RossKean
Well-known member
... If reflashing is even an option (not been confirmed) and you have a set of parameters that is demonstrably better than the Yamaha engineers have developed...
Accelerator Module by Solid Solutions
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gixxerjasen
Well-known member
And IF reflashing the ECU would eliminate the Fuel Cut.
I'm pretty sure that is what he meant. A re-flash just to eliminate the fuel cut (maybe also improve the F:A ratios in the lower rpm ranges like a PC does) that also didn't cost $500 would be completely awesome.
ionbeam
2 FUN
I read something that inferred that the Gen III has an OBD II port, if that's the case then there will be a good opportunity to use a Mitsubishi code compliant software package to tweak some of the software and do awesome diagnostics. I know that domestic OBD II allows changes to be made to fuel cut off, it can't be eliminated but the timing can be altered to minimize the effect.
Can one of you Gen III guys confirm/deny the OBD II connector?
vmaxman99
Member
Well, I contacted the manufacturer of this device. Before I post his response, this "Fix" is as old as computer controlled FI has been around. Folks were doing this to cars way before it was ever tried on motorcycles.
Anyway, this was the reply I got to my "snatchy throttle" question from a gentleman named Marc Vernackt:
"Hi Michael, I have sold many modules for the FJR. The module smoothen the ride. It is developed together with the French FJR Forum.
Thanks,
Marc"
With the temperature probe inserted into the air box, the unit won't indiscriminately adjust fuel flow, but do it to the actual intake air temp.
Would be nice if the Euro would take a dump now.
Anyway, this was the reply I got to my "snatchy throttle" question from a gentleman named Marc Vernackt:
"Hi Michael, I have sold many modules for the FJR. The module smoothen the ride. It is developed together with the French FJR Forum.
Thanks,
Marc"
With the temperature probe inserted into the air box, the unit won't indiscriminately adjust fuel flow, but do it to the actual intake air temp.
Would be nice if the Euro would take a dump now.
lnewlf
Well-known member
damnitall, why doesn't someone [not me] just get one and report on it...
Here is a direct quote from the "Solid Solutions" web site:
As you can see in the below Power Commander stock FJR fuel correction map, generated by DynoJet on a dynamometer from actual data, the stock FJR1300 does not require additional fuel at all RPMs and Throttle Opening combinations and in fact some of the stock fuel map is already too rich (those cells with negative corrections). Only the areas inside the red circle would benefit from additional fuel. All of the areas outside the circle (and actually some of the smaller positive cells inside the circle) the added fuel would be detrimental to power and efficiency. By installing one of these Accelerator Modules you will be adding fuel not just to those parts of the fuel map that might benefit from the addition, but also to those areas that are already too rich. That's the indiscriminate part.
For those bikes that retain a functional O2 sensor, the Accelerator module won't do a damned thing whenever the Fuel Injection is operating in closed loop mode (at idle and during steady cruising). In closed loop the lambda feedback will allow the ECU to "undo" the artificial temperature sensor bias that the Accelerator Module introduces. So at those times the module does nothing at all except make it a bit more difficult for the ECU to hit the target A/F ratio. At all other times (i.e. not at idle or steady cruise) the FJR fuel injection runs in "open loop" mode and this dandy module will be steadily adding fuel, only modulated somewhat by the ambient temperature.
The idea that an FJR will somehow get 10% better fuel mileage with one of these modules installed is laughable at best. How could any motorcycle get better fuel mileage by indiscriminately forcing more fuel into the intake?
edit: I should add the following so nobody gets me wrong:
Will adding one of these modules make the off-on throttle transition smoother and reduce the lean surge symptoms that most FJRs seem to exhibit (but only some riders are sensitive to)? Probably yes.
Will adding one of these improve your fuel mileage? Not very likely.
Would I rather use one of these devices or a programmable Power Commander to attain these goals? I would opt for the latter, but clearly the former is a lot cheaper.
So, at a given ambient temperature, this device will be indiscriminately adding the same amount of fuel across all RPMs and Throttle positions. The only "intelligence" to these devices is that they have a negative temperature variable that will back off on the fuel addition at colder ambient temps.
As you can see in the below Power Commander stock FJR fuel correction map, generated by DynoJet on a dynamometer from actual data, the stock FJR1300 does not require additional fuel at all RPMs and Throttle Opening combinations and in fact some of the stock fuel map is already too rich (those cells with negative corrections). Only the areas inside the red circle would benefit from additional fuel. All of the areas outside the circle (and actually some of the smaller positive cells inside the circle) the added fuel would be detrimental to power and efficiency. By installing one of these Accelerator Modules you will be adding fuel not just to those parts of the fuel map that might benefit from the addition, but also to those areas that are already too rich. That's the indiscriminate part.
For those bikes that retain a functional O2 sensor, the Accelerator module won't do a damned thing whenever the Fuel Injection is operating in closed loop mode (at idle and during steady cruising). In closed loop the lambda feedback will allow the ECU to "undo" the artificial temperature sensor bias that the Accelerator Module introduces. So at those times the module does nothing at all except make it a bit more difficult for the ECU to hit the target A/F ratio. At all other times (i.e. not at idle or steady cruise) the FJR fuel injection runs in "open loop" mode and this dandy module will be steadily adding fuel, only modulated somewhat by the ambient temperature.
The idea that an FJR will somehow get 10% better fuel mileage with one of these modules installed is laughable at best. How could any motorcycle get better fuel mileage by indiscriminately forcing more fuel into the intake?
edit: I should add the following so nobody gets me wrong:
Will adding one of these modules make the off-on throttle transition smoother and reduce the lean surge symptoms that most FJRs seem to exhibit (but only some riders are sensitive to)? Probably yes.
