Difficulty starting with a warm engine

[pa46nos🇬🇷]

Good evening my friends.
For the past two weeks I have been experiencing a problem with the FJR1300 2004 ABS. When I go for a ride and the engine gets hot and I have to stop and turn it off, when I go to start it again, it won't start. When I push the starter all the dial indicators go off and nothing works. Nor does it send current to turn the starter. I'm thinking maybe it's a rectifier or coil issue. After a while the engine temperature drops, it works normally. Have any of you faced something like this?

 

[Rogue]

Sounds to me like the starter, getting hot and something going out in it.

 

[pa46nos🇬🇷]

Sounds to me like the starter, getting hot and something going out in it.

Thanks. I will check it.

 

[RossKean]

Why is the engine getting so hot that you have to turn it off? Shouldn't do that!

In any case, starters are most likely to have problems when they are hot. If the gauges are going off or the display is blanking out, it is likely because the starter is drawing an excessive amount of current. It may also be indicative of a bad battery (or a little of both).

Fully charge the battery and get it load tested. If the battery is bad, you will need to use a known good battery for further testing.

The next thing is to measure starting current draw when cold and when hot. This is done using a clamp-on DC ammeter. Note: A lot of them are AC only so make sure you have the right type. If the current exceeds 80 to 90 amperes, the starter is pretty much shot. Sometimes they can be rebuilt, but most people replace them.
Edit:
Note: A very good battery can mask a failing starter. Some people replace their battery and because the engine will start, they assume that was the entire issue. It is important to check the starting current if it does not crank the engine quickly, if the LCD display goes out while cranking or if the clock or trip odometer reset.

Probably a good idea to check out the starter relay and consider replacing it along with the starter. High current starts could burn the contacts...

Good luck.

 

[Ignacio]

Why do you think it's "getting hot" and think you have to stop it? Is it boiling over, throwing an error code, or running strangely? If not these or something other than you think it's hot...I wouldn't shut it off to begin with. Fans coming on, temperature bars in upper segments, and hot air around your legs are exactly as designed.

 

[pa46nos🇬🇷]

Why do you think it's "getting hot" and think you have to stop it? Is it boiling over, throwing an error code, or running strangely? If not these or something other than you think it's hot...I wouldn't shut it off to begin with. Fans coming on, temperature bars in upper segments, and hot air around your legs are exactly as designed.

I don't stop because the engine heats up. I can stop on the road to buy something from a store or my wife can get off for her work. The fan opens at 4 bars of temperature and when what I describe as a problem happens it has never produced any error indication

 

[escapefjrtist]

Thanks for the clarification. I read it as (normal) hot start on bike, not the bike overheating and needing to stop to cool off.

As mentioned, starter and/or battery is where to begin troubleshooting. On high mileage or older FJRs, there have been instances where seals weep and engine oil will contaminate the starter and essentially gum it up. This causes high amp draw, instrument blinking and non-start. Let the engine cool off and bike starts. Not difficult to repair, just determine what is causing problem.

Good luck!

~G

 

[vzhq16]

While the battery and/or starter are the most likely culprits, something else to look at are the connections between the battery and the starter and between the battery and ground. Loose or corroded connections there can have the same symptoms.

 

[MotoMike]

Good evening my friends.
For the past two weeks I have been experiencing a problem with the FJR1300 2004 ABS. When I go for a ride and the engine gets hot and I have to stop and turn it off, when I go to start it again, it won't start. When I push the starter all the dial indicators go off and nothing works. Nor does it send current to turn the starter. I'm thinking maybe it's a rectifier or coil issue. After a while the engine temperature drops, it works normally. Have any of you faced something like this?

I had a very similar issue with my 2007A. A cold start worked fine. If I stopped for a short time (for example for fuel) then tried to start up, the fuel pump and all the dash lights and all the guages would work but when I activated the start button nothing happened. I then had to push the bike into the shade and wait about 20 minutes before I could start the bike normally. Does that sound familiar? In my case, the problem turned out to be a faulty starter relay.

To test for this you need to find the starter relay on your bike. I don't know where it is located on the 2004. Once you have located the relay, set up your "no start" condition: start up the bike, let the engine heat up to the point where it will not restart if you turn off the engine. Make sure your ignition is in the "on" position, the the kill switch is in the "run" position and the bike is in neutral. Now, using a screwdriver with an electrically insulated handle, jump the side of the starter where the two large wires are attached. This bypasses the low voltage side of the relay and sends power directly to the starter. If the starter turns, the problem is the relay. Replacing the relay is simple: disconnect the wires that attach to the relay (keep track of which wire goes where). Pop out the old relay from it's mount. Pop in the new relay and reconnect the wires.

Good luck. I hope the problem is as simple as I described.

 

[pa46nos🇬🇷]

Είχα ένα πολύ παρόμοιο πρόβλημα με το 2007Α μου. Μια κρύα εκκίνηση λειτούργησε καλά. Αν σταματούσα για λίγο (π.χ. για καύσιμο) και μετά προσπαθούσα να ξεκινήσω, θα λειτουργούσαν η αντλία καυσίμου και όλα τα φώτα ταμπλό και όλοι οι μετρητές, αλλά όταν ενεργοποίησα το κουμπί εκκίνησης δεν γινόταν τίποτα. Έπειτα έπρεπε να σπρώξω το ποδήλατο στη σκιά και να περιμένω περίπου 20 λεπτά πριν ξεκινήσω κανονικά το ποδήλατο. Ακούγεται οικείο; Στην περίπτωσή μου, το πρόβλημα αποδείχθηκε ότι ήταν ένα ελαττωματικό ρελέ εκκίνησης.

