2nd Gear Problem

[FJR2005*01880]

Nice outcome 01880. Sounds like the dealer you're working with is a keeper. With new parts in the tranny and everything back to spec, you'll have many miles of enjoyment. Good catch before taking delivery and glad it worked out.
--G

Thanks

 

[Randy]

I'd be curious to see the complete parts list. $1000 sounds salty. I realize it isn't coming out of your pocket, but, I don't think it should be that much.

 

[FJR2005*01880]

I'd be curious to see the complete parts list. $1000 sounds salty. I realize it isn't coming out of your pocket, but, I don't think it should be that much.

If i get a copy of it in a week or so I'll let you know...

 

[madmike2]

I'd be curious to see the complete parts list. $1000 sounds salty. I realize it isn't coming out of your pocket, but, I don't think it should be that much.

If i get a copy of it in a week or so I'll let you know...

You don't suppose they "padded" the bill to the sales department, do you?

I mean...er...every nut, bolt, screw, gasket, special tool, coffee breaks, etc., etc., etc.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

The finale:... It was bent and torn shift forks as well as some other gearing problem that I couldn't understand fully ...The parts are available and are on order. It was $1000 in parts and $1800 in labor for a total of $2800.

$2800 -- Yikes...!

Gives meaning to the term: 'cost of repair' -- the labor, $1800, is 18 hours @ $100/hr (24 hours -- 3 eight-hour days -- @ $75/hr). I wonder what the 'flat rate' manual says?

What is the service department's hourly shop rate?

You don't suppose they "padded" the bill to the sales department, do you?I mean...er...every nut, bolt, screw, gasket, special tool, coffee breaks, etc., etc., etc.

The price of the parts can be looked-up on-line -- and precision gears and shafts prices do add-up. If I were paying, I'd want to see, and have explained, the damaged parts.

Really good/successful service departments do include all the little incidental items used in the repair -- if they're needed in the repair, whoever gets them should pay for them. :blink:

 

[RadioHowie]

Hmmmm.....I smell a Y.E.S. the new owner isn't aware of that the shop is gonna charge back to the Mother Ship.

18 hours @ $100/hour slots in nicely with the rates around my neck of the woods, plus the time to yank the motor, split the case, fix the problem, put it back together and re-install the motor.

Yeah...I can see that all being an 18 hour job. Hell, only took me 8 months to replace a motor.

 

[FJR2005*01880]

Hmmmm.....I smell a Y.E.S. the new owner isn't aware of that the shop is gonna charge back to the Mother Ship.
18 hours @ $100/hour slots in nicely with the rates around my neck of the woods, plus the time to yank the motor, split the case, fix the problem, put it back together and re-install the motor.

Yeah...I can see that all being an 18 hour job. Hell, only took me 8 months to replace a motor.

I don't think they sent it back to the mothership but maybe you're right

 

[RadioHowie]

Hmmmm.....I smell a Y.E.S. the new owner isn't aware of that the shop is gonna charge back to the Mother Ship.
18 hours @ $100/hour slots in nicely with the rates around my neck of the woods, plus the time to yank the motor, split the case, fix the problem, put it back together and re-install the motor.

Yeah...I can see that all being an 18 hour job. Hell, only took me 8 months to replace a motor.

I don't think they sent it back to the mothership but maybe you're right

I didn't mean to imply that the dealer would send the bike/motor/transmission back to Yamaha, only that perhaps they were charging the costs back to the Company.

Hard to believe they'd eat those costs just out of "good will".

 

[FJR2005*01880]

Hmmmm.....I smell a Y.E.S. the new owner isn't aware of that the shop is gonna charge back to the Mother Ship.
18 hours @ $100/hour slots in nicely with the rates around my neck of the woods, plus the time to yank the motor, split the case, fix the problem, put it back together and re-install the motor.

Yeah...I can see that all being an 18 hour job. Hell, only took me 8 months to replace a motor.

