brake/tail light leds
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tmonroe
Member
I got the lights yesterday - took maybe 30 seconds to install. Hopefully the pictures appear properly - if not, my apologies, its probably a hosting issue, and I'll put them up someplace else if you really need to see the pictures...
They are a little longer than a regular 1157 style bulb, but they fit in the Gen II housing just fine.
On low, the bulb is a little dimmer than the stock bulb on low (LED on left, stock bulb on right).
On high (brake lights), the bulb is significantly dimmer than stock.
The bare bulb when illuminated.
The Gen II FJR has a seperate incandescent bulb that lights the plate, so that's not a consideration (I don't know about the Gen I FJR, but since this lights up "all the way around", it should work, although again, likely not as bright as stock.
Pros:
This will probably never ever burn out - LED's should give on the order of 100,000 hours of service life. (my friends on the flashlight forums say they see a lot of cheap LED's failing early, so that might also be a consideration).
Illuminates more quickly than Incandescent (instantaneous on vs. .1 second).
Should stay cooler than stock
Should use less power than stock
Cons:
Very expensive.
Unacceptably dim vs. a stock bulb.
I'm a big fan of LED's. I belong to a flashlight enthusiats forum (yes, I am a geek), and I have some friends who do some really cool stuff with maglights and LED's. They get tons of light out of modified mag lights (think 2AA battery mag brighter than a 2D Cell Mag light, and batteries last longer...). That said, the LED's they use are very expensive - some bulbs cost more than $100.00. The one I got looks to be much cheaper, and no where near the light output. Based on the other products on the page, I could not recommend these. If the light level was equivalent to incandescent, then I would consider these to be a nice upgrade because of the reasons above - but since they're dimmer, I wouldn't recommend these. I put the stock bulbs back, and I'll have a better idea of what questions to ask before I order next time.
They are a little longer than a regular 1157 style bulb, but they fit in the Gen II housing just fine.
On low, the bulb is a little dimmer than the stock bulb on low (LED on left, stock bulb on right).
On high (brake lights), the bulb is significantly dimmer than stock.
The bare bulb when illuminated.
The Gen II FJR has a seperate incandescent bulb that lights the plate, so that's not a consideration (I don't know about the Gen I FJR, but since this lights up "all the way around", it should work, although again, likely not as bright as stock.
Pros:
This will probably never ever burn out - LED's should give on the order of 100,000 hours of service life. (my friends on the flashlight forums say they see a lot of cheap LED's failing early, so that might also be a consideration).
Illuminates more quickly than Incandescent (instantaneous on vs. .1 second).
Should stay cooler than stock
Should use less power than stock
Cons:
Very expensive.
Unacceptably dim vs. a stock bulb.
I'm a big fan of LED's. I belong to a flashlight enthusiats forum (yes, I am a geek), and I have some friends who do some really cool stuff with maglights and LED's. They get tons of light out of modified mag lights (think 2AA battery mag brighter than a 2D Cell Mag light, and batteries last longer...). That said, the LED's they use are very expensive - some bulbs cost more than $100.00. The one I got looks to be much cheaper, and no where near the light output. Based on the other products on the page, I could not recommend these. If the light level was equivalent to incandescent, then I would consider these to be a nice upgrade because of the reasons above - but since they're dimmer, I wouldn't recommend these. I put the stock bulbs back, and I'll have a better idea of what questions to ask before I order next time.
HotRodZilla
GOD BLESS AMERICA
If you are just looking for relacement lights for inside your housings, I would strongly suggest the Kissan flashing bulbs. The flash module is built into the light, so replacement is plug&play. I have a set of them and love them. They probably flash 8-10 times before going solid and have lasted well so far. I may add LEDs around my license plate, but I will stay with these flashing bulbs.
Bustanut joker
Well-known member
Ha! I'd put aboot as much stock in this klowns words as Elmer Fud's ..... He copulates with Armadillos and trailers his bike ya know.. :lol:
:jester:
Damn. That is disappointing. The dimness sure is a deal breaker.
