Enough with the near hits

[Slappy]

Bounce, I do not know where you got the idea of a red and blue flashing light. These are aicraft wingtip strobe lights and are clear white.

Tominca, I do not see where clear white strobe lights used in conjunction with turn signals is against the law. Flashing lights are permitted to indicate the intention to turn. That is what I am doing. In conjunction of my yellow turn signals I am adding white strobe lights to each side under the yellow signals to enhance the effectiveness of the OEM turn signal. I am also using them to warn motorist of the hazzard in the road, ME. These are not modulating my headlamps nor my turn signals. According to the CA vehicle code I dont see any issue. Now I am sure there is some other vehicle code about driving with excessive driving lights, just like some people here with their hella lights to help enhance their headlights. I am doing the same thing only with my turn signals.

 

[TomInPA]

No problem, your eyes are wide open to the issue. Worst case is a fix-it ticket that you can contest. Good luck. I want to see this in action, and I'm sure won't be able to miss it if I 'm anywhere near you.

 

[HotRodZilla]

If they only come on with the flashers, I don't see much of a legal issue. I'm sure some bored guy could try to make a case out of it, but I think it would be a stretch.

I think your biggest hassle is going to be the on/off power source thing. Good luck, and when your done, post pictures.

 

[FJRGuy]

...What I want is if I turn on either right or left signal for both strobs to fire. ...

I didn't get into the legality issues cause i figure your a big boy and can take the consequences if there are any, but since you commented that you didn't see how what you were planning contravened the law, i thought i'd point out what jumped out at me when I read Tom's post:

...

25251. (a) Flashing lights are permitted on vehicles as follows:

(1) To indicate an intention to turn or move to the right or left upon a roadway, turn signal lamps and turn signal exterior pilot indicator lamps and side lamps permitted under Section 25106 may be flashed on the side of a vehicle toward which the turn or movement is to be made.

...

Clearly your intended arrangement violates the law, but really, highly unlikely to be an issue for this reason. I suspect the intensity of light would be a bigger concern.

...I think your biggest hassle is going to be the on/off power source thing. ...

If tapping the control source rather than the output of the signal solenoids is the biggest hassle, this will be a piece of cake!

I'm interested in seeing how the 2 signal sources (left and right) will be isolated from each other. i can envision a couple of ways to accomplish this but am not sure if they'd work the way I envision. Have you thought this through yet Slappy?

 

[FJR Flyer]

I would wire in a switch to turn the strobes off at night. I know from flying, those things can be blinding. You keep them off on the ground until ready for departure, as a courtesy to other pilots. And if you're in the clouds, they can kill your night vision. Not sure if you'd be making things worse or better for the cagers.

 

[Slappy]

Flyer, I was definitely thinking the same thing. Sitting on a taxiway at night and flipping on the strobes is more than irritating. Either a switch/pushbutton or maybe getting some sort of smoked lens to cover them to lower the intensity.

 

[Neil San Diego]

I'm interested in seeing how the 2 signal sources (left and right) will be isolated from each other.

Wouldn't that be as simple as a diode on each line before bringing them together? (this would be the relay trip line 86/87)

i can envision a couple of ways to accomplish this but am not sure if they'd work the way I envision.

Do tell. I've offered to help Slappy with this. Any suggestions appreciated.

Also, I just poked through the wiring diagram. I didn't see any full-time "on" voltage from the blinker. The power goes straight from the blinker switch to the blinker lights, which suggests all the brains of the blinker are in the physical switch housing (you know - where the blinker fluid goes). Is there a way to get full time "on" voltage from the blinker switch to run the strobe relay?

 

[wfooshee]

A very basic and possibly flawed assumption is being made here, and that is: drivers aren't seeing you.

I think they see you just fine, they just don't give a rat's ass, and no amount of lighting or hi-viz is going to change that. It may not be that they don't care so much, but that they can't tell anything about you, so you don't matter.

People don't check their mirrors and blind spots before they change lanes.

They don't bother actually stopping at a stop sign, they roll and look, and end up crashing the nose into the pavement by slamming on brakes when someone's actually there.

