Converting Gen 2 AE to A engine - is it possible?

[JamesK]

The shaft sticking out when you remove the gear position sensor is on the shift drum. It goes away when you swap shift drums.
You'll need all the external shifting stuff from your 'A' engine, but once you swap the shift drum the AE will look just like the A does now.

I don't know for sure that you have to actually swap the shift shaft, too, but it has to come out to remove the shift drum anyway, so no big deal.

Thanks for the input everyone, this is starting to sound possible.

 

[wfooshee]

I know you watched my thread last summer when I replaced the transmission parts after finding unacceptable wear. I had gone in with the intention of replacing the shift drum, exactly what you're needing to do, but found issues in the gears and shift dogs that needed to be addressed. Anyway, the teardown and case split is well covered starting with this post, if you haven't already gone back to find it.

 

[JamesK]

Yes, thank you again wfooshee, I did watch/read your posts last summer, like many here in total awe that you were able to strip down your engine/gear box like that and more importantly put it back together and most importantly that it all worked afterwards

I'm too stupid to do that, so will need to involve a mechanic, the problem is I only speak very basic Japanese and he does not speak English, most of our communication happens via Google Translate or occasionally a friend who speaks both languages. I will print out the instructions and pictures from your thread and send him the link (to run through Google Translate, which btw, sucks for Japanese). If there are still issues, I'll try to arrange for my bilingual friend to come over...

 

[JamesK]

I am trying to confirm which parts I would need to actually order, from the past posts and some feedback from Yamaha, I understand that the two fiches containing some of the parts are below:

2007 FJR1300A - FJR13AW SHIFT CAM FORK Diagram

2007 FJR1300A - FJR13AW SHIFT SHAFT Diagram

 

[RossKean]

This one too?

https://www.yamahasportsplaza.com/oemparts/a/yam/50045b47f8700209bc79405a/transmission

 

[JamesK]

I need to replace the:

1: replace the shift cam
2: replace the shift actuator

For the Shift Cam, I would need:

# Part Number Description Qty
1 3P6-18540-00-00 SHIFT CAM ASSY x 1
2 3P6-18542-00-00 POINT, NEUTRAL x 1
3 90501-06022-00 SPRING, COMPRESSION x 1

For the Shift Actuator, I would need:

# Part Number Description Qty
13 3P6-18101-00-00 SHIFT SHAFT ASSY x 1
14 90508-29012-00 SPRING, TORSION x 1
15 90387-1211D-00 COLLAR x 1

I know I'll also need to buy new bolts, the Yamabond, etc., but want to confirm what actual gearbox parts I would need.

 

[JamesK]

This one too?
https://www.yamahasportsplaza.com/oemparts/a/yam/50045b47f8700209bc79405a/transmission

According to Yamaha, to retrofit the engine the only/main parts I'd need to replace are the two listed below, I'm just quite sure which one is the shift actuator.

1: replace the shift cam

2: replace the shift actuator

So as I understand it, no gears or shift forks need to be replaced?

 

[RossKean]

I suspect that you will want to get the shift cam. You would hate to take it apart and find too much wear on yours to swap over to the new(er) engine. I wouldn't bother with anything that is external to the case as long as it could be changed later without dropping the motor or splitting the cases. I don't know what they mean about "shift actuator" but doesn't sound like it is a severe wear item???

You listed the same parts under shift cam and shift actuator in Post #45.

 

[rPGoatBoy]

Part #s 2 and 3 can be found here, just pull them out with your fingers or needle nose pliers. It's a spring loaded contact for the gear position switch.

 

[JamesK]

Thanks Ross, fixed the post.

Thanks rPGoatBoy, I saw these, but figured they are cheap enough to replace, as mine are still original parts.

 

[rPGoatBoy]

No problem James, there are some parts that you can use that simply aren't wear items, that little contact and spring are two of them. On the "A" (internal & external) linkage off of your old bike are some of the others. I suspect what Yamaha means by "shift actuator" is the shift shaft (13); the part numbers are different between the A & AE.

Print out the two fiches and highlight the differences. Or do what I do, open two separate windows (one A, one AE) and hover the cursor over the browser icon in the taskbar to switch back & forth between the two fiches. You can spot part number differences pretty easily if the fiche parts lists are lined up. Things like spacers, springs, washers, aren't wear items and you can get away with using them fine, even if they've got 200k on them. Other parts may be good as well, as long as they're examined first.

I still think that you should give it a try yourself. Digital cameras, Google, and the likes of us unwashed peasants in fjrforum should be able to get you back on the road in short order. You might have to buy some tools and a maybe even a torque wrench. All you need is the will to take it on and learn something new. But on the other hand, hey, to each his own, and I understand if you think it's too daunting.

