Cherry broke down, would not start.

[Taff]

Hi folks,

Thought a quick note to give you peeps a "heads up" on the earthing issue on my bike.

Went to start the machine up after a brief visit to the GF and what, no nothing. The two turn arrows on the instrument cluster, bright blue high beam light, all illuminated along with the fuel gauge flashing, were the indications that something was wrong. The red kill switch had no effect at all. Initially I thought that my alarm starter relay killer was at fault, so I pulled that apart and took the fuse out near the battery, which the alarm uses. The starter was dead so I decided to get the bike towed back home. Lucky I was near within a 30 mile radius.

Bike finally got to the dealership where the technician found that the possible problem was in the earthing side of the harness. Seems the Yamaha technical person was already aware that this had been a problem on a few 2007 machines running extra farkles, WTF.

Now the bike requires a new wiring harness along with a check of the ignition switch, which I think is also getting to be a problem. I would like to suggest that you check the harness (lift the forward part of the fuel tank up, take the T bar off) in the area top left hand side near the frame. Here you will find a black end cap which I am led to believe is the culprit. I have no more information at this time other than to alert owners running electircal farkles to ensure that they claculate the wattage they are using versus maximum output of the stator, and accordingly be mineful of this load requirement.

Here is what I have been running:

Deer hunting lights (AKA: Hella 550 60W lamps)

Electric vest and gloves (obviously not all the time)

GPS (wired to batt directly with fuse etc)

Alarm, through fused wire to batt.

2x 55W PIAA headlight bulbs which were 60W candle power bulbs.

So not really a great deal of farkles so I am surprised at this failure.

So, briefly there are some known failures of this harness......more to follow folks.

Oh, and the bike was damaged during the tow (rear fairing cracked).

Ride safe (and fast) TAFF.

 

[bramfrank]

Indeed, the Gen-II alternator has some 200 extra watts of available power (Certainly better than the 100 or so spare watts that the first generation could support), but this additional power is intended to be used to drive the AE's computer and shift solenoid and to power the OEM heated grips that are standard on all AE models and on all 2007 and later 'A" models sold outside the United States.

Note that loading the system such that the voltage is less than 13.6 volts when spinning the motor is not going to fully charge the battery - the ones in our bikes actually require 14.2 volts at the battery terminals to fully charge, but will top up somewhat more slowly at the lower value. 12 volts isn't going to let the battery discharge completely, but eventually the battery will become 'lazy'. In the x2b's alarm business we use hundreds of AGM batteries and it's a serious problem with cheaper alarm panels that do not provide proper regulated voltage to their batteries. That's one reason we don't sell DSC, FBI, Ademco or any of the other cheaper brands.

Since the AE's solenoid draws only momentary power during shifts, it is reasonable to assume that THAT power is likely mostly drawn from the battery and the alternator replaces the energy . . .

If you run both sets of your lights at the same time - and/or some combination of your heated gear (depending on the wattage of that stuff), you've been loading your electrical system beyond it's limits. The GPS and alarm draw nothing (relatively speaking).

I'm reasonably certain that they don't intend for the electrics to be 100% loaded all the time, so doing this could well be an invitation for eventual trouble.

But that wasn't the nature of your problem.

So it is important to do several things if you ride an FJR.

1. Don't overload the alternator (which would discharge your battery and eventually result in a charging circuit failure) and

2. Your Farkles should ALWAYS be connected directly to the battery, both the positive AND negative connections - that's just good electrical practice.

Sounds to me from your description that you may have wired some of your high current Farkles earth connections to the frame of the bike - and it is becoming clear from your mention that there have been a number of such failures that the harness design isn't intended to support that type of connection. The battery connection IS, because all of the starter power runs through the cabling.

However, if the ground clamp has oxidised (a euphemism for 'burned') it ought to be fixable by some non-precision electrical surgery . . . mind you, if Yamaha is paying for a new harness, why not replace it? No matter what, to avoid a repeat you should rewire you high current Farkles.

Note too, that the headlight wiring is pretty anemic, dropping a fair percentage of the volts applied in the harness - if you have a headlight modulator you can see it graphically by the complementary pulsing of the marker lights when the headlights are flashing - and that cycling is from 17% to 100%!! A relay driven heavy duty wiring harness would possibly do more for headlight performance than would a higher wattage bulb - and a higher wattage bulb could impact on the wiring and possibly the supplied relay - not to mention drawing some of those precious watts.

Way back when, I was the person that talked Gary Murphy into producing his heavy duty wiring harness for the old C10 (with the result being that I was the proud owner of serial number 1 of that device). If I'd had the presence of mind to strip the harness out after my unfortunate crash I'd have transplanted it to my FJR - but with my Hella HID driving lights, which present a load of some 70 or 80 running watts for the pair and produce double the lumens of the OEM H4 headlights, I suppose it doesn't make much difference.

In summary, watch those watts and where you draw them from the bike.

ALWAYS fuse your Farkles, by the way.

As to your cracked fairing . . I assume that you've claimed it from the towing people?

 

[BFehklar]

Bummer Jon - not many things worse than having your ride not go vroom! The cracked fairing is really adding insult to injury - dang.

