program. If you loose both, you must replace lots of parts that are well over the $1,000 mark. Then if you have a bad battery of connection, you don't know because the KIPASS won't allow you to turn the key switch on and hit the starter. So you have to troubleshoot the bike just to find out the the battery is in trouble! All this so someone doesn't have to reach into their pocket for the key? IMO. the KIPASS adds cost, complexity, weight, and takes up valuable room under the seat. I does nothing but allow you to use the same style ignition you would need anyway! So the key-less ignition has all the downsides of a keyed ignition without the positives of a tried and true keyed ignition! Plus the actual ignition key is very soft and has been prone to bend in the gas cap.

The TPS system I actually liked. It allowed you to monitor your tire pressures at all times. It would warn you when pressures dropped below 34PSI. Which saved my butt one day when I had 2 different flats, on 2 different tires, 2 hours apart! So I liked it, but it's also tied into the KIPASS system. So you can't have one without the other. Now the down side of the TPS. The batteries are suppose to last about 5 years. The sensors are hundreds of dollars and the batteries are not designed to be replaced. So two sensors with programing and labor could cost you upwards near $1,000. These TPS sensors have been going bad constantly. Mine started giving me problems at about 1 year old. They would not work in the cooler weather that got worse and worse as time went on. When they fail. The dash display is totally taken over by warnings. You can reset it by holding one button and pressing the other. But it's difficult enough to do. But almost impossible in the dark or with winter gloves on. So if you ride to work in the AM, you be dealing with that warning untill the tires warm up. Normally that's between 5-10 miles. And that warning display does that with any warning including low fuel. It's a total PITA!

The shaft drive troubles have been appearing on more and more bikes. Although the number of final drive failures again is probably low in the number of C14's out there. Most of the shaft problems are bearing related.

Another thing is the panniers that fly off when riding. A number of people have reported riding and finding the pannier gone while riding. The bags can become loose on the bike and can bounce off. Kawasaki has a recall on the original latches. But obviously, it didn't fix the problem. So people employ tactics like drilling and pinning the bottom of the panniers to hold them in place. Others use these little devices that one of the riders has devised. It goes under the handle to hold the bags locked down on the mounts as well. Two solutions to a poor design.

The C14 is plagued by wrapping brake rotors as well. Especially the front rotors, but rears are also warping. Kawasaki has been replacing most of them. But do give people a hard time. Some people have had them replace 3 times or more! Others have gone to after market rotors trying to alleviate the problems with the brakes.

The C14 has had recalls for headlight adjuster knobs falling off, but only repair if your were about to fall off. A recall for the rear brake. Rocks have gotten caught and held the rear brake on creating problems. Well the recall installed a plate to block rocks from getting to the cylinder. But have also held the rocks there to create the problem Kawasaki was trying to fix. So your rear brake can just start dragging and fail or lock up on you still! The Pannier latch fix also didn't seem to accomplish what it set out to do Either.

My particular C14 had KIPASS problems pretty much from the start. I went three years not knowing when it would strand me next. It stranded me numerous times from just long enough to beat on the ignition housing, to waiting for a trailer to come get me. The trailer to the dealer was a few times. The sticking actuator happened many times. Anyway, Kawasaki would not repair the bike unless it was verified. And of course it never would fail once the bike was there. So when the dealer finally verified the problem, 3 years in. They wouldn't replace any of the parts that failed since new! That was the final straw for me.

My C14 also had rotors replaced, TPS sensors replaced and of course the recalls. So my bike seemed to go back to the dealer many times. The good part is that Kawasaki gives you a 3 year warranty with the C14. That's a good thing because mine needed it! I refused to sell my bike to another person directly. So I traded it in on my 2010 FJR.

Now my FJR has so far proven to be the opposite of the C14. The FJR has been rock solid dependable in the 6 months I've owned it. Yes a short time, but 6,000 miles. And my C14 at this point had been at the dealer a few times and stranded me more than once already in the same time frame. Basically my C14 gave me more problems than all the street bikes I have had together over the last 30 years put together. And I had quite a few street bikes in that time. But to be fair, my other two bikes right now are also Kawasaki's (2003 Mean Streak and 1986 Concours C10). They have both been very good dependable bikes.

Now I'll compare some of what I like better on both bikes:

-I like the TPS on the C14. But it has trouble and is part of KIPASS.

-I think the C14's suspension is a little better.

-The C14 is a little smoother engine/transmission.

-The FJR is more nimble than the C14.

-The FJR has much better adjustments for rider comfort. (seat height, bar adjustments)

-The FJR display is much better. Low fuel warnings doesn't take over the whole display.