They don't yield on left turns. The worst ones are the ones who take your lane before they're even at the intersection. The move across and then shorten the left turn across whoever may be on the side street. They simply don't care.

These are the people that have fender-benders, and they don't care. They're in a hurry. Other people are in their way. They see stuff, they just think they can get there first.

Our issue as riders is that there's no such thing as a fender-bender on a motorcycle. We get hurt. We lose every time.

I will repeat my weaving suggestion. Before i developed that habit I couldn't go 2 days without a side-street-stop-sign-runner or an oncoming-left-turn-right-of-way viloator trying to kill me.

In 3 years or so since starting the habit of leaning one way and the other when I see a car on the side street, or in the oncoming left turn lane, I have not had an encroachment issue one single time!!!! Not once!

The motion makes you visible, not the lights or the yellow or the orange or the flourescent green. When something moves across a person's field of vision, they can find it and identify it much more successfully than if it's simply there and approaching. A light down the road has no motion. Is it approaching? Is it approaching fast? They can't tell. Wiggle it a bit and they know exactly what and where it is.

And lastly, don't argue about the right of way. ALWAYS give it up if there's the least question in your mind about what they're doing. Giving up 5 seconds in traffic is way easier on life than 5 days (or weeks) in a hospital.

 

[madmike2]

I say, "Go for it!"

You'll soon find out and can report any legal "issues" or citations.

BUT...what do I know? I was also thinking that your bright clothing cause target fixation.

 

[worney]

I cannot comment on the legal issues. All I can say is that for some reason when I am on my black '08, wearing my Olympia Hi-Vis jacket and silver Multi-Tec helmet, with my headlight modulator on (high-beam), traffic moves out of the left lane in front of me and some people have even pulled over (which I feel somewhat bad about). I can only assume that they think I am a motorcycle mounted cop (even though we don't have any in this area). I don't feel invincible but I do feel happy that I am visible. I have commented to people that I would wear one of those rotating warning lights on top of my helmet like I had as a toy fireman's helmet when I was a kid if it meant that I wouldn't get creamed by someone checking their facebook status, while eating a bowl of cereal and milk (I saw this in traffic one day!), and changing their pants.

I say good luck and I wan to see the strobes in action once you have them figured out.

-worney

 

[bluesdog]

BUT...what do I know? I was also thinking that your bright clothing cause target fixation.

+1

I was semi-serious about the invisible thing. and again, here

Mostly I agree with wfooshee, especially about the weaving trick.

BTW, I really was kidding about installing a switch to turn off the head and running lights, although back in the day before mandatory daytime lights, bikes came with light switches, and I still occasionally encounter the odd vintage bike running 'dark' during the day.

I was reminded of this thread this afternoon: During my rather chilly ride home I came up behind an eighteen-wheeler that had really bright strobing turn signals! They certainly were noticeable. I wonder if modifying the feejer's signals so they'd strobe would be sufficient?

 

[madmike2]

I was reminded of this thread this afternoon: During my rather chilly ride home I came up behind an eighteen-wheeler that had really bright strobing turn signals! They certainly were noticeable.

I've seen the brighter turn signals on emergency vehicles and lately on some "armed transfer" trucks. I wonder if they aren't LED lights rather than strobes? If so, they should be available from commercial vehicle parts sources.

I'm still of the belief that strobes are going to get the attention of law enforcement personnel.

 

[SacramentoMike]

Interesting thread and idea. As I read it, it looks like what you're going for amounts to just extra bright turn signals, and I suppose they're in addition to your OEM turn signals, so it's extra bright auxiliary turn signals. Still, I didn't see anything in Tom's quotation from the vehicle code about limiting the number of turn signals you can sport. In fact, somewhere in that thick book, California limits the number of forward-facing running lights to four. A dual headlight setup like the FJR's counts as only one light (also specified in the law). I have four additional forward-facing lights on my bike (Clearwater Kristas and Glendas --the large and small ones) for a total of five. Never been an issue.

