Cold Start Fast Idle Follow Up with resolution

[Bounce]

And does it play well with oil-cooled turbos?

 

[HotRodZilla]

I remember Ashe saying something about putting SeaFoam into the vaccume lines used for the TBS and causing a cloud of black smoke. I kinda didn't know what he was talking about at the time, but I'm guessing this is it...

 

[RaYzerman19]

I can believe that.... burning that concentration of naptha is akin to running the bike on kerosene, not nearly as volatile or clean as gasoline.

 

[ionbeam]

At one time I had a GM product that had an evil combination of a computer, carburetor and excessively lean tuning in an attempt to manage emissions. On a good day it ran like crap. Typically, over 15k miles it would plug with carbon and then knock like heck. Even the EGR valve was killed and its intake passages would completely plug with carbon and need to be manually chiseled clean. On the recommendation of a GM mechanic friend of mine I purchased a can of the allegedly magical GM Top Engine Cleaner. The directions instructed me to pour half the can in the carburetor while using the throttle to keep the engine from stalling then pour the rest of the can into the engine until the last drop caused the engine to stall. Let the hot engine sit at least 20-30 minutes or longer then start it up and manage the carb linkage until the engine ran smoothly. It was magical, my car stopped knocking and ran as good as it ever did (like crap). It produced a black fog that had to be visible from space and produced a smell that I'm sure killed the grass, insects and shrubs. One application probably made more toxic emissions than an entire lifetime of a conventional engine would have. Two thumbs up, it worked great. I don't know it if causes the carbon to flake off or if it dissolved the compounds that let the carbon deposits hold together but it works.

In these days of fuel injected engines with intake plenums you can't pour the Good Stuff down the intake the way the old carbs would allow. Some fart smeller realized that you could pop off the vacuum assisted brake booster's vacuum line which is attached directly to the intake manifold and introduce the Engine Cleaner through this line directly into the intake manifold. Which is a long winded way of saying Jeff Ashe was correct.

Since the FJR has 4 separate, horizontal intakes we can't induct the liquid cleaner like in a car. The best we could hope for would be to spray into the intake ports which would also coat the intake butterflies. The next best option is to treat the gas but this bypasses the throttle plates and some vacuum passages. Another option that was mentioned would be to patiently run drops into hoses connected to the sync ports.

In any case, some engine cleaners do work well, choose wisely :lol:

 

[FJRay]

At one time I had a GM product that had an evil combination of a computer, carburetor and excessively lean tuning in an attempt to manage emissions. On a good day it ran like crap. Typically, over 15k miles it would plug with carbon and then knock like heck. Even the EGR valve was killed and its intake passages would completely plug with carbon and need to be manually chiseled clean. On the recommendation of a GM mechanic friend of mine I purchased a can of the allegedly magical GM Top Engine Cleaner. The directions instructed me to pour half the can in the carburetor while using the throttle to keep the engine from stalling then pour the rest of the can into the engine until the last drop caused the engine to stall. Let the hot engine sit at least 20-30 minutes or longer then start it up and manage the carb linkage until the engine ran smoothly. It was magical, my car stopped knocking and ran as good as it ever did (like crap). It produced a black fog that had to be visible from space and produced a smell that I'm sure killed the grass, insects and shrubs. One application probably made more toxic emissions than an entire lifetime of a conventional engine would have. Two thumbs up, it worked great. I don't know it if causes the carbon to flake off or if it dissolved the compounds that let the carbon deposits hold together but it works.

In these days of fuel injected engines with intake plenums you can't pour the Good Stuff down the intake the way the old carbs would allow. Some fart smeller realized that you could pop off the vacuum assisted brake booster's vacuum line which is attached directly to the intake manifold and introduce the Engine Cleaner through this line directly into the intake manifold. Which is a long winded way of saying Jeff Ashe was correct.

Since the FJR has 4 separate, horizontal intakes we can't induct the liquid cleaner like in a car. The best we could hope for would be to spray into the intake ports which would also coat the intake butterflies. The next best option is to treat the gas but this bypasses the throttle plates and some vacuum passages. Another option that was mentioned would be to patiently run drops into hoses connected to the sync ports.

In any case, some engine cleaners do work well, choose wisely :lol:

Sounds like the same stuff we used at the Sears auto canters in the early 70s. They called it Combustion Chamber Cleaner and they tried to sell it to every tune up. I worked as a Brake and front end Mechanic and the tune up guys would warn us when they were going to use it so we could leave the shop before we got gassed out. I have to admit I tried it on my old Ford and it made quite an improvment.

We need a volunteer to try it and see if it explodes an FJR.

 

[wheatonFJR]

...We need a volunteer to try it and see if it explodes an FJR.

Paging dcarver....he'll do anything.

Carver? :huh:

 

[HaulinAshe]

My semi-annual maintenance includes a complete SeaFoam treatment. Carbon buildup is an ever-increasing problem with FJRs (and similar engines) using today's pump gas formulas.