-The FJR has a outside temp display. My C14 didn't. But the new one does. Although it must be one that screen only to see it.

-The FJR has better fit and finish. Feels more solidly built!

-The FJR gets better fuel mileage and holds more fuel than my C14 did. But the newer C14 now has an economy mode, so it gets better fuel mileage now.

-The Newer C14 has traction control

-The C14 ABS scares you when it kicks on. I never felt the FJR's ABS come on.

-The FJR has a good amount of under seat storage. The C14 really does not.

-The C14 is taller than the FJR. That's good for clearance, but bad for shorter people that need to touch the ground. But I got by with the C14's high. A lower seat helped.

So this will give you an idea of my thoughts on the subject. Now if I was given the Choice of a brand new 2011 C14 or FJR free and clear. I would still take the 2011 FJR over the C14. Although the C14 is a newer design. I prefer the FJR for the reasons I have stated. But in all fairness, I do just like the fit/finish, feel and a lot of others better about the FJR over the C14. The FJR's reliability is just the icing on the cake for me!

Bob

 

[iboldguy]

BBar, I agree with your comments regarding the FJR. I too am a former Concours owner who is now a feejer owner. I think I've met you a couple of Concours Owner's Group events. I still maintain my membership there since I find it a great group that I fit in with well and they are not overly brand centric like hardly abelson groups. You other feejer owner's should attend a COG event you'll like it. www.cog-online.org

 

[BBAR]

BBar, I agree with your comments regarding the FJR. I too am a former Concours owner who is now a feejer owner. I think I've met you a couple of Concours Owner's Group events. I still maintain my membership there since I find it a great group that I fit in with well and they are not overly brand centric like hardly abelson groups. You other feejer owner's should attend a COG event you'll like it. www.cog-online.org

I know were a little off topic. Sorry!

Yeah, I have no intentions of leaving COG either. Especially since I'm one of the NE asst. area directors. Like you said, COG is more of a any bike towards sport tour riders club. It just happens to be mainly Conocurs owners. That's how they normally join COG. But it's amazing how many have moved on to other bikes, but continue their COG memberships. I knew their was a lot FJR riders in COG. But last August in Vermont, probably 20% of the bikes were FJR's! But we have all kinds from Wings to some cruisers and everything in between. It's a great club that I'm proud to be a part of. And the best part is other than a little ribbing, I'm just as welcome on my FJR as I was on the C10 and C14.

You'll love this story. My C14 was in the shop again (for the last time) when my KIPASS stranded me again. So I was forced to ride the Mean Streak on a COG ride I was co-hosting. My C10 was apart for restoration. So I only had the cruiser. I think some of those guys on their C14's were a little surprised when the Cruiser walked away from them! :yahoo:

But it was all in fun when I got to give back the ribbing over lunch! But if y'all get a chance. Check out a COG event. They're a great bunch. Even if they're a little biased towards their Concours! But I think we all are somewhat!

 

[CRMH Eagle]

You can guy mine!

Just posted a thread if I should part-out the farkles or sell with the bike.

 

[puppychow]

You can guy mine!

Just posted a thread if I should part-out the farkles or sell with the bike.

He already got one! A 2010 FJR. Congrats BBAR!

 

[deanw]

-The FJR gets better fuel mileage and holds more fuel than my C14 did. But the newer C14 now has an economy mode, so it gets better fuel mileage now.

But, I think, under no conditions will a C14 get better mpg than an FJR.

 

[Sticky Throttle]

-The FJR gets better fuel mileage and holds more fuel than my C14 did. But the newer C14 now has an economy mode, so it gets better fuel mileage now.

But, I think, under no conditions will a C14 get better mpg than an FJR.

Ditto. 46.8 mpg for this '03. :thumbsup:

 

[bikerkash]

It sounds like Bob gave you a lot of great input on both bikes. I'm committed to my FJR and love the bike but one has to keep an open mind about what is going on. The FJR is without doubt in serious need of an update and there does not appear to be one coming anytime in the near future. The C-14 gets great reviews from all the bike mags. The other bike to consider is the new BMW GT, with the new 6 cylinder engine, which will at the dealers this spring. Yamaha appears to be unwilling to put more money into the sport touring market and update the FJR. The FJR, 06 and new is a great bike but is falling behind the competition.

 

[deanw]

The next FJR may well be a 1500cc 180mph rocket. I won't buy one; IMHO they're too big already. If I buy another FJR, it'll be smaller and lighter, and/or based on the V4 still in production for the V-Max.