My Kristas are also mounted above the 42" height maximum specified in the CVC by a few inches. Also never been an issue. Forgive me for not researching and citing the code where all this appears, since I'm ignoring it anyway. My feeling about this is, first, most LEO's will be pretty reasonable (unless they're looking for an excuse to give you a hard time for whatever reason) about safety equipment you may add. Most everybody, and all cops, know how vulnerable we are.

Second, it's kind of like the argument lots of folks bring out about carrying an illegal concealed weapon. If you needed it, it would be nice to have it. (I'd rather be judged by twelve than carried by six"). If I get a ticket (and it would be a "fix-it" ticket anyway) for having too much lighting, I'd at least have had it till then. Maybe that's why I'm still alive to get the ticket when it comes. Be sure and post a vid of this working.

 

[bgross]

Here's another option in the 'conspicuity' department:

https://www.lights.skenedesign.com/

 

[McRide]

I might look at 2X the watts for the turn signals and brake lights, say from 10w to 20w.

It might make a big enough difference.

Of course you'd need to review the wiring to see what else is on those fuses and if need be, separate those lights from the rest of the shared circuit and then calc out a larger fuse.

I know the goldwings to be extra bright in blinker and brake lights.

Wonder what those bulbs are?

 

[LAF]

A very basic and possibly flawed assumption is being made here, and that is: drivers aren't seeing you.

I think they see you just fine, they just don't give a rat's ass, and no amount of lighting or hi-viz is going to change that. It may not be that they don't care so much, but that they can't tell anything about you, so you don't matter.

People don't check their mirrors and blind spots before they change lanes.

They don't bother actually stopping at a stop sign, they roll and look, and end up crashing the nose into the pavement by slamming on brakes when someone's actually there.

They don't yield on left turns. The worst ones are the ones who take your lane before they're even at the intersection. The move across and then shorten the left turn across whoever may be on the side street. They simply don't care.

These are the people that have fender-benders, and they don't care. They're in a hurry. Other people are in their way. They see stuff, they just think they can get there first.

Our issue as riders is that there's no such thing as a fender-bender on a motorcycle. We get hurt. We lose every time.

I will repeat my weaving suggestion. Before i developed that habit I couldn't go 2 days without a side-street-stop-sign-runner or an oncoming-left-turn-right-of-way viloator trying to kill me.

In 3 years or so since starting the habit of leaning one way and the other when I see a car on the side street, or in the oncoming left turn lane, I have not had an encroachment issue one single time!!!! Not once!

The motion makes you visible, not the lights or the yellow or the orange or the flourescent green. When something moves across a person's field of vision, they can find it and identify it much more successfully than if it's simply there and approaching. A light down the road has no motion. Is it approaching? Is it approaching fast? They can't tell. Wiggle it a bit and they know exactly what and where it is.

And lastly, don't argue about the right of way. ALWAYS give it up if there's the least question in your mind about what they're doing. Giving up 5 seconds in traffic is way easier on life than 5 days (or weeks) in a hospital.

+1

A weave saved me yesterday. Side streeter sneaking out with no apparent stop on her mind. I weaved a few times and she finally stopped! I was shown this many years ago and adopted it and it works.

Also agree a two finger grab on the front brake to yield is way better than the hit for not yielding. And of course the road rage thing must be considered even if you get through, then they are behind you and coming.

Triangle of light, weave, and finally yield. All are painless and well worth the effort and investment in patience.

It has gotten progressively worse with distracted drivers, young inexperienced drivers, and plain old assholes over the last 10 years or so compared to 20 years ago. It is not getting any better.

Always play defense on the bike, your not set up for offense on 2 wheels.

 

[BobbyBlue]

We prolly all modify our driving habits somewhat depending on location...we have tons of retired military here and if i fired strobes everytime i signal a lane change there will be ass-loads of carnage behind me or AT me, so i go with wfooshe and SS and LAF and go fast quietly and move around to keep as much distance as possible 'tween me an them...i also let my bike drink a little so he likes to weave around anyway! You know best the peeps tryin to kill ya everyday so if strobes wake them up, rock on brother !!!!

Blessings,

Bobby