SeaFoam is simple to do. I've demonstrated this method at several Tech meets.

Tell the neighbors in advance that your house is NOT on fire, seriously!!! Use four equal lengths of vacuum hose attached to the sync ports. Bind them together and with the aid of a helper, run the HOT engine up to roughly 5,000 rpm and shove all four hoses into the can of SeaFoam. It will suck the can about 2/3 dry before stopping. Let sit 5-10 minutes, then WFO start the engine and clear all the mosquitos from the neighborhood at the same time.

Carbon has become such a common issue that I never do valve checks or valve adjusts without de-carboning the FJR first.

 

[SkooterG]

My semi-annual maintenance includes a complete SeaFoam treatment. Carbon buildup is an ever-increasing problem with FJRs (and similar engines) using today's pump gas formulas.

You should do a write-up with piccies on exactly how you do it.

Funny though. 226,000 miles on my first FJR with no issues that I was aware of.

 

[HaulinAshe]

You should do a write-up with piccies on exactly how you do it.

Funny though. 226,000 miles on my first FJR with no issues that I was aware of.

I was typing more when you replied.

Your 226k miles started a long time ago. USA Pump Gas has gone exponentially to crap in the past 2-3 years. Carburetor engines are doomed, and FI engines without O2 sensors both upstream and downstream of a catalytic converter aren't doing much better.

 

[HaulinAshe]

I remember Ashe saying something about putting SeaFoam into the vaccume lines used for the TBS and causing a cloud of black smoke. I kinda didn't know what he was talking about at the time, but I'm guessing this is it...

Damn it makes you feel old when somebody sorta, kinda, somewhat remembers you.

SeaFoam makes a cloud of grayish-blue smoke that will block the sunlight from your neighborhood. But it sure works!!!

 

[wheatonFJR]

...Carbon has become such a common issue that I never do valve checks or valve adjusts without de-carboning the FJR first.

Holy Crap!

Your f##king with us aincha?

 

[HaulinAshe]

...Carbon has become such a common issue that I never do valve checks or valve adjusts without de-carboning the FJR first.

Holy Crap!

Your f##king with us aincha?

Nope! I consider it pointless to measure valve clearances on an FJR that has not been recently de-carboned, especially one that has run 26,000 miles since the last valve check. Typically you will find at least one exhaust valve that gives inconsistent measurements due to carbon buildup.

 

[HotRodZilla]

I remember Ashe saying something about putting SeaFoam into the vaccume lines used for the TBS and causing a cloud of black smoke. I kinda didn't know what he was talking about at the time, but I'm guessing this is it...

Damn it makes you feel old when somebody sorta, kinda, somewhat remembers you.

SeaFoam makes a cloud of grayish-blue smoke that will block the sunlight from your neighborhood. But it sure works!!!

It's not that I only somewhat remembered what you said. It's that when you posted that up, I had no idea what the Hell you were talking about. I'm a much more edumacated FJR owner now. Don't worry Jeff, your older than me, but not old enough to be my dad like most of these other guys!

I'm guessing I better get to I this as I have 41k on the bike and its never been decarbonized as far as I know.

 

[Fred W]

This is the kind of first hand experience, from a respected source, that I was deferring to earlier. I've never done a "suck the seafoam down the vacuum pipes" tune-up either, and my '05 has >60k miles on it. I should probably do this sometime this winter, while the neighbors windows are all still all closed and nobody is out on their decks grilling.

I'm thinking it would be a real good idea to have a fresh set of plugs to jam in there afterwards too.

 

[ionbeam]

...I'm thinking it would be a real good idea to have a fresh set of plugs to jam in there afterwards too...

If Jeff's Seafoam works like my Top Engine Cleaner did, this is a great way to get plugs clean too. It can't fix worn plugs, but it sure takes care of dirty buildup.

 

[wheatonFJR]

Can't somebody take a danged video of this next time there is a tech meet or sumpin?

 

[JamesK]

This video from STP certainly makes a good visual argument...

STP - See the Difference

 

[someguy]

hmm... so, basically we need a nice fiber optic camera, and someone with some miles who is willing to snake a video of the intake/exhaust and possibly inside the combustion chamber via the sparkplug hole, before and after a round of seafoam...

i'd do it, but i truly don't have enough miles on my scoot yet...

 

[Fred W]

I'd do it, and I think I have enough miles to have some deposits, but I don't have a fiberoptic camera.

 

[Geezer]

I'd also volunteer my high mileage engine for a look see if someone has he necessary camera. Maybe we can do this at NERDS this year. My FJR has over 100K miles on it and I have noticed a slight degradation in power the last couple of years. I was planning to run some Seafoam through the vacuum lines this spring but I'll hold off if someone has a camera and is willing to bring it to NERDS.