ABS not working, ABS light works okay, 2004 FJR

Gyrobob · Apr 11, 2013

My 2004 FJR antilock braking system is not working. The rear wheel locks up. Here are the clues:
-- The ABS light behaves normally,.. it comes on for a second when the ignition is turned on, then goes off.
-- The rear tire was replaced a while back by the dealer in Newnan, GA. I did not check the ABS right away. I wish I would have.
-- I don't know if the front wheel ABS works or not.
-- The battery is getting tired. A new one is on the way. Cranking a cold motor cranks over slower than usual, but it starts reliably. Today in traffic the bike stalled, and would not restart right away. I waited for a couple of minutes, and got it started again. I'm not riding it anymore until the battery is replaced.
-- 18,000 miles on the bike
-- It had not been ridden for a few months prior to this morning's ride.

-- I don't see anything obviously broken, leaking, hanging down, etc. in the rear wheel caliper area.
-- The rear brake fluid has not been replaced.

That's all I can think of at the moment. I did check around the forum for ABS situations, but I have not found one just like this.

Thanks for any help.

Gyrobob

Fred W · Apr 11, 2013

You are in the same boat as this other guy.

Read his thread

TomInPA · Apr 11, 2013

It's likely unrelated, but when was clutch and brake fluid last changed? Also, when the rear wheel was replaced, the ABS sensor ring must be properly aligned. there is a single mark on the brake caliper mount and two marks on the ABS sensor ring. Check against this:

wfooshee · Apr 11, 2013

Go to the thread linked by Fred in post #2, and in post #4 of that thread, follow the link for Ionbeam's Most Excellent ABS Test Procedure.

The light only monitors ABS electronics (and maybe not completely at that,) and it has no clue if there's anything mechanically wrong with the system, like a stuck solenoid or something. Basically, correct function of the light is less useful than you would think. Much less.

Gyrobob · Apr 11, 2013

Where might there be a step by step procedure on bleeding the brakes? I have the equipment, but not a service manual, and, after popping the panels off the right side, it looks complicated. The fluid in the master cylinder, though, looks pretty clear. The bike spends very little time outside when not being ridden.

TomInPA · Apr 11, 2013

There is nothing special about bleeding the brakes. I use a large syringe to empty the old fluid from the master cylinder and refill, then just flush throgh the system by pushing the pedal while opening the bleeder (use a piece of tubing to collect fluid). You don't actually bleed the ABS block, the fluid just pushes through. Some guys will do a fluid flush and then activate the block, and re-flush. Best policy is to just do it every year. Brake fluid is moisture contaminated by time, not miles. You're probably way overdue.

RadioHowie · Apr 11, 2013

Another '04 ABS pump bites the dust. Sigh...........

Gyrobob · Apr 11, 2013

TomInCA said:
There is nothing special about bleeding the brakes. I use a large syringe to empty the old fluid from the master cylinder and refill, then just flush throgh the system by pushing the pedal while opening the bleeder (use a piece of tubing to collect fluid). You don't actually bleed the ABS block, the fluid just pushes through. Some guys will do a fluid flush and then activate the block, and re-flush. Best policy is to just do it every year. Brake fluid is moisture contaminated by time, not miles. You're probably way overdue.

What is the order of bleeding/flushing? There is the master cylinder for the brake lever on the handlebar, then the master cylinder low on the right side of the bike,... and then three calipers.

RadioHowie · Apr 11, 2013

The two front calipers are separate from the rear on your 04, so it doesn't matter if you do rear first or fronts first, but when doing the fronts, it's best to do the port side caliper first, then the starboard side. Don't have a frickin' clue why there's a difference, but that's what's always been recommended here on the forum.

Since you know the rear ABS isn't working, I'd suggest doing that first. Don't do just a simple bleed...do a serious flush, to replace ALL the fluid in the rear reservoir. You might get lucky and free up the pump spools. Don't hold your breath, though...good luck trying to re-activate your ABS. It's an ongoing issue with the older FJRs, and will probably start showing up any day on the Gen IIs.

escapefjrtist · Apr 11, 2013

RadioHowie said:
<snip>...and will probably start showing up any day on the Gen IIs.

Why exactly, age?

Flush the fluid, cycle the ABS regularly and there's no reason for the spools to sieze.

