FJR's and motorcycle speakers!

[bobg3723]

As for amps clipping past the bleeding edge, the FJR does not have enough spare amperage to drive enough amps for any decent sound at the volume you'd need for the highway, even if you could find a way to mount good speakers.

Bad idea, abandon it immediately.

+1 If you still don't believe see spider threads.

And?

 

[Pepperell]

Gee, it must be Friday somewhere in the world!

Professional musicians use in-ear monitors nowadays; so should you.

They are a little light in the low end, but maybe you could use one of these.clicky!

 

[bobg3723]

the FJR does not have enough spare amperage to drive enough amps for any decent sound at the volume you'd need for the highway

You obviously have a shaky understanding regarding aspects of electrical power wfooshee. Nice try.

 

[bobg3723]

Gee, it must be Friday somewhere in the world!

Professional musicians use in-ear monitors nowadays; so should you.

They are a little light in the low end, but maybe you could use one of these.clicky!

Yeah, but my accordion music doesn't reach those bottom octaves. Besides, I prefer to cut off the frequency (somewhere below 200Hz) FAST!!! to help the full range amp from just simply moving air and also to keep any unplanned for DC signals getting to the speaker. I hate the smell of fried speaker coils.

 

[phroenips]

I sure hope this thread keeps going until tomorrow! (P.S. It is already Friday in Asia)

Bobby G is apparently just looking for that one person to agree with him and ignoring everyone else.

 

[bobg3723]

I sure hope this thread keeps going until tomorrow! (P.S. It is already Friday in Asia)

Bobby G is apparently just looking for that one person to agree with him and ignoring everyone else.

I wish you would say something pertinent phroenips so I can disagree with you too! Hahaha!!! :lol2: :lol2: :lol2:

It's only Thursday here in Minnesocold, but it's close enough! :yu:

 

[wheatonFJR]

I agree with BobG. He should DEFINITELY install the system on HIS bike. :clapping:

Who knows? Show up at one of the regional FJR events with it and prove us all wrong...it may start catching on! I hear that LPs are a hot item these days...so who knows?

GO FOR IT BOB!!!



Man, I really hope he does. :lol:

BTW, at a group FJR ride, I'm guessing that people will ask you to ride in the back...even if you're the fastest mofo out there...which you may be. B)

 

[bobg3723]

I agree with BobG. He should DEFINITELY install the system on HIS bike. :clapping:

Who knows? Show up at one of the regional FJR events with it and prove us all wrong...it may start catching on! I hear that LPs are a hot item these days...so who knows?

GO FOR IT BOB!!!



Man, I really hope he does. :lol:

It's not sexy enough.

It's not loud enough.

And just how do you prove something one way or the other that is entirely subjective, pray tell, cuz I woot really like ta know?

BTW, at a group FJR ride, I'm guessing that people will ask you to ride in the back...even if you're the fastest mofo out there...which you may be. B)

This is about sounds systems. Not politics. Stay on topic there wheaton. <_<

Ok?

 

[wheatonFJR]

Sounds like your mind's made up there, Bob. What did you need from us again?

Either way, if you install them, I hope YOU like them. So long as it isn't blaring by me, I couldn't give a rip.

You asked us for our thoughts, and we expressed those. Don't be surprised if others have opinions different from yours...believe it or not, that happens sometimes on the innernets.

 

[wfooshee]

the FJR does not have enough spare amperage to drive enough amps for any decent sound at the volume you'd need for the highway

You obviously have a shaky understanding regarding aspects of electrical power wfooshee. Nice try.

By amps I meant amperes, not amplifiers, sorry.

You might have 100 or 150 watts of surplus power from the stator over what is required to actually power the bike's systems.

You're not going to get listenable sound through speakers with less than 30 watts per channel of amplifier output. If you try to use a radio with built in "hi-power" amplifiers you're probably looking at 12 to 15 watts per channel. Maybe that would fly.

Matter of fact, that's probably what you'd have to use. Where the hell you gonna put an external amp?!?!?!

But since we all know that amplifiers are not what you'd call "efficient," how much actual load is that putting on your electrical system? Speaking of "shaky" . . .

+1 If you still don't believe see spider threads.

And?

He's telling you to have a look at the issues people are having on Gen-II bikes with grounding issues, what are called grounding spiders. Junction points several places in the harness where several ground wires come together from various items and accessories on the bike, and join with a single wire that is actually grounded to the frame. Two or three of these junctions are well-known for overheeating and melting, resulting in very bizarre issues with electrical items. The implication is: You wanna add to that load?!?!?!?

