Better Riding Techniques

[bergs]

I wouldn't consider ABS as "trading up".

Anything that removes your braking power is not a safety feature, IMO.

Learning how to threshhold brake...now THAT's where it's at.

 

[El Toro]

We came upon several miles of twisties with gravel, dirt, coal dust and deisel fuel on it. That makes for a very greasy surface, even in the absence of moisture. Speeds must be reduced to a minimum in those situations.
For example, a very tight switchback. Here you can see beyond the turn but the technical difficulty of the turn itself is the limiting factor.

And while on the topic of "cornering adhesion", I'd be amiss not to mention body positioning. If you shift your weight to the inside of the turn (best done in an anticipatory fashion, ie. just before the turn) the bike will go through the turn in a more upright position, thus leaving you with the greatest amount of cornering traction.

And it follows, if you stay centered on the bike, this will be an intermediate amount of lean and move the bike closer to its cornering traction limits.

And further, it you keep your body more upright, thus leaning outside the turn, this will bring the bike to the maximum amount of lean, closest to the traction limits (and also most likely position for peg scraping).

I hate gravel, sand, and washboard roads ... they've got plenty of these in Maine where I often ride in Summer.

I hate switchbacks because invariably you're at the mercy of the guy coming in the opposite direction who cuts the corner.

And big guys can really do quite a bit by shifting their weight. Draggin' pegs is overrated, especially for us guys that move the cg up pretty high by our largeness.

 

[oldryder]

take a riding school. its great fun and arguably the safest way to improve your skills. you might also find a lot of the fear you experience on the street goes away on a racetrack when you don't have to worry about cars, cell phone drivers, debris, and a hot of other hazards present on the street but not on a racetrack. a little bit of coaching goes a long ways.

I went to Reg Pridmore's "CLASS" school and had so much fun I started road racing this year at the age of 53.

 

[Brody]

The next logical topic here might be body positioning.

How do you shift your weight to the inside of the turn?

I was on this subject the other day, at EOM, and Marty A mentioned the phrase, "kiss your mirrors".

I'm not sure who or where this phrase came from but it does come pretty close to what you want to do.

This body position weight shift is a dynamic movement and has a range of motions to it from a slight upper body lean to actually lifting up off the seat by standing on the pegs and hanging off knee dragging racing style.

But for a basic sport riding position this is how I would describe it. Your butt doesn't have tomove side to side and you don't have to stand on the pegs. Just lean as folows;

You're riding straight, your weight is centered, there is minimal pressure on the bars, your grip is relaxed.

You approach a left turn, your upper body shifts left, as if you were going to kiss the image of your own lips in the left mirror.

As you do this shift, you will feel the inner side of your right thigh grip along the right side of the tank.

Your left knee may point out some to the left away from the tank.

The pressure on the bars remains relaxed. Your grip remains relaxed.

Your left butt cheek presses against the left of the seat as if its trying to push the bike to the right.

Your right butt cheek unweights from the seat.

As you round the bend your sight distance opens and you roll on the throttle which tends to stand the bike up.

(Assumming you are now approaching an immediate right turn), you now, even as you are still finishing the left turn,

start your anticipatory right lean. Done smoothly at the finishing of the left and while the bike is starting to "stand up",

this early right lean both keeps the bike leaning just a bit more to the left and in effect slows the "stand up".

Now you continue (in mirror image of the left lean), you are trying to kiss the image of your lips in the right mirror.

Your left inner thigh is gripping the left side of the tank. Your right knee points out a bit.

Your left buttcheek unweights as your right butt cheek pushes the seat to the left.

Pressure on bar and grips stays relaxed.

Side note: don't actually look at your lips in the mirror. Look at the road. As I said in an earlier post,

"focus on the sight horizon and scan the rest". The kiss in the mirror is just an aid to get into the "position".

 

[Brody]

One other thing that's more specific to the FJR.

This may be just a personal preference but for me, for twisty riding, the windshield should be in its lowest position.

This gives you the best visual range.

I was surprised to see more than a few who leave their shields up all the time, even in the twisties.

 

[madmike2]

[SIZE=12pt]Take A Class!!![/SIZE]

Lee Parks class has come up several times in this thread, and they move it around the country.

There is nothing like having a professional show you HOW, follow you and CRITIQUE your performance, then offer suggestions on how to improve.

Spend the money equipping the rider rather than buying the latest bling-bling farkle. I've taken a local California street riding class and its amazing how the techniques one learns are instantly used on the trip home. I am seriously considering taking the Sport Touring class that Cdogman spoke of.

You might also consider buying David Hough's books (Proficient Motorcycling & MORE Proficient Motorcycling). He is a staunch defender of the late entry/delayed apex style of riding on the street.

As others have said, SIGHT LINES! If you are over riding your line of sight, the best technique in the world cannot continue to save you. In the end, it isn't how much speed you carry into a corner but the speed at which you exit, safely, while lining up for the next curve.