I don't have many farkles yet - I'm about to install heated clothing on feklar. Guess I better calculate loads before adding too many goodies. Your post is a good reminder.

+Rob

 

[Taff]

Indeed, the Gen-II alternator has some 200 extra watts of available power (Certainly better than the 100 or so spare watts that the first generation could support), but this additional power is intended to be used to drive the AE's computer and shift solenoid and to power the OEM heated grips that are standard on all AE models and on all 2007 and later 'A" models sold outside the United States.
Note that loading the system such that the voltage is less than 13.6 volts when spinning the motor is not going to fully charge the battery - the ones in our bikes actually require 14.2 volts at the battery terminals to fully charge, but will top up somewhat more slowly at the lower value. 12 volts isn't going to let the battery discharge completely, but eventually the battery will become 'lazy'. In the x2b's alarm business we use hundreds of AGM batteries and it's a serious problem with cheaper alarm panels that do not provide proper regulated voltage to their batteries. That's one reason we don't sell DSC, FBI, Ademco or any of the other cheaper brands.

Since the AE's solenoid draws only momentary power during shifts, it is reasonable to assume that THAT power is likely mostly drawn from the battery and the alternator replaces the energy . . .

If you run both sets of your lights at the same time - and/or some combination of your heated gear (depending on the wattage of that stuff), you've been loading your electrical system beyond it's limits. The GPS and alarm draw nothing (relatively speaking).

I'm reasonably certain that they don't intend for the electrics to be 100% loaded all the time, so doing this could well be an invitation for eventual trouble.

But that wasn't the nature of your problem.

So it is important to do several things if you ride an FJR.

1. Don't overload the alternator (which would discharge your battery and eventually result in a charging circuit failure) and

2. Your Farkles should ALWAYS be connected directly to the battery, both the positive AND negative connections - that's just good electrical practice.

Sounds to me from your description that you may have wired some of your high current Farkles earth connections to the frame of the bike - and it is becoming clear from your mention that there have been a number of such failures that the harness design isn't intended to support that type of connection. The battery connection IS, because all of the starter power runs through the cabling.

However, if the ground clamp has oxidised (a euphemism for 'burned') it ought to be fixable by some non-precision electrical surgery . . . mind you, if Yamaha is paying for a new harness, why not replace it? No matter what, to avoid a repeat you should rewire you high current Farkles.

Note too, that the headlight wiring is pretty anemic, dropping a fair percentage of the volts applied in the harness - if you have a headlight modulator you can see it graphically by the complementary pulsing of the marker lights when the headlights are flashing - and that cycling is from 17% to 100%!! A relay driven heavy duty wiring harness would possibly do more for headlight performance than would a higher wattage bulb - and a higher wattage bulb could impact on the wiring and possibly the supplied relay - not to mention drawing some of those precious watts.

Way back when, I was the person that talked Gary Murphy into producing his heavy duty wiring harness for the old C10 (with the result being that I was the proud owner of serial number 1 of that device). If I'd had the presence of mind to strip the harness out after my unfortunate crash I'd have transplanted it to my FJR - but with my Hella HID driving lights, which present a load of some 70 or 80 running watts for the pair and produce double the lumens of the OEM H4 headlights, I suppose it doesn't make much difference.

In summary, watch those watts and where you draw them from the bike.

ALWAYS fuse your Farkles, by the way.

As to your cracked fairing . . I assume that you've claimed it from the towing people?

Thanks for your reply.

I have indeed been running all of the wiring through fuses and therefore connected to the battery, including the deer hunting lights. In adding the farkles I have calculated the wattage whilst running the heated gear when I am moving and not at a stop (same applies to the Hella lights).

The damage to the fairing has been reported to the towing Company but they have not bothered responding to several e mails and a quote from the dealership for the repair. I am now forced to get a lawyer involved or take them to the small claims Court. Sad that I have to take this course of action but when I called this week I gave them 2 more buisness for a response, or face the other option.

As soon as I have more information I will post it up.

Taff.

 

[Taff]

Bummer Jon - not many things worse than having your ride not go vroom! The cracked fairing is really adding insult to injury - dang.
I don't have many farkles yet - I'm about to install heated clothing on feklar. Guess I better calculate loads before adding too many goodies. Your post is a good reminder.

+Rob

Hey Rob, long time no hear :yahoo:

Just remember that the full output of the stator is achieved around 4800 RPM so that puts the bike and the rider into the State Trooper zone for a ticket. I switch off lights etc at traffic lights or slow moving traffic just to help the stator.

Yep the fairing just happens to be the full one piece around the side and back of the bike. The exhaust was also pushed towards the frame as well.

Got a performance award a couple of weeks ago, 86 in a 60 on I-5 North near Ft Lewis, SP came from out of nowwhere, dang got my lawyer to try and get me off that one. Trouble with the Tacoma Court next year is that all 3 judges will be replaced with non user friendly State patrol loving remoulds which means I will not have a chance in getting off this one. At least it beats the other ticket I got on the custom rocket ship (cough cough).

Jon.