I have ordered a different type of 1157 replacement bulb and will report on them similarly when I get them. I do not need them to be brighter than stock, just want them equally bright with the fast turn-on time.
Auburn
Well-known member
I have a '06 feej.
I got the red LED brake/tail lights (1157) from V-LEDS.com (part number 1157_27_SMT_R) they sell as 2 per package. I got a set for the bike and a set for my trailer. They are significantly brighter than the incandescent lamps. EDIT: To clarify, I pull the trailer with the bike.
RED LED they are about $10 dollars cheaper per pair then what I paid a couple of months ago.
Ambers for the rear of the bike, 1156 replacements: (part number 1156_60_SMT_A) Rear Amber
The base for the fronts is different it looks like this: Amber base I got these for the front: (part number 7507_20_A) Front Amber LED
I have only installed the rear Ambers, and the brake/tail LED's in the bike and trailer. When the trailer is unplugged the ambers flash rapidly, they flash normal with the trailer plugged in. I have not found the load cell for the turn signals so they flash at the correct rate.
These LED's are significantly brighter than the stock incandescent lamps. They are spending though for the ambers, but I was out to save watts due to the added loads for the trailer lights when I am towing it. I just haven't had the time to research the piece needed to get the flash rate right on the ambers yet. If any one knows, please pass along.
I got the red LED brake/tail lights (1157) from V-LEDS.com (part number 1157_27_SMT_R) they sell as 2 per package. I got a set for the bike and a set for my trailer. They are significantly brighter than the incandescent lamps. EDIT: To clarify, I pull the trailer with the bike.
RED LED they are about $10 dollars cheaper per pair then what I paid a couple of months ago.
Ambers for the rear of the bike, 1156 replacements: (part number 1156_60_SMT_A) Rear Amber
The base for the fronts is different it looks like this: Amber base I got these for the front: (part number 7507_20_A) Front Amber LED
I have only installed the rear Ambers, and the brake/tail LED's in the bike and trailer. When the trailer is unplugged the ambers flash rapidly, they flash normal with the trailer plugged in. I have not found the load cell for the turn signals so they flash at the correct rate.
These LED's are significantly brighter than the stock incandescent lamps. They are spending though for the ambers, but I was out to save watts due to the added loads for the trailer lights when I am towing it. I just haven't had the time to research the piece needed to get the flash rate right on the ambers yet. If any one knows, please pass along.
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HotRodZilla
GOD BLESS AMERICA
You know Bust, those kinds of lies just hurt. Everyone knows I don't trailer my bike.
Now this is sounding a bit more optimistic!!
As for a turn signal flasher, the FJR "Turn signal/hazard relay" as it is called, is a two prong style flasher. It just has a supply and a load side. One of these EL-12 flashers (top of the page) should work.
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Auburn
Well-known member
As promised, I am reporting on the 1157 bulb, LED replacements that I ordered from www.spectrumled.com. What I bought was a pair of their Matrix II 32 LED 1157 dual circuit "bulb" in Super white, as I need white for 1st gen license plate lighting (scroll down the page in the above link). These cost me 13.99 plus shipping.
These bulbs were just a hair (maybe 1/32") over 1" in diameter, but I was eventually able to wriggle them into the stock FJR rear tail lamp assembly without any modification to either the bulb or the tail lamp. From there, things went down hill.
When in running light mode there is only a couple of leds lit. Certainly not enough to allow someone to see you from behind, or prevent them from creaming you in the dark. When the brake lights are activated, the brightness directly back is almost equal to the standard incandescent light bulb, but that is only when viewed from directly to the rear. Slightly off axis, and I mean only 10-20 degrees, the perceptible light drops away radically.
My assessment is these bulbs are garbage and completely unusable. And I intend on telling the vendor my feelings. Do not waste your money.
The only attribute for them was that their response time was as expected, being LEDs, much faster, allowing a flasher / modulator to more effectively flash or strobe the tail lamp to catch the attention of cagers behind you..