BTY, I've been installing car and home sound systems since the late '70s. I can hear, and I know how to distribute power. Please don't belittle my electrical knowledge again. :angry2:

 

[SacramentoMike]

.

Thirteen posts on this thread so far, and counting. Way to get rid of that much-despised "FNG" label, Bob. Wheatie's right. If you want to do it, do it. Just don't keep drumming on it and expect to get everybody (or anybody) else to go along with what the consensus clearly shows is considered a bad idea.

BTW, at a group FJR ride, I'm guessing that people will ask you to ride in the back...even if you're the fastest mofo out there...which you may be. B)

This is about sounds systems. Not politics. Stay on topic there wheaton. <_<

It's so we won't have to LISTEN to your selections, Bob. Not your politics. Or ours. Politics? WTF?

the FJR does not have enough spare amperage to drive enough amps for any decent sound at the volume you'd need for the highway

You obviously have a shaky understanding regarding aspects of electrical power wfooshee. Nice try.

By amps I meant amperes, not amplifiers, sorry.

You might have 100 or 150 watts of surplus power from the stator over what is required to actually power the bike's systems.

You're not going to get listenable sound through speakers with less than 30 watts per channel of amplifier output. If you try to use a radio with built in "hi-power" amplifiers you're probably looking at 12 to 15 watts per channel. Maybe that would fly.

Matter of fact, that's probably what you'd have to use. Where the hell you gonna put an external amp?!?!?!

But since we all know that amplifiers are not what you'd call "efficient," how much actual load is that putting on your electrical system? Speaking of "shaky" . . .

+1 If you still don't believe see spider threads.

And?

He's telling you to have a look at the issues people are having on Gen-II bikes with grounding issues, what are called grounding spiders. Junction points several places in the harness where several ground wires come together from various items and accessories on the bike, and join with a single wire that is actually grounded to the frame. Two or three of these junctions are well-known for overheeating and melting, resulting in very bizarre issues with electrical items. The implication is: You wanna add to that load?!?!?!?

BTY, I've been installing car and home sound systems since the late '70s. I can hear, and I know how to distribute power. Please don't belittle my electrical knowledge again. :angry2:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

OP guy: consider getting past the need to jump back on with another retort. This is a very helpful post. Can you just thank the man and let go now?

 

[bobg3723]

.

Thirteen posts on this thread so far, and counting. Way to get rid of that much-despised "FNG" label, Bob. Wheatie's right. If you want to do it, do it. Just don't keep drumming on it and expect to get everybody (or anybody) else to go along with what the consensus clearly shows is considered a bad idea.

Well clearly the most vocal of the group talked about 8-track players falling out of fashion, bloviating on how other people might receive me, bla bla bla. People can go about waging their finger at me for my opinions, yet freely chastise me with their own. Fine, whatever. A little topic drift is fine for humor and such, but if you can dish out your own humor then humor with me with mine, OK!?!? I didn't ask for anybody to go along with me. That's your read on it and it's plain fallacious. Reread post#1. Your experiences only, please. I got a few of those opinions at the start and even acknowledged them. I didn't have to agree with them any more than ya'll had to agree with me.

So let's take it down a notch now, or else I'm gonna blast out some German Polka music at ya!!

 

[bobg3723]

the FJR does not have enough spare amperage to drive enough amps for any decent sound at the volume you'd need for the highway

You obviously have a shaky understanding regarding aspects of electrical power wfooshee. Nice try.

By amps I meant amperes, not amplifiers, sorry.

You might have 100 or 150 watts of surplus power from the stator over what is required to actually power the bike's systems.

You're not going to get listenable sound through speakers with less than 30 watts per channel of amplifier output. If you try to use a radio with built in "hi-power" amplifiers you're probably looking at 12 to 15 watts per channel. Maybe that would fly.

Matter of fact, that's probably what you'd have to use. Where the hell you gonna put an external amp?!?!?!

But since we all know that amplifiers are not what you'd call "efficient," how much actual load is that putting on your electrical system? Speaking of "shaky" . . .

+1 If you still don't believe see spider threads.

And?

He's telling you to have a look at the issues people are having on Gen-II bikes with grounding issues, what are called grounding spiders. Junction points several places in the harness where several ground wires come together from various items and accessories on the bike, and join with a single wire that is actually grounded to the frame. Two or three of these junctions are well-known for overheeating and melting, resulting in very bizarre issues with electrical items. The implication is: You wanna add to that load?!?!?!?

