Peter
Member
I just purchased a 2007 FJR. What octane should I be using?
What gas octane should I use in a 2007 FJR
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madmike2
Shtirrenuppenmeister
Okay, Peter, your a noobie so here's is one answer: Read the owners manual. IIRC it recommends 87 octane.
Or, second answer, you could clicky here for a past posting.
I found this by using the "search" function, typing in "octane" then scrolling down through the topic headings to this one. There are about 70-11 posts on gas or octane, but this one sums it up fairly well.
Third answer is: lookie here! The "Bin o' facts" is suggested reading when you register to the forum. The info is there.
Or, second answer, you could clicky here for a past posting.
I found this by using the "search" function, typing in "octane" then scrolling down through the topic headings to this one. There are about 70-11 posts on gas or octane, but this one sums it up fairly well.
Third answer is: lookie here! The "Bin o' facts" is suggested reading when you register to the forum. The info is there.
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nubfjr
Well-known member
read the owners manual, it says it in there
twowheelnut
R.I.P. Our Motorcycling Friend
Please for be tellink me vat eest dees "octane", yah? Eets gud for to catch feesh?
SkooterG
Purveyor of Crooked Facts
Peter, I don't know you so it's hard for me to answer your question, so I would say use whatever octane makes you feel better and does not give you indigestion.
For your FJR, 87 octane works just fine per the owner's manual.
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dcarver
Well-known member
Wow Peter, those meds you sold to SkooterG must have been really good!
Hey Peter, take all this with a grain o' salt...
Because lots' of the old time, worn out, crusty and old farts here who think they have already discussed each and every topic possibly regarding the FJR tend to get their panties in a bunch when a enthusiastic noobie asks a question such as you did..
It's Ok, it's a normal progression.. and after about 1,000 or so posts, you'll recall this one and grin.. OBTW, my comment about Skooter's meds working? Normally you would have been slammed, dude! Me thinks Skooter's new gurrlfriend is helping.. :yahoo:
Hey Peter, take all this with a grain o' salt...
Because lots' of the old time, worn out, crusty and old farts here who think they have already discussed each and every topic possibly regarding the FJR tend to get their panties in a bunch when a enthusiastic noobie asks a question such as you did..
It's Ok, it's a normal progression.. and after about 1,000 or so posts, you'll recall this one and grin..
OBTW, my comment about Skooter's meds working? Normally you would have been slammed, dude! Me thinks Skooter's new gurrlfriend is helping.. :yahoo: 
Regular unleaded is fine in any vehicle unless it causes knock. Up the octain until the knock stops. That's the ONLY reason to use a higher octane.
charismaticmegafauna
Well-known member
Mmmm... absolute statements: "....the ONLY reason to...." "....fine in any vehicle...". Some engines have knock sensors and take advantage of higher octane fuels to use more ignition advance for more power and economy. These engines may have combustion chambers of a certain design; a high compression ratio; or, forced induction (supercharging or turbocharging). That's why there are other octane rated fuels available and the reason/s for same.
An engine so configured and equipped (w/a knock sensor) may be forced to run at less than optimum timing settings by the use of low octane fuel.
An engine so configured and equipped (w/a knock sensor) may be forced to run at less than optimum timing settings by the use of low octane fuel.
v65
ouch
Hence the problem with these threads, it takes a lot of work to flesh out the truth - which has been done before. For example, you failed to mention that a vehicle designed to burn low octane fuel may not properly burn high octane fuel, and so in this case more can actually be worse.
Correct me if I am wrong, but the FJR is designed for 87 octane, I don't recall anyone claiming more performance from higher octane fuels on this platform.
charismaticmegafauna
Well-known member
I don't think it's that 'cut and dried'? The owner's manual says: "....designed to use regular unleaded gasoline with a pump octane number of 86 or higher....". It's the 'or higher' part that tends to throw some doubt into what the engineers had in mind when they designed the combustion chamber and set the compression ratio. A compression ratio of 10.8 : 1 -- has historically been a relatively high one for I.C. engines and often such compression ratios need and/or benefit from higher octane gasoline ("swirl" combustion chambers, notwithstanding).