Here is a video showing the FJR with an incandescent stock 1157 lamp in the left socket and the above LED replacement lamp in the right socket:
Clicky to view
But I am not giving up (quite yet). I will order a set of the LED bulbs mentioned by AuburnFJR above and hope for the best. Wish I had some pictures or videos to encourage me...
If that doesn't pan out I'll be reverting to straight incandescent brake lights with some sort of hi power 3rd gen LED auxiliary lights driven by the flashing brake modulator in addition.
These bulbs were just a hair (maybe 1/32") over 1" in diameter, but I was eventually able to wriggle them into the stock FJR rear tail lamp assembly without any modification to either the bulb or the tail lamp. From there, things went down hill.
When in running light mode there is only a couple of leds lit. Certainly not enough to allow someone to see you from behind, or prevent them from creaming you in the dark. When the brake lights are activated, the brightness directly back is almost equal to the standard incandescent light bulb, but that is only when viewed from directly to the rear. Slightly off axis, and I mean only 10-20 degrees, the perceptible light drops away radically.
My assessment is these bulbs are garbage and completely unusable. And I intend on telling the vendor my feelings. Do not waste your money.
The only attribute for them was that their response time was as expected, being LEDs, much faster, allowing a flasher / modulator to more effectively flash or strobe the tail lamp to catch the attention of cagers behind you..
Here is a video showing the FJR with an incandescent stock 1157 lamp in the left socket and the above LED replacement lamp in the right socket:
Clicky to view
But I am not giving up (quite yet). I will order a set of the LED bulbs mentioned by AuburnFJR above and hope for the best. Wish I had some pictures or videos to encourage me...
If that doesn't pan out I'll be reverting to straight incandescent brake lights with some sort of hi power 3rd gen LED auxiliary lights driven by the flashing brake modulator in addition.
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Auburn
Well-known member
FredW asked me to post pictures of my LED's.
When I installed my LED's, I did a before and after in my garage. I had the garage dark and back the bike and trailer up so they refelected off my garage door, which is white. The LED's were significantly brighter in the amount of light that was reflected in my opinion.
So with that said, imagine my surprise when I took pictures with one of each lamp installed in my trailer and bike.
Left Incandescent, right LED Day light. Note how yellow/orange the incandescent appears compared to the LED red.
Left Incandescent, right LED - Night with tail lights only
Left Incandescent, right LED - Night with brakes applied
ALL LED - Day light brakes and hazards applied - Note the amber is almost the same color as the incandesecnt RED above. Notice how much light is reflected off the top of the trailer.
I have two different LEDinstalled. These are the ones in the trailer, because the lamps are sideways and have reflectors behind them.
These are the ones installed in the tail/brake and amber lights on the bike since they aim straight back.
I had a differnt goal in mind when I went to LED's then most. Since I tow a trailer, I noticed that the additional loads with the brake lights on the trailer, that it would cause a low voltage spike and reset my Valentine 1 each time I applied the brakes. Not good. So when I put LED's in, that problem went away, even with the grip heaters on high and the rest of my farkles going.
I think the big difference in the light outputs is due the spectrum the light is operating in. The LED put out a red light that is filtered through a red lens. Where the incandescents put out a white light that is filtered by a red lens. We are dealing with two different light spectrums and trying to compare the brightness, which does not equate. For example, DOT engineers say the 310 watt high pressure sodium (amber-yellow) street light put out that same light level as 700 watt mercury vapor lamps (white-blue light). Yet most people would say the Mercury vapor lamp is brighter, it has to do with how the human eye works. Yet when you put a lumen meter to them both they are the same output in lumens.
My conclusion, I don't know which one is objectively brighter measuring the output in lumens since I don't have the meters to measure it. I do know the LED reflected more light off my garage door when I tested them that way. I have been very happy with the LED, and I will change the front ambers as soon as I have the correct flasher relay for them so they flash at the right rate, which will save me more watts.
As you can see when they are all LED - they are plenty bright for anyone to see.