BTY, I've been installing car and home sound systems since the late '70s. I can hear, and I know how to distribute power. Please don't belittle my electrical knowledge again. :angry2:

You're not going to get listenable sound through speakers with less than 30 watts per channel of amplifier output. If you try to use a radio with built in "hi-power" amplifiers you're probably looking at 12 to 15 watts per channel. Maybe that would fly.

So, you seem to say now after some consideration that 12 to 15 w/ch "maybe that would fly", although you qualify that statement with "You're not going to get listenable sound through speakers with less than 30 watts per channel of amplifier output". That's a far cry from your original assertion to the contrary to "abandon my efforts" (post #16), I was hoping to hear why. But, then again you must have re-read my second post (post #4) and realized that the spec I was calling for was 50W RMS x 2. Ooops.

Q: Where the hell you gonna put an external amp?!?!?!

A. Inside somewhere in the space containing the headlights (below it) would be prefered. I'm trying to keep the power amp component buried like a tick if possible, with a remote fuse holder. Otherwise:

mounted in a sloping black box centered on an R/LINE dash with additional sheetmetal work to blend in with it,

or under a Smuggler is a possibility but unlikely ($$$$),

or in a case between the handlebars (last resort) ,

or in one of the saddle cases.

Q: But since we all know that amplifiers are not what you'd call "efficient,"

A: Well, Class D would be optimum for less amplifier Q being wasted as heat.

Q: how much actual load is that putting on your electrical system?

A: I'm putting the load across the battery terminals. I don't plan on loading down any other circuit branches by putting the power amp on any existing circuit. Yes I'm aware of the spider issues.

 

[bobg3723]

It's so we won't have to LISTEN to your selections, Bob. Not your politics. Or ours. Politics? WTF?

I can tell you're no fan of Polka, either. -_- :huh:

 

[wfooshee]

Q: how much actual load is that putting on your electrical system?

A: I'm putting the load across the battery terminals. I don't plan on loading down any other circuit branches by putting the power amp on any existing circuit. Yes I'm aware of the spider issues.

Now we're having a constructive discussion, and that's cool.

Connecting across the battery terminals does not reduce the load on the stator in any way, shape, or form. Current has to come from somewhere, and the battery can't supply it forever. It has to charge to balance the discharge, and that comes from the stator. You need amps (amperes) for your amps (amplifiers.)

I can't find it now, but somewhere on here (maybe one of the FAQs, I didn't look there!) there's a good post or thread about measuring the load with a voltmeter. Basically, voltage across the battery drops as the bike's accessories soak up the stator output. Guys with aircraft landing lights mounted on their mirrors, and heated gear wrapped around their torsos and limbs will tell you all about how long the bike will [not] run when the volts get down into the low 13s. A stock bike, no added accessories will run about 14.2 volts while riding. Adding auxiliary lights and heated gear are the big loads commonly added, and Gen-I bikes don't take to having both, quickly getting in to the mid-13s with either add-on. Doing both is out of the question. Gen-II has more output, but the harness is still weak in a lot of areas, apparently built with "They won't really do all that" in the back of the engineer's mind.

If you do this, keep a voltmeter across the battery, and watch it as you crank the system. If you get into the low to mid 13s you're running on battery resources, not alternator output, and the voltage will keep dropping until the ignition stops, or you turn off the music.

If it stays in the high 13s then you're golden.

Just for an example, I added loud horns from Discount Auto Parts to my bike, they mount in the same place as the stock horns, no clearance issues, but they draw a huge load electrically. I run 'em through a relay to keep the horn button from sizzling. Hitting the horn at highway speed (meaning maximum or near maximum stator output) drops my volts from 14.2 to 13.3 or 13.4. Just honking the damn horn, nearly a full volt! If I had heated gear or big-ass lights, the bike might shut off if I honked the horn! :huh:

As far as speakers on the bike, I think you'd be making a huge effort to cobble something together that will sound marginally better than something you recorded on a portable cassette recorder by holding its mike to a phone that was playing music the guy in Germany was playing when he called you (speaking of polkas.) The only advantage it would have is that it could be shared, whether those around you wanted it shared or not.

Earbuds or good helmet speakers (like something stolen out of a good set of headphones) will blow away a speaker set any time, any place.

 

[smellthat?]

I noted you thought about placing the amp up front - I can tell you from doing an HID install - there is NO room up front for anything! Man it's tight up there. I had a tough time finding suitable places for the HID equipment and that stuff are all relatively small/flat pieces. Overall, I think most of us agree that external speakers will not give you the sound you want above what a good helmet/ear bud setup will provide (we know about that since many of us use this very setup - like I said earlier I love the BlueAnt setup, best sound I have ever gotten from an off-the-shelf wireless.) Good luck either way - post some pics once you shoehorn that stuff in there!!!