The manual also mentions the use of Gasohol (ethanol) -- and OKs its use up to 10%. In many areas where Gasohol is available it (often) has a higher octane rating, than unleaded regular, (due to the octane boosting effects of ethanol).
So, I'm just not sure what fuel the FJR was "designed" for...? I read '86 and above'.
Whether or not there is any benefit (or handicap) to any certain fuel usage....? (Maybe?)Only those who post here know..... :huh:
The manual also mentions the use of Gasohol (ethanol) -- and OKs its use up to 10%. In many areas where Gasohol is available it (often) has a higher octane rating, than unleaded regular, (due to the octane boosting effects of ethanol).
So, I'm just not sure what fuel the FJR was "designed" for...? I read '86 and above'.
Whether or not there is any benefit (or handicap) to any certain fuel usage....? (Maybe?)Only those who post here know.....
:huh:
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yep. absolutes. you absolutely failed to reference the other threads where this has been hashed out in painful detail many times before. until that happens then i'm asbsolutely convinced that my opinion is mine to cherish and shout from the rooftops and no one but me is right other than when i'm wrong.
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v65
ouch
I am tempted to go into a long reply, explaining what I mean by designed, discussing ambient temps, combustion chamber design, etc. BUT, I think you already know all of this, and as Bounce correctly points out is has been hashed to death.
So lets keep it simple: modern engines have knock sensors. Unless that technology has changed dramatically the engine has to actually knock first for the sensor to retard the timing. I have consistently run my Feej on 87 octane gas in temps into the mid 90's and have never heard it knock.
Pete, did you get an answer out of all this :huh:
charismaticmegafauna
Well-known member
sprint_st
Well-known member
Let's see, can't tell him something he doesn't know???? The logical infers that they very well knew the answer before they asked the question and therefore begs the question, why did they ask the question at all?
"this is MY" first attempt, does that mean that a game is afoot?
Knock sensor or no knock sensor, the idea that 10.8 to 1 or any other specific ratio defines where detonation begins with a particular octane is pretty much BS and has been for quite some time. Engine design, more specifically, head and flow design have made that point a variable on an engine by engine basis. But since nothing is actually new, maybe I'm attempting to interlope into a future "hash to death" plot.
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The FJR has no knock sensor to protect it if it gets fuel with too low of an octane rating. That is the rider's responsibility in this case.
IF the engine had a knock sensor, as most automotive engines do these days, AND you put too low of an octane fuel in the engine you will likely NOT hear it knock. The engine will just be forced to run in a reduced spark/reduced boost/reduced power mode to protect it from detonation without you knowing it necessarily. The knock systems are tuned so accurately that they will sense spark knock long before you could hear it. It is NOT a good idea to assume that an engine with a knock sensor will knock before it corrects the spark. You will likely feel the loss of power, poorer driveablity, lower fuel economy resulting from the detonation protection from the knock system but do NOT think you will hear it knock.
I don't know about you guys but I fancy myself pretty good at hearing detonation.....and I wouldn't bet a nickel on being able to "hear" detonation or spark knock on an FJR. Maybe if you were stopped still and revving and clutching the shit out of it to get it unstuck from the sand bar you stopped in...but moving down the road....???...not likely you'll hear spark knock. Way too much engine shrouding, way too much wind noise and liquid cooled engines just do not make the obscene noises when they spark knock like air cooled dirt bikes did.
There are WAY more factors invovled with fuel octane requirements than just the compression ratio. The combustion chamber design is far far more critical than the absolute compression ratio. Even the cylinder diameter makes the compression ratio comparison moot. Compression ratio is worse than useless as a guideline for guessing octane rating....it is very misleading.
Within all practical reason premium and regular fuels burn at the same rate and contain the same energy content. The idea that an engine is "designed for regular" and will not make as much power on premium is an old wives tale at best. There are some highly specialized racing engines that will run correctly on only the exact fuel they were designed for but general use automotive/motorcycle engines are not in this category. Similarily, yes, if the engine runs fine on regular with no detonation then you will not get any more power by using premium. The regular fuel requirement by Yamaha indicates the FJR engine is pretty tolerant of fuel quality and is not likey to barf using regular fuel.
