Fuel injector question

[ionbeam]

Glad you have 'er running. This may be a small nit-pick but it wasn't 'All it was, was the spark plugs.' It was the gas and gas treatment that most likely led to the plugs getting fouled. I agree with Ross, you should check your plugs again and note if they are wet/dry and the color. I suspect that if you checked the plugs first they would have looked OK, then you would have treated the gas and then fouled the plugs. As Ross says, the FJR isn't a plug fouler unless something went seriously wrong.

 

[Klubis]

Plugs don't often foul like that, especially on a modern fuel-injected bike. (even with crappy fuel) I would check them in a couple of hundred miles and make sure there isn't an underlying problem.

Thanks for the suggestion, I'll do that. Might be a good time to add block off plates.

 

[Klubis]

Glad you have 'er running. This may be a small nit-pick but it wasn't 'All it was, was the spark plugs.' It was the gas and gas treatment that most likely led to the plugs getting fouled. I agree with Ross, you should check your plugs again and note if they are wet/dry and the color. I suspect that if you checked the plugs first they would have looked OK, then you would have treated the gas and then fouled the plugs. As Ross says, the FJR isn't a plug fouler unless something went seriously wrong.

I agree it was a combo of things, and the old gas and the overdose of gas treatment contributed. Other than that, I doubt and strongly hope that there is nothing "seriously wrong". It sure felt like it though. She is a 2007 that only had 1600 a1700 miles on her when I got her this past November. I suspected I would have problems because of all the time sitting. I truly feel now that she is good to go, but I will monitor closely for a while just to be sure.

Is it easy to post pictures? I'd like to show ya'll the plugs.

 

[ionbeam]

...I doubt and strongly hope that there is nothing "seriously wrong"....
Is it easy to post pictures? I'd like to show ya'll the plugs.

Upload your pictures to any picture hosting site such as Photobucket. Click on the link to the picture (in Photobucket it's the Direct Link), then in the Forum, in the message box click on the picture icon and paste the link into the pop-up box. The actual details and what you see can vary with the type of web browser you are using, but this is the general idea (and what you will see using Firefox).

 

[JamesK]

Fuel injector rebuilding and cleaning involves some common elements of fuel injectors. The following injector is a Nippon Denso from a Yamaha boat engine. On the top left side, the item with the gold collar is a fuel filter, almost all injectors gots 'em. The filter can plug from debris but the tip orifices and pintles should be protected from the dirt. The tip orifices and pintles can clog from carbon or fuel varnish. Injector service should include the fuel filter, cleaning the tip and O-ring replacements.
Running fuel system cleaner through the gas tank is unable to take care of debris that collects in the injector filter but it can help with carbon and varnish on the tip.

Apologies if this is a stupid question, but could anyone pls advise how to remove the filter from the Fuel Injectors for cleaning? I can't seem to see any obvious way and at $120 a pop, I am worried about experimenting too much.

 

[RadioHowie]

Seriously, I'd leave it the hell alone. If your honestly concerned, take the injectors to a qualified repair facility.

I had mine done for about $35...cleaned and balanced. Not expensive at all.

 

[JamesK]

Seriously, I'd leave it the hell alone. If your honestly concerned, take the injectors to a qualified repair facility.
I had mine done for about $35...cleaned and balanced. Not expensive at all.

Thanks for the advice RH, I'll try. The problem of course is that I'm in Japan, and barely speak a word of Japanese, and like most/all things in Japan it's likely to be a lot more expensive than in the US.

What exactly do you mean by balanced? I ask because I'll be trying to explain this to some shop in "sign language" and with the limited help of Google Translate on my iPhone

 

[bluesdog]

The little filters on the injectors are not a serviceable item. They are forcibly removed with an extractor, and pretty much destroyed during the process.

When you have the injectors cleaned, typically they are all subsequently connected to a machine which checks the flow. AFAIK it is not possible to actually 'balance' them, but typically there will be some minor variation among them w/respect to flow.

The tech will know if they are all within spec, and if not will advise you accordingly.

A good injector service will know what to do, in any language!

Good luck

 

[RadioHowie]

Seriously, I'd leave it the hell alone. If your honestly concerned, take the injectors to a qualified repair facility.
I had mine done for about $35...cleaned and balanced. Not expensive at all.

Thanks for the advice RH, I'll try. The problem of course is that I'm in Japan, and barely speak a word of Japanese, and like most/all things in Japan it's likely to be a lot more expensive than in the US.

What exactly do you mean by balanced? I ask because I'll be trying to explain this to some shop in "sign language" and with the limited help of Google Translate on my iPhone

The little filters on the injectors are not a serviceable item. They are forcibly removed with an extractor, and pretty much destroyed during the process.
When you have the injectors cleaned, typically they are all subsequently connected to a machine which checks the flow. AFAIK it is not possible to actually 'balance' them, but typically there will be some minor variation among them w/respect to flow.

The tech will know if they are all within spec, and if not will advise you accordingly.

A good injector service will know what to do, in any language!

Good luck

I had my injectors checked during the "Rusty Tank Episode" of 2009. Worried that my injectors were toast, I sent them off to https://www.cruzinperformance.com/ and they were cleaned and "flow-matched" to 1% for $32.40, including shipping! I really don't have a clue to what "flow matching" involves, but I was pleased with the price and turnaround time.

 

[bluesdog]

When mine were cleaned, the tech hooked 'em up to his test equipment, and showed me they were all within spec, and reasonably close in terms of static and dynamic flow.

You can see that #3 in the pic is a little high, and # 4 a bit low. He said that the difference amounted to @ 1% on the low side for # 4, and a little less than 1% positive for # 3.

When I installed them, I put #4 first in line, in #1 spot, and #3 at #4. I figured that perhaps the one placed closer to the inlet end of the fuel rail would receive slightly higher pressure, than the one at the end, thus balancing out any minor difference.

(I'm fully aware this is probably simply magical thinking, but what the hey...)

I asked the tech about balancing/flow matching, and he pretty much gave me the same information as found here:

Can you "flow match" or "balance" my injectors?

The flow rate of the injectors cannot be changed or adjusted. In order to make a balanced or matched set of injectors, you need to start with more injectors than are needed for your application. All of the injectors would be cleaned and tested. Then, the injectors that flow closest to each other are grouped in sets according to their flow. This, in essence, makes a "matched" set.

In any case, the bike runs flawlessly, and even has a smooth idle compared to many inline fours.

 

[RadioHowie]

Good info!

 

[steve'o']

For what it's worth, I had a similar problem with my '03 on #4 cylinder, bike stumbled and ran rough, worked t\like crap, did almost everything under the sun, including compression checks, spark gap test, so on and so on, until a buddy of mine found the little brass air/fuel mixture screw on #4 cylinder was backed almost all the way out, which was causing that plug to foul up in a hurry. I replaced the plugs 4 times before this was identified. My injector was fine. Once the screw was back where it was supposed to be I did a TBS and then performed the unauthorized TBS, which made my FJR a totally different bike. Just throwing that out there for some info.