FJR not happening for me now.

[Old Michael]

And this elite class is currently getting hired on at 300-500 hours TOTAL TIME in the log book. That's like throwing the keys to Busa to a 9-year-old that just got off his first 50CC quad. Sleep well in first class.

Dude, that is a troubling thought. Are you serious?

 

[painman]

Honzo, hope things are on a upturn for you and that you and your family makes it through ok. My wife and I lost our real estate business due to the market collapse of late. I can somewhat relate. Prayers to your family. PM. <>< :glare:

 

[jmdaniel]

Not having an FJR is not the end of the world. Enjoy and treasure your family, and get out in that Kayak. Take comfort in knowing that to 85% of the world's population, you are blessed with your station in life!

Exactly. This country would be in better shape if a lot of folks remembered this. I have some nice things, earned through hard work, but I never want to have it all. As Bob Dylan sang, in The Ballad of Frankie Lee & Judas Priest

[SIZE=12pt]If you see your neighbor carryin’ something, help him with his load, [/SIZE]

[SIZE=14pt]And don’t go mistaking paradise for that home across the road.[/SIZE]

 

[AStar]

Honzo,

I do know if you have thought about it, but I fly for the federal government. If you are less than 37 and have 1500 hrs then you would qualify for CBP Air. but you may have to relocate your family. I would recommend that you look at WWW.USAJOBS.COM.

 

[JimH]

Flying is not what it used to be. I have been flying for over 17 years, ten in the military, and I can finally make enough money to pay some of the bills. I started my commercial career making 18k. It went up really slowly from there. My wife supported me along the way, both financiall and emotionally. I worked two jobs for over four years and was lucky to get one day off a month. The last three years since I added that fourth stripe have been better.

Sounds like you have a crappy boss and/or company. Move! There are a ton of flying jobs out there and the regional airlines can't fill their seats with new hire pilots. They are really scaraping the bottom of the barrell to fill the right seat. I know that makes folks feel better when they fly. Just know that the guy in the left seat at some regionals is a couple of years older and finally has his braces off.

If you decide to stay in flying, do the research. Get a better job. The majors are not what they used to be. Continental, Northwest and United all start out about 30k and go up slowly. That would be a huge pay cut for me to move there. There are other options. If you have questions send me a PM. I will be glad to get you on track. I have helped a lot of pilots see the forest through the trees. It will get better if you stick in.

I still don't own a bike because I am digging myself out of years of debt. Thanks to Dave Ramsey, it's working quickly. Take a look at his book "The Total Money Makeover". It saved my butt. My light at the end of the tunnel is a '08 FJR1300A!

Hang in there. It gets better...

 

[jjsC6]

I've had several friends who are pilots, some still are. I understand that some have to start out at fairly low paying jobs. But I've also seen them all work their way up to $100,000 + positions. I'm not sure how this is any different than any other profession. I don't see any reason for you to be bashing the industry because you are not there yet. If it's that bad for you, get out of it. But don't blame the industry for your situation.

 

[Checkswrecks]

Sorry to hear that this one step in your life has been so painful. I've been flying and working in the aviation industry for nearly 40 years and it is truly a slave trade on less senior flight crews. The only worse conditions that I know of are how some of the flight attendants are paid and worked. You're burned and bitter, so I'd suggest that you get out of this and go find peace in something else.

Just an observation on something I've noticed over the years about something that a lot of ex-pilots do really well. They take to technical sales like a fish to water. I've known a lot of guys leave the industry and it doesn't matter if they become stock brokers, sell insurance, or computers, they are willing to accept the learning curve, take a calculated risk, and have a background in making a technical subject into something that people can relate to. It's so much like what they just left, but without the company capping what they can make.

When you make your money elsewhere, have a bike, and the family pressures slow down, buy yourself a Kitfox or something for fun.

Bob

 

[Honzo]

I've had several friends who are pilots, some still are. I understand that some have to start out at fairly low paying jobs. But I've also seen them all work their way up to $100,000 + positions. I'm not sure how this is any different than any other profession. I don't see any reason for you to be bashing the industry because you are not there yet. If it's that bad for you, get out of it. But don't blame the industry for your situation.

I know a guy that was a 20 year United Capt. They furloughed him the last time the MBAs wanted to save some money, which forced his early retirement with half pension. He was making close to 200K at 55 years old... Been a couple years since anyone I know has heard from the guy.

And if you can explain why 9/11 was a good reason for underwriters to double their total time requirements of ALL pilots everywhere, setting back many a career, then I am listenning. All in all, I will bash whatever I have been intimately involved with for 2.5 decades if I please.