Will adding one of these improve your fuel mileage? Not very likely.
Would I rather use one of these devices or a programmable Power Commander to attain these goals? I would opt for the latter, but clearly the former is a lot cheaper.
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ionbeam
2 FUN
To add to what Fred Said, engines that run rich feel smooth due to slight bogging. This device makes no bones about its core functionality, it lives to make your engine run rich. American thinking: if a little gas is good, more is better. If you go to an engine diagnostic manual you will find that they ask you to 'read' your spark plugs and tell you that if they are black and sooty your engine is rich and should be fixed for this. The ACCELERATOR module™ isn't a root cause fix, it is a mask for the underlying problem and tradeoffs rarely have a net positive result.
By intentionally making your FJR run rich you are accepting a loss of performance. A rich engine runs cooler (albeit a small amount). Counter intuitively, many top fuel cars have a lean-out button to boost performance near the finish line. It works by making the engine run hotter which produces more power. This won't translate well to a conventionally aspirated FJR but it does show that rich is not a good condition. It is true that if your FJR runs too lean it will run hotter.
Running rich slows down warm-up. Rich causes black sooty plugs. Rich washes down the cylinder walls, stripping oil away. Rich leaks past rings and contaminates oil. Rich burns more fuel. Rich hurts the cat-con. Rich hurts performance. All to get a small amount of relief to abrupt throttle. Are the trades worth it for the benefit (singular)?
By intentionally making your FJR run rich you are accepting a loss of performance. A rich engine runs cooler (albeit a small amount). Counter intuitively, many top fuel cars have a lean-out button to boost performance near the finish line. It works by making the engine run hotter which produces more power. This won't translate well to a conventionally aspirated FJR but it does show that rich is not a good condition. It is true that if your FJR runs too lean it will run hotter.
Running rich slows down warm-up. Rich causes black sooty plugs. Rich washes down the cylinder walls, stripping oil away. Rich leaks past rings and contaminates oil. Rich burns more fuel. Rich hurts the cat-con. Rich hurts performance. All to get a small amount of relief to abrupt throttle. Are the trades worth it for the benefit (singular)?
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vmaxman99
Member
I'm attempting to contact the folks on the French FJR Forums that are currently using this device on their bikes to get some direct feedback from them.
I will post what I find out.
I will post what I find out.
Remember that the EFI config of a French FJR will be very different than that of a US version. The US version has EPA numbers to meet. The French version has a speed/power limiter on it that no other country requires.
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lnewlf
Well-known member
as noted, not good to run too rich, along with everything else mentioned, carbon buildup can occur...obviously too lean is bad also...Seems that removal of the PAIR system might cause the O2 sensor to read rich and lean out an already lean mixture..This would exacerbate the off idle throttle take up...Tough to beat Mamaha at her own game..
ionbeam
2 FUN
The Exhaust Air Injection is only active until the thermostat opens, after that it is only active at idle. The main intent is to burn off rich exhaust fumes from the fuel injection trim for a cold engine.
richsp51
Well-known member
Solid Solutions does state that :
"Open loop simply means there is no feedback of the Lambda sensor to the ECU. It means there is no sensing or measuring of the exhaust gas to see how the motorcycle is running. The fuel injected is determined by the RPM and throttle position, derived from fuel injector pulse width numbers stored in the fuel maps, and is trimmed for environmental conditions due to air temperature, air pressure and engine temperature. The open-loop mode is needed since the Lambda sensor is not quick enough in response when you are e.g. accelerating with your bike."
and:
"The ACCELERATOR module will only work during the open-loop mode. That is the mode where most of the effects of the lean fuel mixture are seen..."
So, this is not in conflict with what Fred W states.
I'm not concerned about any fuel improvement (or even slight worsening) ... only the off-on throttle transition improvement possibility for a relatively low investment and simplicity of install and maintenance.
That being said, I've been pretty happy with the effect that the G2 throttle tamer , along with throttle slack removal, has made on my '07.
"Open loop simply means there is no feedback of the Lambda sensor to the ECU. It means there is no sensing or measuring of the exhaust gas to see how the motorcycle is running. The fuel injected is determined by the RPM and throttle position, derived from fuel injector pulse width numbers stored in the fuel maps, and is trimmed for environmental conditions due to air temperature, air pressure and engine temperature. The open-loop mode is needed since the Lambda sensor is not quick enough in response when you are e.g. accelerating with your bike."
and:
"The ACCELERATOR module will only work during the open-loop mode. That is the mode where most of the effects of the lean fuel mixture are seen..."
So, this is not in conflict with what Fred W states.
I'm not concerned about any fuel improvement (or even slight worsening) ... only the off-on throttle transition improvement possibility for a relatively low investment and simplicity of install and maintenance.
That being said, I've been pretty happy with the effect that the G2 throttle tamer , along with throttle slack removal, has made on my '07.
Pay-Pal said it was $105ish on my credit card. God only knows how long it will take to arrive. When it does arrive, I may or may not choose to reveal what the results are...
I think I'd rather try the G2, but don't want to risk the heated grip.
I think I'd rather try the G2, but don't want to risk the heated grip.
richsp51
Well-known member
Well, as this topic has generated a lot of discussion, I for one hope that you choose to discuss your impressions in whatever level of detail you choose. Good luck.
Mi tu!
lnewlf
Well-known member
Plz do...
and yes, wuzz a pita to get the grip off to install the G2..but worth the trouble and the $70...almost eliminated the problem [ along with wrist training].. and my '06 should be much worse than your '12
Arrived in the mail today! Pretty quick turn around considering. No time for install before the weekend -- and the front tire is bald. Will shoot for a review on Saturday.
ANZAC
Well-known member
Interesting idea. Please advise and give us your feedback.