When I installed my LED's, I did a before and after in my garage. I had the garage dark and back the bike and trailer up so they refelected off my garage door, which is white. The LED's were significantly brighter in the amount of light that was reflected in my opinion.
So with that said, imagine my surprise when I took pictures with one of each lamp installed in my trailer and bike.
Left Incandescent, right LED Day light. Note how yellow/orange the incandescent appears compared to the LED red.
Left Incandescent, right LED - Night with tail lights only
Left Incandescent, right LED - Night with brakes applied
ALL LED - Day light brakes and hazards applied - Note the amber is almost the same color as the incandesecnt RED above. Notice how much light is reflected off the top of the trailer.
I have two different LEDinstalled. These are the ones in the trailer, because the lamps are sideways and have reflectors behind them.
These are the ones installed in the tail/brake and amber lights on the bike since they aim straight back.
I had a differnt goal in mind when I went to LED's then most. Since I tow a trailer, I noticed that the additional loads with the brake lights on the trailer, that it would cause a low voltage spike and reset my Valentine 1 each time I applied the brakes. Not good. So when I put LED's in, that problem went away, even with the grip heaters on high and the rest of my farkles going.
I think the big difference in the light outputs is due the spectrum the light is operating in. The LED put out a red light that is filtered through a red lens. Where the incandescents put out a white light that is filtered by a red lens. We are dealing with two different light spectrums and trying to compare the brightness, which does not equate. For example, DOT engineers say the 310 watt high pressure sodium (amber-yellow) street light put out that same light level as 700 watt mercury vapor lamps (white-blue light). Yet most people would say the Mercury vapor lamp is brighter, it has to do with how the human eye works. Yet when you put a lumen meter to them both they are the same output in lumens.
My conclusion, I don't know which one is objectively brighter measuring the output in lumens since I don't have the meters to measure it. I do know the LED reflected more light off my garage door when I tested them that way. I have been very happy with the LED, and I will change the front ambers as soon as I have the correct flasher relay for them so they flash at the right rate, which will save me more watts.
As you can see when they are all LED - they are plenty bright for anyone to see.
Thanks very much for the pictures. To me, it appears that the quantity of light from your LEDs is a bit better than mine when the brakes are not on, but not by much. That is really the deal breaker with mine. It still appears to me that the incandescent bulb is putting out a greater amount of light, even in your pics too.
The lamps that you installed in the tail lamp of the FJR do look very similar to the ones that I have.
Here's mine:
As you can see, mine have two rings of LEDS around the rear circumference, the idea being the scattered light will reflect off the lamp assembly's reflector and mimic an incandescent bulb. Yours appears to has one ring of LEDs. Otherwise they appear very similar.
I noticed that with my LED bulb that not all the indirect "ring" LEDs and none of the direct rear view LEDs were contributing in running light mode (brakes off) . But they then all illuminate when the brakes are pressed. This is why there is not enough light output as running lights. But even if there was, I still think the light would be inadequate in brake light mode when they are all on.
At this point I am thinking of cutting my losses and going to right to the auxiliary LED brake light mounted separately.
The lamps that you installed in the tail lamp of the FJR do look very similar to the ones that I have.
Here's mine:
As you can see, mine have two rings of LEDS around the rear circumference, the idea being the scattered light will reflect off the lamp assembly's reflector and mimic an incandescent bulb. Yours appears to has one ring of LEDs. Otherwise they appear very similar.
I noticed that with my LED bulb that not all the indirect "ring" LEDs and none of the direct rear view LEDs were contributing in running light mode (brakes off) . But they then all illuminate when the brakes are pressed. This is why there is not enough light output as running lights. But even if there was, I still think the light would be inadequate in brake light mode when they are all on.
At this point I am thinking of cutting my losses and going to right to the auxiliary LED brake light mounted separately.
wfooshee
O, Woe is me!!
You guys' experience is just reinforcing my opinion stated in post #2.