 

[bobg3723]

Well, needless to say, the total current draw can't be permited to exceed the charging rate of the stator. An accounting of all electrical loads have to be summed up, of course. This has to be determined beforehand when added to the total and I'm looking closely at only a handfull of Class D power amps that might be a good fit --current draw wise and mounting space wise. Voltmeters have been around since forever and are a good thing.

If I have to turn off my handwarmers, well let's say I won't miss them during the summer.

At least one marine amp in particular comes rated at driving a 4 ohm impedence with a power rating of 60 WRMS x 2 ch, at a nominal voltage of 12.5V, dimensioning to 8-9/16"L x 7-1/8"W x 2-1/16"H.

Senior smellthat? is right on the mark. Shoehorn is an apt description.

As for the relative audio clarity, they're outdoor speakers after all. I think they'll be a good fit soundwise with my superb collection of 8-track cartridges and under-sampled MP3's, dontcha tink?

But Shirley there are other situations where having outdoor speakers might have an advantage or subjectively preferable (this is a judgement call after all) for the rider. Such as riding your own ride solo. Not all of us ride with groups.

How about helmet-less? Are we going to dictate riders put a helmet on where you can legally ride without them for the sake of headphones over speakers on a sweltering summer day cruising down the asphalt strip?. What would the LEO say if you had your earbuds on, clearly visible when you roll into some obscure hamlet en-route? Now would he give you a F**K you have a nice day citation for those fabulous earbuds in your ear or for having too much chrome on yer speakers, I ask?

So the reasons why not to have outdoor speakers don't appear all that restrictive. If riding past those of you (and you know who you are) with my "loud" bike upsets you on a sunny 4th of July, well get over it.

Anyway, I appreciate views expressed, constructive criticisms, and razzes, too. As for the straw man arguments, eehhh, whatever.

I think I earned my Friday dogpile, so when the fun starts let me know. :headbonk:

 

[wheatonFJR]

...I think I earned my Friday dogpile, so when the fun starts let me know. :headbonk:

meh...

You owe it to yourself and frankly, the rest of us, to install this forward thinking mod...take it for a good test ride of a couple thousand miles, and do a good report (with pictures, cuz I don't read too well) on the thing.

Then, this thread will have been useful.

 

[SacramentoMike]

...I think I earned my Friday dogpile, so when the fun starts let me know. :headbonk:

meh...

You owe it to yourself and frankly, the rest of us, to install this forward thinking mod...take it for a good test ride of a couple thousand miles, and do a good report (with pictures, cuz I don't read too well) on the thing.

Then, this thread will have been useful.

Gunny! But avoid Sacramento. Or risk running afoul of my circuitry-frying fantasy anti-polka ray gun.

.

 

[bobg3723]

...I think I earned my Friday dogpile, so when the fun starts let me know. :headbonk:

meh...

You owe it to yourself and frankly, the rest of us, to install this forward thinking mod...take it for a good test ride of a couple thousand miles, and do a good report (with pictures, cuz I don't read too well) on the thing.

Then, this thread will have been useful.

I'll have to disagree with you there Wheatser on the conditional "usefulness" of this thread. Ya see, the topic is

"FJR's and motorcycle speakers! Tell us why you prefer those instead of headphones or earbuds".

The topic is not about proving a point. It's not about pleasing anyone. It's not about why you disagree with the premise of the thread, or your own personal bias to the contrary. But you can certainly express all those aforementioned viewpoints without hijacking the thread, but I just expect people to stay within the scope of the topic if it's all the same to you. The topic clearly states that it pertains to those individuals who have an expressed opinion about motorcycle speakers of the outdoor type installed on their FJR.

If you want to start a consensus, well you're perfectly free to start that topic or any other topic to suite your viewpoint and get some lovin' there.

...I think I earned my Friday dogpile, so when the fun starts let me know. :headbonk:

meh...

You owe it to yourself and frankly, the rest of us, to install this forward thinking mod...take it for a good test ride of a couple thousand miles, and do a good report (with pictures, cuz I don't read too well) on the thing.

Then, this thread will have been useful.

Gunny! But avoid Sacramento. Or risk running afoul of my circuitry-frying fantasy anti-polka ray gun.

.

Hehehe. I'll comply. Lock and load! :lol: (The lights flickering at the Sacramento Power Authority as we speak).