Personally, I use premium or the best fuel available in my FJR. Like some people feel better using synthetic oil....I feel better putting premium in it. Rationally, the engine is probably fine on regular and I would have no hesitation using regular if need be. Why premium? I know Warsz will pipe up and tell me I am full of shit but my experience with fuel sample data taken from the field over the past 3 decades has shown me that premium fuels from any given brand tend to have better detergent and additive packages in them. Better and more consistent. Not always true but the deck is stacked more in your favor. Secondly, the use of premium gives the motor a little cushion for abnormal conditions that might make detonation more likely....carbon deposits, high coolant temps, high air temps, etc. Never know when you might get stuck in traffic .... or stuck in a sand bar. The price difference is really not that great so for little bit more there is simply some insurance in buying premium that I like.
Using premium in a "regular" fuel engine is NOT going to cause any damage, it will not raise the exhaust temps, it will not cause overheating or burned valves or any of the other things the internet experts blather about. It just might keep injector and valve deposits from happening if the additives are better compared to regular...which they generally are.
Higher altitude operation causes engine power loss due to the lower barometric pressure/lower air density. Since cylinder pressure is lowered due to the less dense air getting compressed the octane requirements of the engine decrease with altitude (assuming normally aspirated engines for the moment) which is why you see lower octane numbers on the pump for any given grade of fuel in Denver compared to New Orleans. The engines need less octane at altitude so the fuel is blended accordingly.
Hot weather, high barometer, dry/low humidity all tend to exacerbate detonation. Which is why you might want to consider premium for that blast across Death Valley in the summer. Regular fuel is probably going to be borderline for detonation under those conditions in an FJR so mid or premium is better advice. Similarily, if you are fueling up in Durango and heading south you might want to fill with Premium as the chances of getting some lower octane "regular" at altitude are greater and you would be burning that fuel at much lower altitude, in dryer conditions and much higher engine loads/speeds...potentially. Think ahead.
Obviously, there are a LOT of factors affecting the octane requirements of any given engine and engines in general. Generalized, far ranging recommendations regarding octane requirements should be avoided or taken with a large grain of salt unless ALL the specifics about the situation are understood. What works for one engine is potentially death to the next regarding fuel octane requirements. There are just too many variables to cover even in a very longwinded post.
That is what is nice about using premium all the time. It takes the guesswork out of it. Besides, other than a few pennies more cost, there is absolutely no disadvantage to using premium. So now all the guys that use synthetic oil will tell me about saving money on gas...
And, yes, I know that 50,000 FJR's run wide open across the hot low desert all the time on regular with no problems...for now.... MINE would be the one to get some slightly off octane regular and blow up. So I use premium for piece of mind.
IF the engine had a knock sensor, as most automotive engines do these days, AND you put too low of an octane fuel in the engine you will likely NOT hear it knock. The engine will just be forced to run in a reduced spark/reduced boost/reduced power mode to protect it from detonation without you knowing it necessarily. The knock systems are tuned so accurately that they will sense spark knock long before you could hear it. It is NOT a good idea to assume that an engine with a knock sensor will knock before it corrects the spark. You will likely feel the loss of power, poorer driveablity, lower fuel economy resulting from the detonation protection from the knock system but do NOT think you will hear it knock.
I don't know about you guys but I fancy myself pretty good at hearing detonation.....and I wouldn't bet a nickel on being able to "hear" detonation or spark knock on an FJR. Maybe if you were stopped still and revving and clutching the shit out of it to get it unstuck from the sand bar you stopped in...but moving down the road....???...not likely you'll hear spark knock. Way too much engine shrouding, way too much wind noise and liquid cooled engines just do not make the obscene noises when they spark knock like air cooled dirt bikes did.
There are WAY more factors invovled with fuel octane requirements than just the compression ratio. The combustion chamber design is far far more critical than the absolute compression ratio. Even the cylinder diameter makes the compression ratio comparison moot. Compression ratio is worse than useless as a guideline for guessing octane rating....it is very misleading.
Within all practical reason premium and regular fuels burn at the same rate and contain the same energy content. The idea that an engine is "designed for regular" and will not make as much power on premium is an old wives tale at best. There are some highly specialized racing engines that will run correctly on only the exact fuel they were designed for but general use automotive/motorcycle engines are not in this category. Similarily, yes, if the engine runs fine on regular with no detonation then you will not get any more power by using premium. The regular fuel requirement by Yamaha indicates the FJR engine is pretty tolerant of fuel quality and is not likey to barf using regular fuel.