Smooth is fast!

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

So my question is How do I become a better more confident rider?Thanks in advance for your comments.

There are three things involved in becomming a better rider: you, the bike, and the road.

You're already working on the 'you' part (good).

The bike -- the FJR (good as it is) may not be the best platform for learning the skills necessary for rider improvement? Maybe still a little too intimidating for some? An already highly skilled rider will take to the FJR like a duck to water -- but, learning those skills may require a different/smaller/sportier/lighter/less intimidating motorcycle?

The road -- yep, you've already figured out where to ride to learn the essentials.

Now just add T.O.M. (Time On Motorcycle) and you'll probably be progressing nicely in your studies.

An anecdote: My SO had ridden most of her life (mostly on large-ish touring/standard type bikes) and had skills that allowed her to ride confidently in many areas but not enjoy motorcycling to its fullest. Eventually, fate contrived to get her on a mountain canyon road (Cimmaron Canyon) on a nice day on the right bike (Kawi 250 Ninja). At the end of that day she exclaimed, "Now I understand." And I'm sure she's never looked back and has enjoyed the "Sport" of motorcycling differently since.

Good luck, and you're welcome.

 

[Brody]

So my question is How do I become a better more confident rider?Thanks in advance for your comments.

There are three things involved in becomming a better rider: you, the bike, and the road.

You're already working on the 'you' part (good).

The bike -- the FJR (good as it is) may not be the best platform for learning the skills necessary for rider improvement? Maybe still a little too intimidating for some? An already highly skilled rider will take to the FJR like a duck to water -- but, learning those skills may require a different/smaller/sportier/lighter/less intimidating motorcycle?

The road -- yep, you've already figured out where to ride to learn the essentials.

Now just add T.O.M. (Time On Motorcycle) and you'll probably be progressing nicely in your studies.

An anecdote: My SO had ridden most of her life (mostly on large-ish touring/standard type bikes) and had skills that allowed her to ride confidently in many areas but not enjoy motorcycling to its fullest. Eventually, fate contrived to get her on a mountain canyon road (Cimmaron Canyon) on a nice day on the right bike (Kawi 250 Ninja). At the end of that day she exclaimed, "Now I understand." And I'm sure she's never looked back and has enjoyed the "Sport" of motorcycling differently since.

Good luck, and you're welcome.

On the other hand, learning to ride a big pigcycle cruiser through tight turns gives you more excitement at less speed.

Then when you get on a sportier bike.......................zoom---zoom

 

[Big Sky]

I like this quote from above: "Now I understand."

We took my brother over a fabulous piece of twisties in Idaho back in about 1990. When we got to the bottom, he was splitting a grin and said, "Now I get it!" He said he "found a rhythm" and that it was "like dancing."

And then I, too, knew he had really gotten it. The light bulb had come on and was shining brightly.

He's now on his fourth motorcycle and is still getting better at age 55 (I'm finding it harder to stay with him).

 

[Fred W]

I'm not an expert, and not even one of the "fast guys", but I have experienced "finding the rhythm" off and on. I cannot explain why it is there sometimes and not at others, but that is the case. For anyone that has done much snow skiing, it is very comparable to that. Some times you are just in a groove, and other times... not so much.

 

[Brody]

I'm not an expert, and not even one of the "fast guys", but I have experienced "finding the rhythm" off and on. I cannot explain why it is there sometimes and not at others, but that is the case. For anyone that has done much snow skiing, it is very comparable to that. Some times you are just in a groove, and other times... not so much.

Your mention of skiing has reminded me of something I call "The broken line slalom".

You find a straight flat stretch of road with no traffic (and hopefully none of those gouged out reflector thingies between the lines).

Just a nice flat pavement with the standard broken lines indicating a legal passing zone.

Your goal is to slalom your bike between the lines continuously for as long as possible at a steady 55mph.

Start slower then work your way up.

At 55mph you get a great rhythym reminiscent of skiing on unbroken powder.

 

[Fred W]

I'm not an expert, and not even one of the "fast guys", but I have experienced "finding the rhythm" off and on. I cannot explain why it is there sometimes and not at others, but that is the case. For anyone that has done much snow skiing, it is very comparable to that. Some times you are just in a groove, and other times... not so much.

Your mention of skiing has reminded me of something I call "The broken line slalom".

You find a straight flat stretch of road with no traffic (and hopefully none of those gouged out reflector thingies between the lines).

Just a nice flat pavement with the standard broken lines indicating a legal passing zone.

Your goal is to slalom your bike between the lines continuously for as long as possible at a steady 55mph.

Start slower then work your way up.

At 55mph you get a great rhythym reminiscent of skiing on unbroken powder.

I'll certainly have to try it, Zen Master Brody.

