Throttle Response Help?!?

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ricks.06

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I just finished a 3K trip that covered all of my favorite mountain roads (Deals Gap, etc). I am having a hard time with the on/off throttle response from 4500 rpm and up. Example- approaching a corner in 2nd gear at 5K and rolling off of the throttle, then opening the throttle to exit and BAM! It's like there is an on off switch on that sucker. It is so pronounced that I have to ride the turns in a taller gear to keep the rpms below 4K. Otherwise, it feels like it will literally buck me off when the throttle engages. Not good when you are commited to a line and then looking to roll on the throttle! It may be me, but I swear that it seems to almost stall for a fraction of a second before the throttle reengages after rolling off.

Has anyone else had this? It really sucks when riding the twisties.

Thanks in advance

 
The first thing I would suspect is your Throttle Position Sensor (TPS). I have copied and pasted a diagnostic from another forum, it may help -

"It does sound like it is the TPS. But to be sure before ordering, try the diagnostic mode first to see what voltage the TPS is sending to the ECU.

On the LCD display, press SELECT and SET at the same time and turn on the ignition. Wait 10 seconds or so. You will see DIAG in the screen. Press SELECT and SET together again and wait 10 seconds. Now you are in the TPS diagnostic. You should see a small number on the bottom of the screen. It should be 15-17 with the throttle closed. Check to see that the readings go from 15-100 (16-99 etc is OK) by turning the throttle slowly from no-throttle to full-throttle. The numbers should gradually increase/decrease in a linear fashion as the throttle is opened/closed. Any jumping around or wild values as you do this means its FUBAR. If all is OK, the poor idle probably lies elsewhere.

If it is bad and the agent is to replace it, be sure they know it is not just a matter of blindly fitting the new one and attaching the wire harness. It has to be calibrated to the throttle position before locking down the mounting screws".

Hope that helps

Don

 
Common problem with 2006's - Power Commander is the best fix I've found. Throttle Tube and spring unwind will help, but not as much as PC. I suppose the only 'complete' fix is to trade for a 2008+ FJR or another model which doesn't have this problem, but since that is not in my budget that wasn't the best fix for me.

 
Has anyone tried advancing the TPS slightly? It helps a buttload on the FI-ed SV-650, I was wondering if anyone's tried it on the FJR. I didn't find anything with a search.

 
Has anyone tried advancing the TPS slightly? It helps a buttload on the FI-ed SV-650, I was wondering if anyone's tried it on the FJR. I didn't find anything with a search.
The Throttle Position Sensor sends a voltage to the ECU that changes with the mechanical movement of the throttle plates. The ECU converts the voltage to indicate throttle opening as a percentage. At idle the diAG screen will show 16-17 indicating that the throttle plates are open 16% to 17%, the amount necessary to flow enough air for the engine to idle at 1,100 rpm (give or take a few rpm). When the throttle is pinned open the diAG will read 99-100 indicating that the throttle plates are mechanically 99% to 100% open. The span of the TPS is fixed, you can't adjust the distance between 17% to 100%. The range is adjustable, if you drop the lower number to something like 14% the top reading will drop to 97%. If you raise the lower number to 20% then the top reading will be 103%. If I were to make a pretty sure bet, I would bet that the ECU disregards anything over 100% and simply sees it as 100%. The throttle opening percentage and especially the rate of position change are two important elements in the ECU determining the fuel injection trim. Which is a whole lot of words to say that advancing the TPS slightly probably won't help around idle and may hurt top end performance.

As to the opening post in this thread, the following is excerpted from something I wrote a while back. Because it was from a different issue this text may not follow this thread exactly but it does talk about the various reasons the '06 may have abrupt throttle issues.

================

The '06/'07 share the eccentric throttle pulley that causes the rate of RPM change to be non-linear, which is fixed by a G2 throttle tube. The '06/'07 were included in the ECU recall for altitude drivability issues. The '06 instrument panels on some early bikes were recalled for an instant MPG readout stuck at 17 mpg.

 

Separate from the non-linear throttle response is abrupt power delivery. Some bikes are worse than others, some riders are more sensitive than others. This is remediated for sure with a PCIII. Some people claim that changing the CO setting helped them. Search out the Barbarian Jumper that enables the CO settings to be adjusted.

 

No FJR has to have any of these modifications done or parts added, but when required the G2 throttle tube, a PCIII and perhaps unwinding the throttle spring one turn are sure fixes.

 

 

=====================

 

Surging: At a steady throttle, light engine load, the engine speed varies a small amount which feels like the throttle is being opened and closed a tiny amount even though it is being held steady. Sometimes fixed by CO adjustments, fixed with a PCIII.