As for the life of these things, I got a set of low-voltage (read 12-volt) yard lights that use a similar matrixed-white-LED bulb. Kit had 12 lamps, I used 9. Less than one year later not a single one of them still lights up. They started flickering, then died. Not altogether, some withing days, the rest over time. They're all dead now.
Seeing cars that have OEM LED setups, they're very impressive. Instant on/off, very bright, but a couple of caveats. Obviously they're using specially-designed reflectors, they use large matrices of LEDs, and you don't see them on cheap cars, do you?
As for the life of these things, I got a set of low-voltage (read 12-volt) yard lights that use a similar matrixed-white-LED bulb. Kit had 12 lamps, I used 9. Less than one year later not a single one of them still lights up. They started flickering, then died. Not altogether, some withing days, the rest over time. They're all dead now.
Seeing cars that have OEM LED setups, they're very impressive. Instant on/off, very bright, but a couple of caveats. Obviously they're using specially-designed reflectors, they use large matrices of LEDs, and you don't see them on cheap cars, do you?
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PhilMills
Well-known member
I'm not a big fan of the multi-element lamps that most of you have been trying out. I've seen 'em and think they're a great way for a vendor to market cheap LED components ("Ooohh! Look how many LEDs we have on this lamp! Surely more is better!"). But the majority of them are, in fact, really cheap low-output products.
When the taillight on my '99 F650 gave up and just about got me run over, I ordered a 3W Luxeon as a replacement (and dropped in another incandescent for a while). I got a red lamp like this one from SuperBrightLEDs.com.
That lamp, in my opinion, blew the incandescent out of the water from all angles - I swapped back and forth a few times in the garage to compare and really, it wasn't even a contest. Day or night, I could see it better even though minimal light was making it back to the reflector.
That was a few years ago - 5W Luxeon lamps are now available and pump out even more light.
When the taillight on my '99 F650 gave up and just about got me run over, I ordered a 3W Luxeon as a replacement (and dropped in another incandescent for a while). I got a red lamp like this one from SuperBrightLEDs.com.
That lamp, in my opinion, blew the incandescent out of the water from all angles - I swapped back and forth a few times in the garage to compare and really, it wasn't even a contest. Day or night, I could see it better even though minimal light was making it back to the reflector.
That was a few years ago - 5W Luxeon lamps are now available and pump out even more light.
Phil,
If you still have access to these can you do some photos in comparison?
I have already ordered the auxiliary brake light for the feejer, but would be interested for my other bikes.
In an attempt to get some semblance of a scientific approach to this whole replacement bulb thing, I searched around to find the light output specifications for a standard incandescent 1157 bulb. According to this site the standard bulb which has two filaments (8.3 watt and a 26.9 watt) out 37.7 lumens and 402 lumens.
The specs for the superbrightled 3 Watt Luxeon says it puts out 30 & 85 lumens. Their 4 watt High Power bulbs put out a more respectable 25 & 165 in white or 35 & 140 in red. In all cases the brake light output is way down compared to the standard bulb and are not quite as bright in running light mode.
Now it may be that the lumen is not an accurate representation of how bright they are to the eye. But is seems to me that being 1/4th the light output would be a serious handicap.
The specs for the superbrightled 3 Watt Luxeon says it puts out 30 & 85 lumens. Their 4 watt High Power bulbs put out a more respectable 25 & 165 in white or 35 & 140 in red. In all cases the brake light output is way down compared to the standard bulb and are not quite as bright in running light mode.
Now it may be that the lumen is not an accurate representation of how bright they are to the eye. But is seems to me that being 1/4th the light output would be a serious handicap.
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wfooshee
O, Woe is me!!
PhilMills
Well-known member
lawmans3
Member
Wow, what a difference the Hyperlites make! I just got done installing these on my 08 and they are so much brighter than the stock running lites and brakes lights. Very easy to install, great safety item! I got the ones that go on the outside (left/right) of the license plate with the California 4 flash model. Everyone raved about how bright they were and I would agree completely. They are a little expensive ($100) but if they keep a cager from smashing me it's well worth the money. :clapping:
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