The only big difference I can see from the outset is that when snow skiing the turns are linked at the skier's whim. Whatever the rhythm dictates. No cones, or dashed lines to dictate the speed and frequency of the linked turns. What you suggest sounds much more like slalom water skiing. Another great sport that I have enjoyed (in my younger days), but one that is less "free form" and more constrained by the slalom course laid out (and length of the tow line). Personally, I really like the freedom of snow skiing...

 

[Brody]

...................................................
The only big difference I can see from the outset is that when snow skiing the turns are linked at the skier's whim. Whatever the rhythm dictates. No cones, or dashed lines to dictate the speed and frequency of the linked turns. What you suggest sounds much more like slalom water skiing. Another great sport that I have enjoyed (in my younger days), but one that is less "free form" and more constrained by the slalom course laid out (and length of the tow line). Personally, I really like the freedom of snow skiing...

I also like the freedom of snow skiing. Actually for the past 30 years my snow skiing is freeheel snow skiing (aka tele') for even more freedom.

This is not like slalom water skiing. These turns are tight-linked

But, as you may have surmised from the short time spent with me, I like challenges. A steep narrow chute has no slalom poles but you must do tight turns,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,or else.

(Then there are the trees. Always watch the spaces not the trees or you'll do a Sony Bono.)

Anyway, back to the broken line slalom. TRY IT,,,,,, CAREFULLY!

You'll see what I mean. The whole suspension gets into a bouncy rhythym.

And this exercise actually has a practical application, This type of quick bouncy turn can be used to set up for a very tight hairpin!

 

[madmike2]

After reading a number of crash posts lately and some "butt pucker" posts, if I may be so bold....some of the members here need to practice more "slow in/fast out" riding style coupled with riding within one's sight lines.

Unfortunately these principles come into play and become a part of one's riding repertoire AFTER one gains wisdom. How does one gain wisdom? By surviving bad decisions, or from listening to those who have!

Take a street riding school. Then participate in a "track day". Learn and work to overcome your shortcomings and know the capabilities of your bike.

 

[Brody]

A lot of you have posted, "Take a riding course". "Do a track day".

Yea, great suggestions. (I'm serious.) Those are obviously good things to do.

But, here we have a forum for analysing and discussing things.

So add something useful or interesting from your experiences. It can't hurt and it might help.

As far as crashing, many could have been avoided with better skill.

But some could have been avoided by better decisions.

Some can not be avoided.

Most of you know of Larry Grodsky, motorcycle safety guru, killed when he hit a deer. He had predicted that could be the way he would go. He made a decision to ride after dark. Turned out to be a bad choice.

 

[madmike2]

But, here we have a forum for analysing and discussing things.
So add something useful or interesting from your experiences. It can't hurt and it might help.

Sooooo.....

1.) Ride your sight lines.

I've learned (from rounding a blind curve and seeing someone else in my lane) to not "push" the entry of a corner. By entering any corner with enough "sight distance" to stop if there should be any sort of lane blockage or foreign matter on the road or surface (trees, a parked RV, hikers, gravel and sand have all been experienced by this rider).

2.) SMOOTH.

Learn throttle control. When riding in traffic or on twisty roads, ride in a gear that allows the engine to help and respond to your inputs. Be smooth with the application of power and smooth in the transitions (rolling off the throttle and applying brake....releasing the brake and rolling back on the throttle. This will be particularly helpful once you have the supension settled in a corner since you won't experience drive train/suspension load & unload.

3.) Late apex cornering.

In my neighborhood this is a good way to stay alive. On right hand turns/corners, I approach the corner in the left wheel track, having my braking done before I enter the corner, I begin my the turn but do not "tip" the bike deeply into the corner until I can see the exit. I am keeping some throttle applied to set the suspension and maintain driving force to the rear wheel, then I "tip in" for a late apex and roll on the throttle accelerate through the exit of the corner.

This technique allows me to see further around the corner, identify any hazards, notice if anyone coming the opposite direction is invading my space and gives me time to avoid or brake, unlike a "race line" which would have me deep into the corner and committed to one line and unable to compensate for gravel in the apex, a closing radius turn or hundreds of other variables one finds riding in the Sierra Nevada Mountains.

How's that for a start? All of the above have been outlined, discussed, debated and argued AND all of them, and more, are available in the books that have been mentioned here. The bottom line is to practice and apply what one reads.

 

[monk69]

wrong video,tryed to delete

 

[madmike2]

The bottom line is to practice and apply what one reads.

Or take a class or school where an unbiased coach or instructor can critique your technique and help you work on the skills you want to develop.

Especially since most of us will "gloss over" certain defects in our abilities and major in those things we've already accomplished. Most schools-seminars-closed course training venues won't let us take the easy way out thus strongly encouraging us to become better riders.

YMMV!

 

[monk69]

Sorry guys....That was the wrong video...should have tested it....

 

[Brody]

Sorry guys....That was the wrong video...should have tested it....

I'm not sure what the point is here.

Both of those videos showed an ***** pushing the limits with no regard for anyone else on the road,

let alone his/her own safety.