I don't think they sent it back to the mothership but maybe you're right

I didn't mean to imply that the dealer would send the bike/motor/transmission back to Yamaha, only that perhaps they were charging the costs back to the Company.

Hard to believe they'd eat those costs just out of "good will".

Well if it is good will...its the first dealership I've been to that exemplifies that point

 

[Wee Willy]

Mike -- if it's an '05, then the OP's "AE" designation is incorrect, since all '05's have clutches. His info shows it to be an '05 with ABS, which makes it an FJR1300A.
I'm thinking that it's probably a good thing the dealer still has it and is willing to address the issue. They likely have the tranny apart (noting 9 hour estimate).

Not gonna do a search, but this has gotta be caused by damaged dogs or bent internal shift forks, doesn't it? And if so, it's more likely than not caused by previous owner hammering on the shift lever at the wrong time under the wrong conditions. Either way, once fixed, I wouldn't expect a problem later -- if the dealer has the tranny open, they're likely gonna make right whatever they find there.

Would they XSB? I wonder who's footing the bill for this repair. If it's the dealership, they may take a "good enuf" approach and cut costs by not replacing each and every item not found to be within spec. Indeed, they might night even run it completely to ground.

Or is it still under warranty? If so and the problem persists, it will only come back so maybe they'll do the right thing and fix it the way we would if it were our personal bike and we didn't want a recurrence. Not real sure about this one...I'd need more info before I would simply take the dealer's position as the final say.

They will definitely need to open the tranny just to see what's going on. I would want to see and understand the HW and their intended fix before consummating this one.

Just sayin'.

W2

 

[exskibum]

Mike -- if it's an '05, then the OP's "AE" designation is incorrect, since all '05's have clutches. His info shows it to be an '05 with ABS, which makes it an FJR1300A.
I'm thinking that it's probably a good thing the dealer still has it and is willing to address the issue. They likely have the tranny apart (noting 9 hour estimate).

Not gonna do a search, but this has gotta be caused by damaged dogs or bent internal shift forks, doesn't it? And if so, it's more likely than not caused by previous owner hammering on the shift lever at the wrong time under the wrong conditions. Either way, once fixed, I wouldn't expect a problem later -- if the dealer has the tranny open, they're likely gonna make right whatever they find there.

Would they XSB? I wonder who's footing the bill for this repair. If it's the dealership, they may take a "good enuf" approach and cut costs by not replacing each and every item not found to be within spec. Indeed, they might night even run it completely to ground.

Or is it still under warranty? If so and the problem persists, it will only come back so maybe they'll do the right thing and fix it the way we would if it were our personal bike and we didn't want a recurrence. Not real sure about this one...I'd need more info before I would simply take the dealer's position as the final say.

They will definitely need to open the tranny just to see what's going on. I would want to see and understand the HW and their intended fix before consummating this one.

Just sayin'.

W2

Well, the quality of a dealer's service and the integrity with which they deal with a customer clearly depends on the dealer, but let me explain what I meant.

Like you said, they need to open the tranny, and just doing that (and putting it back together) is not an insignificant amount of the time involved. Given the two almost certain causes for symptoms that really aren't going to go away without addressing the dogs or the shift levers, I don't see much benefit to a shyster dealer in whatever few shortcuts might even be available in this situation. Keeping in mind that we're talking about constant mesh trannies, the damage is likely to be limited to the fork and dogs for second gear, and not likely to involve trashed gear teeth damaging other gears or gear pieces floating around to grenade things like you might find in an abused auto tranny. Trying to grind or undercut damaged dogs on gears, instead of just putting in new parts isn't the sort of thing I'd expect from a dealer's service department that is working on a brand they sell when those parts are still available, either.

That's mostly what I was getting at -- once a service department makes the commitment to take this tranny apart, they might as well fix it. I agree that it's likely that they took advantage of a YES warranty, and for a dealer, it probably wouldn't be that difficult to backdate the first report of a problem (if they needed to) -- either when the old owner allegedly brought the bike in complaining of the shifting problem or the date the dealer agreed to buy/take the trade in/consign the bike. It is an '05, many of which are still under YES warranty coverage (mine just expired this last Friday). And if YES is covering it, there's REALLY no reason for the dealer to fubar the repair.