 

[Crash Cash]

The FJR is without doubt in serious need of an update and there does not appear to be one coming anytime in the near future.

No. No, it doesn't. It's just fine as it is. I don't want a bike with a ton of traction control, keyless ignition, variable valves, CANBUS electrics, clutchless transmission, and other useless **** to junk it up. Fuel injection and ABS is as far as it goes with me. About the ONLY neato-nifty-keen item I might buy is a forkless front suspension.

The C-14 gets great reviews from all the bike mags. The other bike to consider is the new BMW GT, with the new 6 cylinder engine, which will at the dealers this spring. Yamaha appears to be unwilling to put more money into the sport touring market and update the FJR. The FJR, 06 and new is a great bike but is falling behind the competition.

Not really. I wouldn't buy a C-14 or a BMW GT, for the same reason I won't buy a Goldwing. If I want a car, I'll buy one with 4 wheels. If I totaled my FJR next year, I'd still buy another one. It's a big comfy bike without being lardy, and it's mostly easy to work on. It's also nowhere near as ugly as the BMW or the Kawasaki.

I'm hoping all the fancy crap will shake out of the bike market, and they'll go back to being motorcycles.

 

[Tom Herold]

My riding buddy came off a C-10 to the 08 C-14 and has had all the same problems listed above. Kawasaki's been a PITA over a lot of the warranty stuff too. He loves his bike though, and has somewhere in the neighborhood of 45k miles on it since new. It seems somewhere near the 40k mile mark, the C-14's are experiencing a lot higher rate of failure.

Regardless of the "unlimited mileage" warranty my friend has, Kawasaki's saying the componenets requiring repair have "too much mileage" on them...

When I was in the market to replace my 99 Triumph Trophy 1200, I rode his C-14 for a personal evaluation; its a big bike! I didn't like it enough to sell off my old Trophy, but did start searching for an FJR to evaluate too. The BMW's aren't my personal taste so i never considered one.

We swap bikes once in a while, I rode his C-14 yesterday and he had my FJR.

I won't beat a dead horse, but I'm glad I went with the Yamaha.

 

[MCRIDER007]

It seems somewhere near the 40k mile mark, the C-14's are experiencing a lot higher rate of failure.

Higher than what??? I have been following the C14 forums since the C14 hit the dealer showrooms in July 2007 and while there have been threads on KIPASS failures, rotor replacements, and bad u-joints in the driveshaft, those problems were apparent long before the 40K mark. There don't seem to be that many riders to date that have actually passed the 40K mark but the ones that have seem to be pretty happy with the C14 so as a C14 owner I would be interested in knowing what components are experiencing the higher rate of failure you referenced.

 

[beachy]

i had a c 10 now the fjr to me it was night and day.to me the c 14 still feels top heavy in comparison to the fjr. and that kipass i have heard of a lot of people being stranded.the c 14 wasnt even an option

 

[mab864]

Agreed it's about fit and feel. I rode both before I settled on the fjr. The Connie felt big and I didn't care for the hyperdrive top end powerband it had. I rode an '09 and the mirrors were absolutely worthless. All I saw were the bags in the rear view mirrors. I think the '10 Connies are better, but they're full retail here. I had a choice between new '09 Connies and '10 fjr. Both were within a few hundred bucks of each other OTD. Of course I choose the fjr and I'm really glad I did.

 

[Mike Kelly]

Two of my riding partners (actually the only two I ride with) have CL14s. One is making 150WHEEL HP on it. I test rode both before I bought my FJR. Things I perfer on the FJR? I like not roasting my crotch. Not once did I get hot on the FJR like I did on the CL14. That thing is an OVEN. I also didn't care for the mirrors, and LIKE the position of the mirrors on the FJR because they help keep the wing off my hands. Changing oil on the FJR is a snap compared to the concourse, and the VALVE adjustments are much more pocket friendly.. The one thing I DO prefer on the concours is the lower, more sport oriented handlebars. I HATE the more upright position of the bars on the FJR and will likely buy another pair of uprights and have them cut and welded. Not a fan of the lack of aftermarket support in that area. Otherwise, I don't get the hoopla over the CL14. I was CLOSE to buying one until I rode it. I've actually had both CL14 owners tell me that the fit and finish of my FJR is way better than their CL14s. If I were going to shop for a CL14, I'd only look at the 2010 or newer, as I think it is more equal to the 2006-newer FJR in refinement and options... Hell the FJR had heated grips for how long, and Kawi JUST put them on the CL14? Really? I'm glad I got the deal on my 08 for $8000 with 4K miles on the clock. It was a great buy and overall I've been very happy riding it, except for the whole "first crash in 28 years riding" thing, two months into ownership...

