Gonna do tapered head bearings

[dcarver]

Sooo, I've been quiet about All Balls until now.

Not sure they have the same quality as say, Timken. JSNS.

Would not surprise me if they 'settle' in over time causing looseness and handling issues.

Just a thought, no scientific fact.

Only 2 data points I have are 4 FJR's using Timkens with no issues and we didn't even use a torque wrench... just pretend it's a wheel bearing, over tighten, walk away, come back an hour later, loosen, over-tighten, wait an hour, loosen and set until no looseness is felt in front forks front and back. Literally, over 100k across the 4 bikes and no torque adjustments to any of them.

I know, backyard tech but it seemed to work.

YMMV, of course.

 

[enumclaw]

So I'm in the middle of this also, and I agree with dcarver about AllBalls in general. However, properly set the stem bearings don't exactly see a lot of abuse on a street bike, within reason of course. My gen 1 has about 55k on it, and while there has been absolutely no wobble, even with a well-worn tire, I do have a flat spot dead center. So since I needed to replace the tire and wheel bearings anyway, I decided to do the stem bearings as well. I've got the races back in the head (geez, the bottom is a pita with the fairing on no matter what anyone says), and the rest will go together in the morning. I will also do the dcarver method; over tighten, come back later, loosen and reset. Tweak as necessary. We'll see if that's necessary.

Yes, first time on an FJR, but there's not much variation between machines.

 

[dcarver]

I wonder if maybe the Bottom race wasn't seated fully?

Looking back at my CandyButtAss website.. I see a neighbor machined a specialty tool to seat it for me.

https://candybuttorg.ipage.com/cba/node/498

edit

I see I used an SKF not Timken bearing.

 

[Auburn]

Sooo, I've been quiet about All Balls until now.
Not sure they have the same quality as say, Timken. JSNS.

Would not surprise me if they 'settle' in over time causing looseness and handling issues.

Just a thought, no scientific fact.

Only 2 data points I have are 4 FJR's using Timkens with no issues and we didn't even use a torque wrench... just pretend it's a wheel bearing, over tighten, walk away, come back an hour later, loosen, over-tighten, wait an hour, loosen and set until no looseness is felt in front forks front and back. Literally, over 100k across the 4 bikes and no torque adjustments to any of them.

I know, backyard tech but it seemed to work.

YMMV, of course.

Don, what is the part number SKF or Timken bearings?

 

[dcarver]

Sooo, I've been quiet about All Balls until now.
Not sure they have the same quality as say, Timken. JSNS.

Would not surprise me if they 'settle' in over time causing looseness and handling issues.

Just a thought, no scientific fact.

Only 2 data points I have are 4 FJR's using Timkens with no issues and we didn't even use a torque wrench... just pretend it's a wheel bearing, over tighten, walk away, come back an hour later, loosen, over-tighten, wait an hour, loosen and set until no looseness is felt in front forks front and back. Literally, over 100k across the 4 bikes and no torque adjustments to any of them.

I know, backyard tech but it seemed to work.

YMMV, of course.

Don, what is the part number SKF or Timken bearings?

DSC03922.jpg

https://candybuttorg.ipage.com/cba/node/572

 

[Brodie]

Ive put the All Balls kit in all 3 of my FJRs as well as my Ascot and Venture Royale. They worked for me, never had an issue with them once I got the torque right. Granted I didnt take them to nearly 250,000 miles like some have around here, but my experience has been good with that bearing set.

As always - YMMV

Brodie

 

[ReRose]

Went for a day ride today and from when I left the driveway to when I came back was 500.2 miles. Other than this poor old mans body being sore I just keep liking this bike more and more. With a used set of Shinko's R009 and $42 for the All Balls tapered bearings and a total of 1478 miles on it since then all I can say is wow. I don't want to say to loud but I think I like it more than I did my beemers.

 

[MajBach]

If I loosen my grip on the bars, at 45 and decelerating, my Gen 1 shakes so hard it would probably knock me off the bike if I let it continue without grabbing hold again. New front tire helps a lot, but never eliminates.
Interesting that as much as Yamaha has labored to upgrade and update this platform, this one has eluded them.

Or has it?

I've experienced the same thing on my Gen II and found adjusting the compression on the forks makes a night and day difference.

 

[MajBach]

I literally just did mine. Couple of lessons... polishing away! The lower bearing is a pain otherwise. I ended up developing a large burr/lip that had to be polished down. I used a dremel. The upper race drifted in easily. No fairing removal. Just the wheel and forks. Torque to 30 ft lbs as a final torque for the bearings, 80 ft lbs of the steering nut. Plan on retorqueing after about 100 miles or so. I've tried a bunch of different torques, 30 is the sweet spot. Otherwise, wasnt a hard job at all. Went pretty smoothly and minimal cussing.

Loose as in the bike doesnt feel as precise. Nothing else has changed except the bearings. The suspension was perfect prior to the bearings for me especially when I'm loaded down. I've torqued the head bearings down repeatedly with 2-300 miles between torques. I may need to bring it up a little bit. I'm not getting as much test riding as I want to for various reasons...

PJ4863, I sense you're getting a little frustrated with this head bearing job and I can understand because the result of your efforts is not adding up and coming up short. I would suggest taking a deep breath and take a step back. It always helps me anyway.

Keep in mind we are only trying to help and sometimes without actually having our own hands and eyes on your problem it can make it much more difficult to diagnose. You might not like what I'm about to suggest, and I hope I'm wrong. Based on your first post you talked about a burr and dremel tool and sanding. Also your first torque settings being quite high. Since your imprecise handling started after you changed the head bearings, I would take it completely back apart and make sure 1) the bearings spin free and are not damaged. 2)the races are not damaged, not crocked and are fully seated. 3) make sure the bottom bearing sits all the way down on the steering stem and is not loose on the stem. Hopefully all is good. If not correct whatever needs correcting. Assemble everything in accordance with the FSM. People always seem to forget to bounce the forks before torquing the axle and pinch bolt, shops included. This is only my suggestion based on your posts.

Maybe someone else could chime in with some different/better suggestions. Good Luck, I hope you figure it out.

I had no idea just how significant a role steering head bearings played but I have to admit, I cannot fully understand why. After all, there really isnt any spinning going on. In fact, under load, you probably do not turn the bars a full degree from side to side. Can someone explain to me how the function of the bearings is so critical? Why can't a bushing do the same job? Why do you have to torque it twice and why such a low amount? I don't even have a wrench that goes down that low. How does a few pounds of twist either way make such a difference? Any why is the stem nut torque so high??!! What does it even do?

I'm so confused.

 

[Blueridgerider]

It takes patience and time but is well worth the effort. Outstanding results...

I haven't had any issues with head shake (other than with a bad tire). AS far as I know, there are no issues with my head bearings - do you think a change would make a noticeable difference? How would you describe the change?

Notice a change? When a wobble is present, replacing the bearings takes the bike from wobble to no wobble. That simple, that noticeable. Regardless of tire condition, regardless of suspension settings, regardless of suspension oil viscosity, etc., etc. replacing the bearings simply makes the wobble go away forever.

I always heard that as well but recently purchased my 2016, slapped a set of GT4's on the bike, and was suffering from the dreaded wobble. I had always heard that tapered bearing would fix the evils of the wobble so installed a set of All Balls. The mechanic and I were shocked the bike still had a wobble. It was not nearly as bad but far from gone. We discovered that the front tire was defective. I replaced it and then the wobble was history. Michelin paid for the replacement tire as well. So tapered bearings will take care of most problems but its not enough to overcome a bad tire.