Help needed for Iron Butt Rally - Wheels!

[DaJuice]

True, but look who they were. Perry has to decide if he's in that class.

I think Perry and I are in the same boat. I've never done 11 days so I don't know if I'm capable of more than 11,000 miles, but I don't want my tire to decide for me. Besides, I'll have to change the tire either mid rally or at the end of it to make it home. I can swap a wheel in 10 minutes and as long as I'm by my bike, someone can do it for me. in the IB5K last year one rider ate his meal while he watched his dad change his wheel at the checkpoint. Why he needed new rubber on a 5 day event... well, I didn't quite understand that planning either.

 

[user 213]

True, but look who they were. Perry has to decide if he's in that class.

I think Perry and I are in the same boat. I've never done 11 days so I don't know if I'm capable of more than 11,000 miles, but I don't want my tire to decide for me. Besides, I'll have to change the tire either mid rally or at the end of it to make it home. I can swap a wheel in 10 minutes and as long as I'm by my bike, someone can do it for me. in the IB5K last year one rider ate his meal while he watched his dad change his wheel at the checkpoint. Why he needed new rubber on a 5 day event... well, I didn't quite understand that planning either.

You certainly have a point. Several riders have done the IBR on a single set of PR2s. Far too much emphasis is placed on having a spare set of wheels, or fresh rubber, imho.

The point here is simple. How do you ride? Are you going to ride that same way during the IBR? (you should ride how you always do) Then how hard are you on tires? Make your choices accordingly.

Side note, it's pretty sad that you can't count on a rear motorcycle tire to last over 10k any more.

 

[SkooterG]

You certainly have a point. Several riders have done the IBR on a single set of PR2s. Far too much emphasis is placed on having a spare set of wheels, or fresh rubber, imho.

The point here is simple. How do you ride? Are you going to ride that same way during the IBR? (you should ride how you always do) Then how hard are you on tires? Make your choices accordingly.

Side note, it's pretty sad that you can't count on a rear motorcycle tire to last over 10k any more.

I am sorry Eric, but you are talking out your ***. Perhaps because you have never run an IBR.

Far too much emphasis on having a spare set of wheels? I beg to differ. With the tremendous pressure and stress that all the unknowns of the IBR place on a competitor, you try to control what you can. Not having to worry about whether your tires are going to make it through the entire rally is a HUGE factor. One that allows a participant to stress about other **** that is more worthy. Participants have a tremendous amount of time, energy, and money invested in running the rally - perhaps one of the biggest deals in their life in a long time. Tires are most definitely NOT one of the things you want to be worrying about. Nor do you want them to be costing you time, points, or final position places. Its just that simple. I know FJR riders have run a rally on a single set of tires. They were obviously comfortable doing so, or willing to take the time to get replacements while running the rally if necessary. I never was.

And your statement about riding in the IBR as you always do? Complete horsecock! It's an 11 day competitive rally! It's not business as usual! I sure as hell don't get my normal 8 hours of sleep per night during an IBR. I don't eat like normal. I don't do anything like normal during an IBR. An IBR is NOT normal. Why the hell would anyone ride like they 'always do'. You ride like you NEED to to keep safe, and get as many points as you personally can. Period. Sometimes that's more conservative than normal, frequently it's more aggressive than normal. And I load my FJR up with a hell of a lot more weight during an IBR than it 'normally' has which most definitely affects tire life.

You are my friend. You are a good guy. But sometimes your 'opinions' and your ability to tell people what they 'should' do when you know not of what you speak really leave me speechless. Well, I guess not speechless!

 

[rickcorwn]

True, but look who they were. Perry has to decide if he's in that class.

I think Perry and I are in the same boat. I've never done 11 days so I don't know if I'm capable of more than 11,000 miles, but I don't want my tire to decide for me. Besides, I'll have to change the tire either mid rally or at the end of it to make it home. I can swap a wheel in 10 minutes and as long as I'm by my bike, someone can do it for me. in the IB5K last year one rider ate his meal while he watched his dad change his wheel at the checkpoint. Why he needed new rubber on a 5 day event... well, I didn't quite understand that planning either.

You certainly have a point. Several riders have done the IBR on a single set of PR2s. Far too much emphasis is placed on having a spare set of wheels, or fresh rubber, imho.

The point here is simple. How do you ride? Are you going to ride that same way during the IBR? (you should ride how you always do) Then how hard are you on tires? Make your choices accordingly.

Side note, it's pretty sad that you can't count on a rear motorcycle tire to last over 10k any more.