Mike

 

[XLR8]

I'm like the OP. I had a 2005 and sold it and have been missing my big couch. Not that I don't like my VFR, I do but I was thinking of a FJR vs C14. The FJR looks better but the C14 has better tech... which sounds like it has been going awry. Do I really need TC, a slipper clutch and tire pressure sensors? Also, I already know how to work on an FJR.

 

[dbvolfan]

I have an '05 FJR and a '08 C14 with ABS. I've said it before but if I had to do it over again I'd be putting a 2nd FJR in the stable.

Not that there isnt anything terrible about the C14 but many of the posters here have touched on the issues that bother me. Maintenance (intervals and difficulty) as well as reliability.

My FJR now has close to 60k trouble free miles but the C14's seem to be running into a lot more issues. Yes, there are a lot of people out there with 30-40k+ miles but there seem to be a lot more issues or wider array of issues on the C14, than the FJR.

Warranty work depends on the dealer. I never really had any issues on my FJR so I cant speak to it but so far Kawi has sucked. I hope it is more delaer related than anything.

Touring- It's a toss up. I really do enjoy 6 gears on the C14, as you can be doing 85 at 4k rpm's and that nets you 70mph on my Gen1. The C14 engine and tranny is smoother but sure feel weak in the pants compared to my FJR. Much less torque, and you can feel it. Both needed Vstream windscreens to offer adequate protection for me. Ergonomics feel better on the C14 to me.

Handling- Depends on the rider. For me, even with 60k miles and the original rear shock, my FJR feels tighter and I can toss it around. Maybe its because I have more miles on it but both bikes have new PR2's and the C14 feels like it wanders sometimes.

I am 6' 180# and the C14 stock fit me great whereas I had to mod the bars on my Gen1 to get a more comfortable position. Heat? I dunno...it seemed like a big issue to Gen1 FJR owners but I never had an issue with it on mine and I havent really noticed it on the C14 either. It's truen about the seat height. Even at 6' with a 32" inseam my feet arent as planted squarely on the ground as they are with the FJR and lugging your legs over the bags requires you to do plenty of PX90 or Zoomba workouts to get the flexibility required to avoid scuffing your bags up with your boot heel.

C14- Premium Fuel Gas mileage is also lower as I get 35-36mpg on the C14 vs 40-43 on the FJR day in and day out

C14- Valve intervals at 15k miles and those checks are a royal PITA. My FJR has proven very easy to work on over the years.

Only time will tell. I have 5k on the C14 so it's still young. The new C14's addressed many design/complaints present on mine such as the useless mirrors (WTF designed those anyway?!?!)

It's like I said on the C14 forum......it's like Ford and Chevy. Someone can show that the other is statistically more reliable than the other but owners on both sides have examples of piss poor reliability as well as those who have 1,000,000 mile cars. I think in the end my C14 will pile on some miles and perhaps endure a few more trips to the dealer than my FJR did but it's an enjoyable bike nonetheless.

 

[03HiYoSilver]

The FJR looks better but the C14 has better tech... which sounds like it has been going awry. Do I really need TC, a slipper clutch and tire pressure sensors? Also, I already know how to work on an FJR.

XLR,

I understand what you mean. This is a good example of Newer is Not Necessarily better... like when we were harassed to switch from Win2k and WinXp Windows OS to the prettier better Windows Vista.

Well after some research and upon finding about 1/4 of (total about 125) my Old Best programs would not work under Vista I went along peacefully doing my Business Without a hitch, but hearing a Great Deal of Complaints from who made the switch, Including Most Business" things were not working so well and actually had to Roll back the the Functioning XP Downgrade version. This was Dell's answer and they even charged more for it!

This is one good example of too many to count and Newer is like a 2 edged sword. P.S. I am still running Win2k and WinXp3 (supported until 2014) without a hitch and a great deal of more hair.

All the Best with your decision.

 

[garyahouse]

Thought I'd add my 2 cents worth.

The FJR is better looking. Period.

Though you don't HAVE to own an FJR to cruise this website, when it comes to knowledge and helpfulness, you know there's no forum like this forum. Period.

FJRs are cheaper to buy and the FORUM consensus: cheaper to maintain. Period.

Let's do the math. The FJR makes you prettier, hanging out on the forum makes you smarter, and choosing an FJR makes you richer.

Since I'm certified to teach math, I'd saying that adds up to a winning combination.

Now if you can just decide on the color...

Gary