 

[CRMH Eagle]

Honzo, I truly sypathzie with you. I looked into aviation about 8 years ago wanting a job change and realized the truth that only a very small handful of pilots are making 6 figures a year. Many pilots work horrible hours with unstable work schedules for $50k or less. And with many in the military retiring it is a diffcult fact to swallow that those new entries into the market place would drive down wages.

As an accountant I'm faced with the hard truth that people who've worked a few years at a nat'l acctg firm get precendence at the good jobs and everyone else is left fighting for the scraps. Due to a blessing of God I'm now a Controller at a very low-stress job and 40hr a week with good pay. But I've spent years interviewing for the a job like this having to fight my way with those from a nat't acctg firm who only know how to audit. During that time I've had to work for so little pay that I considered even becoming a nurse to get the money I needed to live on.

Dude, I waited several years for my fjr... got it this past October. The past 10 years of my life are a nightmare and a financial disaster. At least for me the blessing did come but not w/out tons of disappointment and frustration beforehand.

My friends and family abandoned me years ago in my darkest hour... it would've been nice to have a family to help me in my difficulties but I didn't have that luxory. My wife walked out on me left me with huge debt. If you have a wonderful significant other and/or kids then you are truly blessed beyond measure.... yeah, I have an fjr but it would much more enjoyable with a family.

My work isn't my true passion in life, but I enjoy it and it pays the bills and then some. I work now to live. My creative passions are in my spare time. Not everyone will have the opportunity to work at what they truly love. Those that say the opposite don't know reality. Yeah, all the big-name speakers and preachers teach that but that's not true. Mr. Robbins and those like him should try preaching that sh$t to those in 3rd world countries have to do whatever just to survive. I know... I've been to some of the poorest nations.

Trust me, your FJR is waiting for you. Yeah you may have to climb a difficult mountain or two, but you'll make it. Don't abandon your dreams, whatever they are.

 

[Toecutter]

My work isn't my true passion in life, but I enjoy it and it pays the bills and then some. I work now to live. My creative passions are in my spare time. Not everyone will have the opportunity to work at what they truly love.
Don't abandon your dreams, whatever they are.

Sorry if this may be sprinklng some salt on the wounds, but it seems so appropriate to follow up Eagle's post with....

Even some of us with seemingly everything going our way need a bit of incentive to get by now and then.

 

[gr8eyes]

Honzo, good luck to you in the future. I hope things work out for you in the end.

I can't imagine taking on the responsibility of flying a commercial aircraft, for less than 80,000 a year. I wouldn't do it.

 

[krashdragon]

Good luck with whatever you chose to do.

Sometimes doing nothing is doing the right thing.

sometimes not...

But hang in there...

At least you're not sewing doggie diapers for $5 each... but hey, it's cash....

https://www.crossurharness.com/

Thank God I have a sense of humor..otherwise, I might get depressed! <_<

Mary

 

[uctofeej]

Financially, I would say look here. Give Dave a listen for a few weeks and see what changes. You'll soon learn it's not what you make, but how you use it.

The kayak ain't a bad way to get around either. I have two (one tandem -- for anyone brave enough to climb aboard -- and a single). It builds strength, endurance, and you can have a blast going places few have gone, like my Mississippi River cruise north of Memphis.

 

[mdisher]

With only a two year degree, my options are limited.

Don't take this the wrong way but ********

Some of the brightest folks I know either don't have degrees, or have degrees in something entirely unrelated to what they are doing.

Doesn't mean the paper doesn't help. But don't use that as an excuse or crutch. Anyone that wouldn't hire you simply because of that is very short sighted.

It doesn't mean you won't have to pay your dues or prove yourself, folks out of college have to do that too. There is no shortages of useless people with MBA's.

Find what you love to do and are good at and work it.

-MD

 

[jjsC6]

I've had several friends who are pilots, some still are. I understand that some have to start out at fairly low paying jobs. But I've also seen them all work their way up to $100,000 + positions. I'm not sure how this is any different than any other profession. I don't see any reason for you to be bashing the industry because you are not there yet. If it's that bad for you, get out of it. But don't blame the industry for your situation.

I know a guy that was a 20 year United Capt. They furloughed him the last time the MBAs wanted to save some money, which forced his early retirement with half pension. He was making close to 200K at 55 years old... Been a couple years since anyone I know has heard from the guy.

And if you can explain why 9/11 was a good reason for underwriters to double their total time requirements of ALL pilots everywhere, setting back many a career, then I am listenning. All in all, I will bash whatever I have been intimately involved with for 2.5 decades if I please.