Personally, I use premium or the best fuel available in my FJR. Like some people feel better using synthetic oil....I feel better putting premium in it.
Rationally, the engine is probably fine on regular and I would have no hesitation using regular if need be. Why premium? I know Warsz will pipe up and tell me I am full of shit but my experience with fuel sample data taken from the field over the past 3 decades has shown me that premium fuels from any given brand tend to have better detergent and additive packages in them. Better and more consistent. Not always true but the deck is stacked more in your favor. Secondly, the use of premium gives the motor a little cushion for abnormal conditions that might make detonation more likely....carbon deposits, high coolant temps, high air temps, etc. Never know when you might get stuck in traffic .... or stuck in a sand bar. The price difference is really not that great so for little bit more there is simply some insurance in buying premium that I like.Using premium in a "regular" fuel engine is NOT going to cause any damage, it will not raise the exhaust temps, it will not cause overheating or burned valves or any of the other things the internet experts blather about. It just might keep injector and valve deposits from happening if the additives are better compared to regular...which they generally are.
Higher altitude operation causes engine power loss due to the lower barometric pressure/lower air density. Since cylinder pressure is lowered due to the less dense air getting compressed the octane requirements of the engine decrease with altitude (assuming normally aspirated engines for the moment) which is why you see lower octane numbers on the pump for any given grade of fuel in Denver compared to New Orleans. The engines need less octane at altitude so the fuel is blended accordingly.
Hot weather, high barometer, dry/low humidity all tend to exacerbate detonation. Which is why you might want to consider premium for that blast across Death Valley in the summer. Regular fuel is probably going to be borderline for detonation under those conditions in an FJR so mid or premium is better advice. Similarily, if you are fueling up in Durango and heading south you might want to fill with Premium as the chances of getting some lower octane "regular" at altitude are greater and you would be burning that fuel at much lower altitude, in dryer conditions and much higher engine loads/speeds...potentially. Think ahead.
Obviously, there are a LOT of factors affecting the octane requirements of any given engine and engines in general. Generalized, far ranging recommendations regarding octane requirements should be avoided or taken with a large grain of salt unless ALL the specifics about the situation are understood. What works for one engine is potentially death to the next regarding fuel octane requirements. There are just too many variables to cover even in a very longwinded post.
That is what is nice about using premium all the time. It takes the guesswork out of it. Besides, other than a few pennies more cost, there is absolutely no disadvantage to using premium. So now all the guys that use synthetic oil will tell me about saving money on gas...
And, yes, I know that 50,000 FJR's run wide open across the hot low desert all the time on regular with no problems...for now.... MINE would be the one to get some slightly off octane regular and blow up. So I use premium for piece of mind.
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twowheelnut
R.I.P. Our Motorcycling Friend
Me thinks you guys have never watched a thrilling episode of Bill Dance Outdoors, have you?
Jestal,The FJR has no knock sensor to protect it if it gets fuel with too low of an octane rating. That is the rider's responsibility in this case.
IF the engine had a knock sensor, as most automotive engines do these days, AND you put too low of an octane fuel in the engine you will likely NOT hear it knock. The engine will just be forced to run in a reduced spark/reduced boost/reduced power mode to protect it from detonation without you knowing it necessarily. The knock systems are tuned so accurately that they will sense spark knock long before you could hear it. It is NOT a good idea to assume that an engine with a knock sensor will knock before it corrects the spark. You will likely feel the loss of power, poorer driveablity, lower fuel economy resulting from the detonation protection from the knock system but do NOT think you will hear it knock.
I don't know about you guys but I fancy myself pretty good at hearing detonation.....and I wouldn't bet a nickel on being able to "hear" detonation or spark knock on an FJR. Maybe if you were stopped still and revving and clutching the shit out of it to get it unstuck from the sand bar you stopped in...but moving down the road....???...not likely you'll hear spark knock. Way too much engine shrouding, way too much wind noise and liquid cooled engines just do not make the obscene noises when they spark knock like air cooled dirt bikes did.