 

Abrupt power delivery: When the throttle is closed the engine goes into a decel FI routine where fuel injection is basically turned off, then when power is asked for again there may be small hesitation without response as the throttle is rolled on, then suddenly you get all the throttle that you dialed up. Helped/fixed by a PCIII

 

Abrupt Throttle Response II: The Gen II throttle cam is eccentric (not round) causing the throttle to respond in greater proportion than what the operator intended. The steep ramp of the throttle cam is right around the 3k rpm range. A second issue are the gorilla springs on the throttle pulley making it very tiring to use and makes fine throttle control difficult. A G2 throttle tube & cam will neutralize the eccentric throttle cam. Some people acknowledge the risks and partially unwind the throttle springs to lighten up response.

 

Drive line lash: Free play between the engine output shaft and the rear wheel. With the bike on the center stand, engine off, in gear, rotate the rear wheel and note how much free rotation it has. This could possibly cause the same feel as abrupt power delivery and/or surging. No fix, not proven to be an issue.

 

Altitude sickness: Total lack of throttle response, bogging, very poor drivability. Often initiated by rapid altitude change, often reset back to normal operation by cycling the key off/on. ECU recall.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Has anyone tried advancing the TPS slightly? It helps a buttload on the FI-ed SV-650, I was wondering if anyone's tried it on the FJR. I didn't find anything with a search.
The Throttle Position Sensor sends a voltage to the ECU that changes with the mechanical movement of the throttle plates. The ECU converts the voltage to indicate throttle opening as a percentage. At idle the diAG screen will show 16-17 indicating that the throttle plates are open 16% to 17%, the amount necessary to flow enough air for the engine to idle at 1,100 rpm (give or take a few rpm). When the throttle is pinned open the diAG will read 99-100 indicating that the throttle plates are mechanically 99% to 100% open. The span of the TPS is fixed, you can't adjust the distance between 17% to 100%. The range is adjustable, if you drop the lower number to something like 14% the top reading will drop to 97%. If you raise the lower number to 20% then the top reading will be 103%. If I were to make a pretty sure bet, I would bet that the ECU disregards anything over 100% and simply sees it as 100%. The throttle opening percentage and especially the rate of position change are two important elements in the ECU determining the fuel injection trim. Which is a whole lot of words to say that advancing the TPS slightly probably won't help around idle and may hurt top end performance.

As to the opening post in this thread, the following is excerpted from something I wrote a while back. Because it was from a different issue this text may not follow this thread exactly but it does talk about the various reasons the '06 may have abrupt throttle issues.

================

The '06/'07 share the eccentric throttle pulley that causes the rate of RPM change to be non-linear, which is fixed by a G2 throttle tube. The '06/'07 were included in the ECU recall for altitude drivability issues. The '06 instrument panels on some early bikes were recalled for an instant MPG readout stuck at 17 mpg.

 

Separate from the non-linear throttle response is abrupt power delivery. Some bikes are worse than others, some riders are more sensitive than others. This is remediated for sure with a PCIII. Some people claim that changing the CO setting helped them. Search out the Barbarian Jumper that enables the CO settings to be adjusted.

 

No FJR has to have any of these modifications done or parts added, but when required the G2 throttle tube, a PCIII and perhaps unwinding the throttle spring one turn are sure fixes.

 

 

=====================

 

Surging: At a steady throttle, light engine load, the engine speed varies a small amount which feels like the throttle is being opened and closed a tiny amount even though it is being held steady. Sometimes fixed by CO adjustments, fixed with a PCIII.

 

Abrupt power delivery: When the throttle is closed the engine goes into a decel FI routine where fuel injection is basically turned off, then when power is asked for again there may be small hesitation without response as the throttle is rolled on, then suddenly you get all the throttle that you dialed up. Helped/fixed by a PCIII

 

Abrupt Throttle Response II: The Gen II throttle cam is eccentric (not round) causing the throttle to respond in greater proportion than what the operator intended. The steep ramp of the throttle cam is right around the 3k rpm range. A second issue are the gorilla springs on the throttle pulley making it very tiring to use and makes fine throttle control difficult. A G2 throttle tube & cam will neutralize the eccentric throttle cam. Some people acknowledge the risks and partially unwind the throttle springs to lighten up response.

 

Drive line lash: Free play between the engine output shaft and the rear wheel. With the bike on the center stand, engine off, in gear, rotate the rear wheel and note how much free rotation it has. This could possibly cause the same feel as abrupt power delivery and/or surging. No fix, not proven to be an issue.

 

Altitude sickness: Total lack of throttle response, bogging, very poor drivability. Often initiated by rapid altitude change, often reset back to normal operation by cycling the key off/on. ECU recall.
Thanks for this! "Abrupt power delivery" sounds dead on. I guess I'm in the market for a PClll!