Do you think the airline industry has a monopoly on screwing up peoples careers? It happens in all industries. It sounds like he made damn good money, and at every pay day, they were back to even. He did his job, and they paid him. I guess this is supposed to be a socialistic society where you are owed a living?

 

[jmdaniel]

It sounds like he made damn good money, and at every pay day, they were back to even. He did his job, and they paid him. I guess this is supposed to be a socialistic society where you are owed a living?

A good article from yesterday:

Age of Entitlement

 

[painman]

With only a two year degree, my options are limited.

Don't take this the wrong way but ********

Some of the brightest folks I know either don't have degrees, or have degrees in something entirely unrelated to what they are doing.

Doesn't mean the paper doesn't help. But don't use that as an excuse or crutch. Anyone that wouldn't hire you simply because of that is very short sighted.

It doesn't mean you won't have to pay your dues or prove yourself, folks out of college have to do that too. There is no shortages of useless people with MBA's.

Find what you love to do and are good at and work it.

-MD

Well said!! One step at a time....PM. <><

 

[Pappy]

I have 400hrs in single-engine pistons and have my private, instrument, and commercial ratings. I wanted to be a professional pilot but when I did the homework I realized it wasn't for me. I'm accustomed to be paid to work.

The airline industry's crazy and essentially expects people to be slaves. Plus the FAA gets to squeeze you too. Every six months you get to play the always fun and exciting "Bet-My-Rating" game with a grumpy examiner and sweat out a physical. You could fly for 20 years and get grounded, POOF!, just like that for developing high blood pressure or any one of a thousand other, otherwise-minor, issues. So, despite my love of flying, I chose another path in gas turbine engineering (first Pratt and now GE).

Flying was, and still is, about the only thing I've ever done in my life where I was COMPLETELY comfortable and confident in my abilities. VFR into Washington Nation? No problem (before 9/11). NY Class Bravo up and down the Hudson River during the afternoon rush? Easy (even after 9/11). They'de let me in at 5pm on Christmas eve if I asked, I was that confident and sure of what I was doing. I was 15 years old living in Manhatten and would listen to NY Approach and LGA on the scanner and read Flying magazine for fun.

I dropped it like a hot rock when I learned I'd have to eat shizznit off a plate for 10 years to make any money at it. Screw that. MOVE ON. Flying's not the only thing in the world. Frankly, if you're reacting so negatively to some adversity, then maybe you're not up to dealing with the HUGE frustration's you'll run into every day in today's ATC system. So, either go after it like a tiger and deal with the issues it presents or find something else.

I spent over $40,000 on my flying and didn't pursue the career. Though I wish it would have worked out, I don't regret it a bit. I'm still alive, never scratched a plane, and have some great stories.

Al T

PS - Those tickets and ratings look great on a resume regardless of the industry in which you're applying.

 

[jjsC6]

It sounds like he made damn good money, and at every pay day, they were back to even. He did his job, and they paid him. I guess this is supposed to be a socialistic society where you are owed a living?

A good article from yesterday:

Age of Entitlement

Thanks for posting. I've been in the same industry 34 years. At 26 years, after never being unemployed I got let go. Three years later, it happened to me again. The first time, I had a job with no loss of pay in less than a week. The next time I got another job in five weeks, and am now making more money than I ever did. I attribute this to having a good reputation in my industry, a good attitude and I never burned bridges.

I understand that some people truly do have bad things happen to them. But we are still in charge of our own destiny. I'm sorry if I have come across as unsympathetic. I am sympathetic to people losing their job, but not to those who bash the industry as if it's conspiracy.

 

[JimH]

I was in the military for ten years and was not at all happy. I loved the people I worked with, but not the people I worked for. I knew that I had to move on and do something different. It took my wife, a civilian and never military until she met me, to make me realize that there are other things in life. I don't regret my service. I am very proud of it. I am glad that I made the move. Things were difficult early on with civilian flying and to say that the military guys all have it made is not all true. Life is what you make of it. After 9/11 I thought I was going to be on the street. So, my wife came to me one day and said she was starting her own business. I said "What the F___"?! It was a good thing that she did. I was very lucky not to get laid off, and her business has been a huge success. It's the old lemonade out of lemons. What happens if my company closes its doors? I don't know. I will move on and do something different or perhaps fly for somebody else. Figure out what you enjoy doing. If it is flying, the money should not matter. It will come, but you have to be willing to make the sacrifices and changes to make it better. If it is painting houses, you have to start somewhere. The money will come. How do I know? I know house painters that are millionaires. It's not what you do, it is being the best at what you do. I am fortunate to live where I do and to know a lot of hugely successful people. Both financially and otherwise. One thing they have in common is none of them waited for it to come to them. They made it happen...

I'll get off my soap box now.