There are WAY more factors invovled with fuel octane requirements than just the compression ratio. The combustion chamber design is far far more critical than the absolute compression ratio. Even the cylinder diameter makes the compression ratio comparison moot. Compression ratio is worse than useless as a guideline for guessing octane rating....it is very misleading.
Within all practical reason premium and regular fuels burn at the same rate and contain the same energy content. The idea that an engine is "designed for regular" and will not make as much power on premium is an old wives tale at best. There are some highly specialized racing engines that will run correctly on only the exact fuel they were designed for but general use automotive/motorcycle engines are not in this category. Similarily, yes, if the engine runs fine on regular with no detonation then you will not get any more power by using premium. The regular fuel requirement by Yamaha indicates the FJR engine is pretty tolerant of fuel quality and is not likey to barf using regular fuel.
Personally, I use premium or the best fuel available in my FJR. Like some people feel better using synthetic oil....I feel better putting premium in it.
Using premium in a "regular" fuel engine is NOT going to cause any damage, it will not raise the exhaust temps, it will not cause overheating or burned valves or any of the other things the internet experts blather about. It just might keep injector and valve deposits from happening if the additives are better compared to regular...which they generally are.
Higher altitude operation causes engine power loss due to the lower barometric pressure/lower air density. Since cylinder pressure is lowered due to the less dense air getting compressed the octane requirements of the engine decrease with altitude (assuming normally aspirated engines for the moment) which is why you see lower octane numbers on the pump for any given grade of fuel in Denver compared to New Orleans. The engines need less octane at altitude so the fuel is blended accordingly.
Hot weather, high barometer, dry/low humidity all tend to exacerbate detonation. Which is why you might want to consider premium for that blast across Death Valley in the summer. Regular fuel is probably going to be borderline for detonation under those conditions in an FJR so mid or premium is better advice. Similarily, if you are fueling up in Durango and heading south you might want to fill with Premium as the chances of getting some lower octane "regular" at altitude are greater and you would be burning that fuel at much lower altitude, in dryer conditions and much higher engine loads/speeds...potentially. Think ahead.
Obviously, there are a LOT of factors affecting the octane requirements of any given engine and engines in general. Generalized, far ranging recommendations regarding octane requirements should be avoided or taken with a large grain of salt unless ALL the specifics about the situation are understood. What works for one engine is potentially death to the next regarding fuel octane requirements. There are just too many variables to cover even in a very longwinded post.
That is what is nice about using premium all the time. It takes the guesswork out of it. Besides, other than a few pennies more cost, there is absolutely no disadvantage to using premium. So now all the guys that use synthetic oil will tell me about saving money on gas...
And, yes, I know that 50,000 FJR's run wide open across the hot low desert all the time on regular with no problems...for now.... MINE would be the one to get some slightly off octane regular and blow up. So I use premium for piece of mind.
For once we are on the same page. I agree with ever word. I think there is hope after all. :lol:
Truely scary......
Are you SURE you read my post carefully? Not ONE thing to disagree on? MMMMMMMMMM, Pie.
If a train is traveling west at 50 miles per hour, and a FJR pointed east is revving at 6000 rpms in one of the box cars, how fast is the FJR traveling relative to the ground?
The question was, what octane to use in an '07 FJR. The correct answer was given: 87, i.e. the lowest pump octane offered. (85 in some places is still fine.)
Also correctly noted was that IF knock was noted, THEN a higher octane would be a good idea. Note that ambient temps and elevation changes may effect performance. Also note that if you dump the clutch at low rpms, you might get some knock too. Not an indication you need higher octane, but that you need some more revs before letting out the clutch.
mmmmmmmmm, Pie.
If a train is traveling west at 50 miles per hour, and a FJR pointed east is revving at 6000 rpms in one of the box cars, how fast is the FJR traveling relative to the ground?
The question was, what octane to use in an '07 FJR. The correct answer was given: 87, i.e. the lowest pump octane offered. (85 in some places is still fine.)
Also correctly noted was that IF knock was noted, THEN a higher octane would be a good idea. Note that ambient temps and elevation changes may effect performance. Also note that if you dump the clutch at low rpms, you might get some knock too. Not an indication you need higher octane, but that you need some more revs before letting out the clutch.
mmmmmmmmm, Pie.