 
I've got an 06 and had the same problem. So much so that I lovingly named my bike Lurch.

I put the g2 throttle tube on there but it didn't help a whole lot.

Then about a month ago I did the Barbarian mod and that cleaned it up to the point that I'm perfectly happy now. It was an easy mod to do and free. Was expecting the gas mieage to go down because of making the air/gas mix richer but it didn't.

 
I've got an 06 and had the same problem. So much so that I lovingly named my bike Lurch.

I put the g2 throttle tube on there but it didn't help a whole lot.

Then about a month ago I did the Barbarian mod and that cleaned it up to the point that I'm perfectly happy now. It was an easy mod to do and free. Was expecting the gas mieage to go down because of making the air/gas mix richer but it didn't.
What is the Barbarian mod? Sounds cool :)

 
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Here are the details:

https://www.g-mac.net/fjr1300/gen_2_fjr1300_bjm.pdf

Barbarian Jumper Mod (allows fuel injector mapping adjustment/CO setting changes)

Jon's excellent BJM (Barbarian Jumper Modification) pictoral is found here:

Typically '06 and '07's are factory set to: 5, 18, 18, 21,

and at least two 2008's are reported to be factory set at: 10,10,10,10. Thread discussion

 
I'm sure it is one of the above but since it hasn't been mentioned. Too much slack in the throttle cables can create some unwelcome fun. :lol:

 
Here are the details:

https://www.g-mac.net/fjr1300/gen_2_fjr1300_bjm.pdf

Barbarian Jumper Mod (allows fuel injector mapping adjustment/CO setting changes)

Jon's excellent BJM (Barbarian Jumper Modification) pictoral is found here:

Typically '06 and '07's are factory set to: 5, 18, 18, 21,

and at least two 2008's are reported to be factory set at: 10,10,10,10. Thread discussion
That is awesome. Thanks for the help!

 
I've got an 06 and had the same problem. So much so that I lovingly named my bike Lurch.

I put the g2 throttle tube on there but it didn't help a whole lot.

Then about a month ago I did the Barbarian mod and that cleaned it up to the point that I'm perfectly happy now. It was an easy mod to do and free. Was expecting the gas mieage to go down because of making the air/gas mix richer but it didn't.
I agree. I went 10 up on each cylinder, which might be a bit much, but the throttle snatch is greatly reduced. The altitude gremlin is still there (ECU recall is in order Me thinks), but no where near as bad.
 
Whoa. Let me get this straight, to help fix the snatchy throttle symptom, we swap two wires on the ECU and then tweak the air/fuel mixture by pressing the buttons?

Cool -- I might give that a try sometime.

I wish I had more data on how well this works. I'll do more searching -- hopefully more folks have already done it on Gen 2 bikes.

Thanks,

Dennis

 
Whoa. Let me get this straight, to help fix the snatchy throttle symptom, we swap two wires on the ECU and then tweak the air/fuel mixture by pressing the buttons?...I wish I had more data on how well this works...
If you can make the next Breakfast Club meeting Fred 'n I can supply lots of information. Heck, we may get carried away and include a fact or two too. Bring No-Doze :lol:

 
Keep in Mind the Following:

Write Down ALL your Original CO Settings before making ANY changes.

Some have Success with doing +3 or +5 or +7

Hope this helps...

 
Edit to continue: There is no harm in doing this and it is completely reversible as long you write down the starting CO values. It's fast and easy to fiddle with the settings. Most people are happy with the generic +7 bump up. The only true way to get it right is to use a 4 channel EGA with 4 rivnuts installed in the header pipes. [/Reader's Digest Condensed version]

Edit 2 too: I see I continue to be a slow typer and this has been covered.

 
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I wonder if someone can help me with this. I am running a PC5 (with auto tune)and loving it. I have no more problem with throttle snatch, and the bike is smooth and powerful. The G2 tube is nice to have, but the PC5 fixed the problem. I had never seen the instructions for the Barbarian Mod, though I had seen it mentioned in different threads. Would there be any point in doing this modification if one is running a Power Commander?

 
I wonder if someone can help me with this. I am running a PC5 (with auto tune)and loving it. I have no more problem with throttle snatch, and the bike is smooth and powerful. The G2 tube is nice to have, but the PC5 fixed the problem. I had never seen the instructions for the Barbarian Mod, though I had seen it mentioned in different threads. Would there be any point in doing this modification if one is running a Power Commander?
NO

 
I have an '09 and just to be different I bumped all of mine up to 15 (they were all at 0). The bike was transformed, now runs smoothly down to 25 MPH in 5th gear and pulls away from 25 MPH without hesitation. YMMV :rolleyes:

Don

 
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