Για να το ελέγξετε, πρέπει να βρείτε το ρελέ εκκίνησης στο ποδήλατό σας. Δεν ξέρω πού βρίσκεται στο 2004. Αφού εντοπίσετε το ρελέ, ρυθμίστε την κατάσταση "χωρίς εκκίνηση": ξεκινήστε το ποδήλατο, αφήστε τον κινητήρα να ζεσταθεί σε σημείο που δεν θα επανεκκινήσει αν γυρίσετε εκτός κινητήρα. Βεβαιωθείτε ότι η ανάφλεξή σας είναι στη θέση "on", ο διακόπτης kill στη θέση "run" και το ποδήλατο στη νεκρά. Τώρα, χρησιμοποιώντας ένα κατσαβίδι με ηλεκτρικά μονωμένη λαβή, πηδήξτε την πλευρά της μίζας όπου είναι συνδεδεμένα τα δύο μεγάλα καλώδια. Αυτό παρακάμπτει την πλευρά χαμηλής τάσης του ρελέ και στέλνει ρεύμα απευθείας στη μίζα. Αν γυρίσει η μίζα, το πρόβλημα είναι το ρελέ. Η αντικατάσταση του ρελέ είναι απλή: αποσυνδέστε τα καλώδια που συνδέονται στο ρελέ (παρακολουθήστε ποιο καλώδιο πηγαίνει). Βγάλτε το παλιό ρελέ από τη βάση του. Περάστε το νέο ρελέ και επανασυνδέστε τα καλώδια.

Καλή τύχη. Ελπίζω το πρόβλημα να είναι τόσο απλό όσο περιέγραψα.

Exactly that is the symptoms
I'll check it
Thanks a lot.

 

[torch]

Sounds to me like the starter, getting hot and something going out in it.

^^^^^^^^

Known problem with the Gen1 starter motors. Fortunately an eBay find from a later low mileage motor will fit and be trouble free.

As Ross said, a new battery can mask the problem. I went through a string of batteries, one every year or two, before I realized where the real problem was. After I changed the starter, the battery lasted another 7 years.

Changing the starter itself is pretty straight forward (two bolts and slide it sideways), but you do have to lift the tank and remove the throttle body bank to access it.

 

[pa46nos🇬🇷]

Thanks for the answer.
First of all I'll check the starting relay as MotoMike said and if continue the problem I'll do your answer.

 

[SacramentoMike]

I don't know why I even start reading these real technical threads. Sometimes when guys like Ross Kean and escapefjrtist get all deep in their diagnoses, I just don't understand what they're all talking about. It's like, you know, Greek to me.

Um, good luck though.

 

[RossKean]

It's like, you know, Greek to me.

Or are we "Geek" to you?

 

[wfooshee]

Pretty much guaranteed it won't be the relay, not with the issue being temperature-sensitive, even after what MotoMike said above, at least I've never seen that reported anywhere else. Easy enough to check, though, and certainly easier than checking the startee!

I went through it several years ago, and found my starter had basically come all apart inside. One of the magnets shifted against another, there were marks showing the magnet and the rotor had rubbed, and it drew an amazing amount of current while cranking the engine, even when cold. I have one of those old-school ammeters with the shunt, had a 100- or 120-amp scale (don't remember which exactly,) and when I put it on the starter wire and it pegged.

Found a used starter and it's been on the bike ever since, working perfectly.

Torch's statement about removing the starter being straightforward is true enough, once you can touch it, but he understates the level of work accessing it:

 

[Fred W]

Before digging into the starter motor, it is also a well known thing that the FJR is always harder starting when hot, requiring more power from the battery.

On my 1st Gen 2005 I once had a situation where any time I tried to start the bike when the engine was hot, the battery voltage would dip so low that the trip meters and clock would reset. The cause was an old battery. If your battery is fairly old, it is probably worth throwing a battery at it before committing to disassembling enough to get at the starter.

 

[Rocket Dad]

Good evening my friends.
For the past two weeks I have been experiencing a problem with the FJR1300 2004 ABS. When I go for a ride and the engine gets hot and I have to stop and turn it off, when I go to start it again, it won't start. When I push the starter all the dial indicators go off and nothing works. Nor does it send current to turn the starter. I'm thinking maybe it's a rectifier or coil issue. After a while the engine temperature drops, it works normally. Have any of you faced something like this?

I had the issue on 2005. 100% starter which I replaced 15hr job...good luck. Great youtube on starter replace which I could not have done without.

 

[MotoMike]

Hey, pa46nos! We have not heard from you for a couple of weeks. How are things progressing with your troubleshooting and repair?

 

[Mr. BR]

Before digging into the starter motor, it is also a well known thing that the FJR is always harder starting when hot, requiring more power from the battery.

On my 1st Gen 2005 I once had a situation where any time I tried to start the bike when the engine was hot, the battery voltage would dip so low that the trip meters and clock would reset. The cause was an old battery. If your battery is fairly old, it is probably worth throwing a battery at it before committing to disassembling enough to get at the starter.

My '05 did that exact same thing and a new battery would fix it for a year or two. But ultimately, I installed a new starter, battery AND relay (just to be sure). Old starter was still in excellent shape and simply needed a cleaning (brushes a little oily/dirty) but I replaced it with a non-OEM unit and it has been good for a few years now. I'll admit that I don't ride much in the summer heat these days (WFH, so no commuting) so it's not a big concern moving forward.
Mr. BR

PS: and... don't forget to check the main ground cable that attaches to the crankcase, right side, down low... mine wasn't bad but cleaning it was part of the process ;-)

 

[pa46nos🇬🇷]

Hello guys.
I was in vacations so I didn't something with the bike. From September I will check it out and hope to fix it.
Thanks for the messages and your answers. They help me with the problem. Talk soon.