 

[wfooshee]

Why order new? You have the parts you need in the old engine!!!! Getting them out would be good tear-down practice, too, before tearing down the engine you're actually going to use. The parts you need have NOTHING (zero, nada, zilch) to do with the shifting issues you've had, and will not damage the AE engine when they go in. The shift drum simply does not wear, and the shift forks are the same, keep the ones from the new engine. EVERYTHING inside is the same except the shift drum and the shift shaft. (Or in parts fiche terms, shift cam and shift actuator.)

The shift drum (what the parts fiche calls shift cam) from the old motor will drop into the new motor and POOF!!!!! You have the correct part for an 'A' engine. That whole shift shaft assembly from the old motor will go into the new motor, and POOF!!! You have the correct 'A' parts in place.

When the engine's all buttoned up and back in the frame, you assemble ALL of the external stuff from the original engine onto the side of the new engine. That bracket that mounted all the actuator stuff has to come off first, because it's in the way. The neutral switch (actually the gear position switch,) the shift pedal, the link, and the arm on the end of the shift shaft. The slave cylinder with the hydraulic cable from the clutch lever goes on, and again.... POOF!!!! You have an 'A' engine in your bike. Finish the wiring and plumbing and go riding!

The only reason NOT to take parts from the old engine would be because you have some hope of selling the old engine.

 

[JamesK]

Thanks again for your input rPGoatBoy, I would love to do the engine retrofit myself and if this work was on my Djebel 250 (DRZ250) where the engine is easy to swap and comparatively cheap to source out I probably would. I've done things like Stator, Starter Motor, Valve Check, CCT, clutch, but splitting cases and messing with the gearbox without supervision from an experienced person looking over my shoulder is just too big of a risk IMHO. I'm saving money where I can by doing the engine swap myself, etc.

In the case of the FJR, the total shipping from the US is about as much as the price of the engine itself, plus the major PITA of getting it in and out of the bike, not to mention the time off the road for my main bike. My FJR has been off-line now since late Oct 2014, I simply don't want to risk one tiny screw up destroying my new engine.

 

[JamesK]

Why order new? You have the parts you need in the old engine!!!! Getting them out would be good tear-down practice, too, before tearing down the engine you're actually going to use. The parts you need have NOTHING (zero, nada, zilch) to do with the shifting issues you've had, and will not damage the AE engine when they go in.
The shift drum (what the parts fiche calls shift cam) from the old motor will drop into the new motor and POOF!!!!! You have the correct part for an 'A' engine. That whole shift shaft assembly from the old motor will go into the new motor, and POOF!!! You have the correct 'A' parts in place.

When the engine's all buttoned up and back in the frame, you assemble ALL of the external stuff from the original engine onto the side of the new engine. That bracket that mounted all the actuator stuff has to come off first, because it's in the way. The neutral switch (actually the gear position switch,) the shift pedal, the link, and the arm on the end of the shift shaft. The slave cylinder with the hydraulic cable from the clutch lever goes on, and again.... POOF!!!! You have an 'A' engine in your bike. Finish the wiring and plumbing and go riding!

The only reason NOT to take parts from the old engine would be because you have some hope of selling the old engine.

Looking at the wear on your 80k mile engine, I don't understand why/how things like the shift drum wouldn't also exhibit some wear (after 213k miles), and/or stress which could lead to premature failures. Or am I totally wrong?

 

[wfooshee]

There's almost no movement in those parts. The wear happens in parts that rotate against each other, or mate and unmate from each other. The shift drum spends 99.999435% of its time motionless.

In the case of my engine, the one shift fork had a gear wheel spinning against it most of its life, scraping the surface down. The 4th gear dogs mated poorly, wearing the edges down, which made them mate even more poorly, wearing them further over time.

Almost nothing ever happens at the other end of the shift forks, where that pin rides the grooves in the drum. Very little motion, and what motion there is has NO speed associated with it. Where the gear was grinding against the fork at several hundred RPM, the motion of the shift drum is a fraction of an inch every shift.

 

[rPGoatBoy]

I've done things like Stator, Starter Motor, Valve Check, CCT, clutch,

Hell, now I think you're even more qualified to do it. What's the risk in splitting the old one to see how challenging it is for yourself?

 

[willboe]

Maybe this is too late, but have you considered offering the AE engine for sale in Japan, and starting over in your search for an A model?

 

[Donal]

Have you given any thought to getting hold a Haynes manual? The pictures in the manual are not that great (black & white) but the words and techniques are all worth it if you are not totally confident. The manual combined with the pictures from the several Forum threads should cover everything you need to know.

It may also be possible to get hold of a Japanese language version............

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Any updates?

 

[JamesK]

Sorry I've been quiet, but I have great news, the retrofit is done (and working) thanks to the help of a friend and skilled mechanic George Funtech.