--G

wfooshee · Apr 11, 2013

Apparently if the mechanical bits don't get "exercised" they get frozen, and can't be made to work after that.

dcarver · Apr 11, 2013

escapefjrtist said:
RadioHowie said:

<snip>...and will probably start showing up any day on the Gen IIs.

Click to expand...

Why exactly, age?

Flush the fluid, cycle the ABS regularly and there's no reason for the spools to sieze.

--G

--G, I cycle my ABS front, rear every day.

Not sure if it helps or not, I just like the decel rush and whap-whap-whap of ABS..

...and to be familiar with ABS engagement, cornering, steering.

Good luck to OP.

My 2006 KrZy8 with 160+ probably needs a good brake flush... Tx for the reminder.

escapefjrtist · Apr 11, 2013

I don't exercise the ABS daily, but for sure every couple months.

Three weeks ago on a ride with Fontanaman. Slick concrete bridge, damn near gathered up a small ankle-biter dog. Got both ends to chatter pretty hard. Most times, I find a sandy spot and all it takes is a light squeeze.

YMMV

--G

Gyrobob · Apr 12, 2013

Last night I bled and flushed front and rear systems. I used a whole 12 oz can of DOT4, about 8 oz in the rear and rest in the front.

I like to use an EZE Bleeder tool which forces fluid from the caliper to the reservior,.. the way bubbles want to travel naturally.
-- I did it both ways -- the old way moving the fluid from the reservior to the nipple on the caliper, and then alternating with the EZE Bleeder way moving the fluid in the opposite direction.
-- Also I cycled fluid through the cylinder attached to the brake pedal as well. I'm pretty sure there is no old fluid left in there.

All the old fluid did not look bad at all. It was darn near as clear as the fresh fluid. Hardly any discoloration.

I'll take the thing out for a test as soon as the new battery arrives.

Where is the ABS diagnostic connector port located?

Fred W · Apr 12, 2013

The rear brake ABS activates quite often on my 1st gen. The front, not so often. I have engaged it in non-panic situations so that I would know what it feels like, but only fater I first ascertained that that the ABS would actually work. You can just use the jumper and go through the Diag tests to exercise them fully and to move some fluid through the pump and spools. That is all that you are trying to accomplish here. No need to risk a front wheel lock-up (if they happen not to be working already).

Fred W · Apr 12, 2013

Gyrobob said:
I'll take the thing out for a test as soon as the new battery arrives.

Where is the ABS diagnostic connector port located?

Read this post. It tells all about running the ABS Diags.

Gyrobob · Apr 12, 2013

I did the ABS diagnostic checks. Bummer. Both systems were frozen.

Out of desperation, I heated up the ABS spool assembly with a hair dryer and tapped on it while doing the ABS exercise-the-system routine. Lo and behold, the front system reacts to the tests properly now. I have been tapping and heating and testing a lot to hopefully get the rear system to free up but to no avail. Sometimes it seems like the pedal pulses a tiny bit, but then it goes dead again. Maybe sitting in fresh fluid after a while might help. Hope hope hope.

RadioHowie · Apr 12, 2013

Maybe more heat than a heat dryer, like a REAL heat gun, or careful, judicious application of flame with a propane torch might do the trick?

One of these little guys...

Best of luck, and if it works out, PLEASE let us know (especially those of us with dead ABS units!)

Gyrobob · Apr 12, 2013

I sure would like to know what is inside the ABS pump thingy.
-- I am the type that dearly loves to disassemble things just to see what it inside, but often ruins the item as part of the disassembly.
-- On the other hand there have probably been a hundred times in my 66 years I have disassembled something that was not working and was not disassemble-able, fixed it, and found some way to fasten it back together.

The latest was a few weeks ago -- one of the power door latches on a Corvette was not working, and the unit was riveted together with really looooong rivets.
-- The replacement part was hundreds of bucks.
-- I ground off the rivets, cleaned up the electrical stuff inside, did a little soldering, reassembled with looooong skinny screws, and it works fine now.

If I thought there was anyway to take apart the ABS pump spool thingy, I would. It is possible if it could be taken apart, it could be made to work by just getting the gunk out of it. Reassembly might be a trick, though.

ABS not working, ABS light works okay, 2004 FJR

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