Now, about dealers in general -- I agree with you. The dealer I bought my FJR from in Carson City wouldn't lift a finger to help on anything once the $$ were in their pocket from the sale. I finally gave up with them and stopped spending money in their parts and accessories department for anything. I moved back over the hill in '06, and the dealer I go to here (ROSEVILLE YAMAHA) is the exact opposite. Beyond just doing a good job, Zac, Dean and the whole operation have gone way above and beyond for me in taking care of repair issues, getting me their price on some repainting from the top notch shop next door to them, and in going to bat with Yamaha for me over my previous dealer's screw up in registering my YES warranty. If they tell me a certain state of facts exists, their track record with me and a number of other forum members allows me to rely on it. Who the dealer is, and who the service manager is makes a difference.

 

[RadioHowie]

Very good assessment, Exski....

Who wrote it for ya???

 

[Wee Willy]

That's mostly what I was getting at --

Yeah, understand. I wasn't questioning your position so much as I was wondering out loud. If I were in our hero's position, I would make sure I very clearly understood the situation. And I would invoke the "trust but verify" approach with the dealer.

Thanks for the insight.

W2

 

[FJR2005*01880]

I should be getting a copy of the work they did...I'll post it hopefully within a week on this site

 

[FJR2005*01880]

*****Update*****

Some of the parts were not in stock in the US so they ordered them directly from Japan and they will be in this Friday. The bike should be ready mid week next week and I'll ask for a report to know what they did and then post it. 3 weeks in waiting but I think it will be worth it...

 

[FJR2005*01880]

Update Two:

Two of the parts are on back order...aggravated but nothing I can do right now...

 

[madmike2]

As frustrating as the situation is...and just for a little perspective...

......some of us gave our dealers a $500 deposit, sent to Yamaha, for our FJRs and then waited months. Uh....Feb-Aug of '03 for my '04. We do understand.

We may not have much empathy or sympathy but we understand.

Trust me, once it's repaired it will be worth it. :yahoo:

 

[FJR2005*01880]

......some of us gave our dealers a $500 deposit, sent to Yamaha, for our FJRs and then waited months. Uh....Feb-Aug of '03 for my '04. We do understand.

We may not have much empathy or sympathy but we understand.

Months?! Are u joking...that's insanity :blink:

Why do these parts take so long for dealerships to get??? It's not like the bike is from the 90's or 80's. It's only five years old... :angry:

On another note, they said they would print out everything they did and give me a copy...so I will still post that when I get it

 

[03HiYoSilver]

Fjr2005,

The reason for the Parts Delay is both Yamaha and Dealers don't hold a great amount of Inventory that does not move quickly. They are Taxed on this Inventory even if it is not sold.

The other reason is that when it is ordered via Japan, it is often held up in Customs at the Port of Entry for tighter inspections due to 911, etc.

Hope this helps... I know the feeling and have a backup bike to help me with my patience.

 

[madmike2]

......some of us gave our dealers a $500 deposit, sent to Yamaha, for our FJRs and then waited months. Uh....Feb-Aug of '03 for my '04. We do understand. We may not have much empathy or sympathy but we understand.

Months?! Are u joking...that's insanity :blink:

Yep! Some of us "old timers" were members of the PDP (Priority Delivery Program). That's the only way you could order an FJR when they were first imported. The dealer would take your deposit, send it to Yamaha and you were put on a list for the bikes coming into the U.S.

See what you missed!

Why do these parts take so long for dealerships to get??? It's not like the bike is from the 90's or 80's. It's only five years old... :angry:

HiYoSilver answered that question in detail.

OTH, it shows that there isn't much replacement need for those parts if the regional warehouses don't stock them. That's a good sign!