Not to speak for those in the Big Dance but, I don't think it's as much that you can't count on a rear tire lasting 11 or 12 thousand miles. It's how much do you want to count on a tire that's in it's last 25% of it's life. If a frog strangler like the one at the start of the '07 Butt were to happen after the last checkpoint you might feel a lot better with a fresh full tread tire rather than one on it's last 25% of tread.

 

[user 213]

I am sorry Eric, but you are talking out your ***. Perhaps because you have never run an IBR.

You're right Greg, I haven't run the IBR. I do have a tad bit of rally experience though. You rode the IBR like you always ride, imho. :blink: Tremendous amount of pressure? It's just a rally Greg. You know that.

I offer that if someone doesn't ride "rally nominal" on a regular basis, doing so in the IBR is asking for trouble.

Tires, ok fine, Rick's statement is valid. I simply know very well what it's like to ride on that last 25% of tread life and it's a non-issue for me. It's hard for me to understand why anyone would worry about a tire that has tread left on it. :dribble: By the time you ride in the IBR or any other rally, you should have a pretty good idea what it's like to use all of a tire up, any any weather condition. If rain is an issue for you, why enter a 11 day rally where you know you are likely to encounter it and need to ride through it?

Greg, I know how you ride. Thing is, my rally load is the same as my touring load, minus some clothes. My rally riding speed is the same as my touring riding speed. Yepper, I got only 3 hours of sleep each night during the 10 'n 10, and no sleep for some long periods. My sleep and riding periods were not business as usual, but my riding habits and speeds were, that was what my comment was about. I didn't need to think about how I rode, what I packed or anything other than the plan I formed, the boni I was after and how well the plan was working out.

It's an 11 day competitive rally. Well, for you it was. For 70% of the riders its about finishing, not about how well they can compete. There are probably 20 riders that have the potential to win this year. Who has the least bad luck will determine which of those wins.

We are off topic here. Hopefully Perry has his wheel needs sorted to allow him to focus on the planning, routing and other challenges of the IBR.

 

[karstenp]

Wow.... interesting discussion. Bottom line is that each rider has to come up with their own game plan. I am spent time corresponding with several previous IBR vets gathering a lot of valuable information. Based on feedback from various riders and knowledge of my own limitations (granted the longest rally I have participated on is the Iron Butt 5000 so I still have much to learn..) I have come up with a plan. Typical for me, I have a plan that includes contingencies and minimizes potential stress of worrying about a tire that may or may not go the distance or a tire that has limited life left at a point in the rally that I expect to be mentally and physically very tired. Regardless of the view of others, I am comfortable with my current plan. I have learned that it is important to ride your own ride. When I do that, I usually do well and have a lot of fun. Do I expect to be in the top 10? Of course not. But I will be riding to best of my abilities and I do not want to have to "back-off" during the rally due to mechanical/tire concerns.

My current game plan includes another set of wheels. For those interested, below is my "tire plan" for the rally.

1) Install a new set of PR2s tires (my current preferred tire) on spare front and rear wheels. I will leave the wheels with the new tires at a friends or with family prior to leaving for the start of the IBR. Note that I live only about 4 hours from the checkpoint.

2) Leave for Seattle with an "older" set of tires to ride the ~2500 miles to the start of the IBR.

3) Ignacio, who lives a few hours from the start, has graciously agreed to let me use his place to install a new set of tires and complete an oil change prior to the start. I plan on installing ME880s which should "go the distance" of the IBR if required. I have never ridden on ME880s before, so I will be installing a set of ME880s to use for my first LD runs when the snow melts and my 3 practice rallies before the IBR. Plan A is to ride the entire IBR on the ME880s.

4) During the first leg, I will have a good idea on my route and where it will take me. I am hoping that it takes me close to my local trusted dealer (only a few hours from the checkpoint). If so, Plan B, is to have the replacement tires/wheels delivered to my dealer to have the new tires/wheels installed.

5) If my Leg 1 route does not take me close to my dealer, then Plan C is to have the replacement tires/wheels delivered to the Checkpoint hotel and to install the tires/wheels in the parking lot.

6) If Plan B and Plan C do not seem viable or I change my mind, I can always revert to Plan A.

7) Having an extra set of wheels/tires available, also gives my the added contingency of replacing a damaged wheel during Leg 2 of the rally. (Damage to a wheel on Leg 1 would probably result in a DNF).

8) My preference is to have fresh rubber installed for the start of Leg 2. This is the lowest stress option and the option with the highest probability of success from a tire perspective. This option also gives me the ability to ride the 2500 miles home.

So all that said..... the question still stands. Anyone have an 04ABS, 05ABS, 06 or 07 rear wheel?

 

[SkooterG]

So all that said..... the question still stands. Anyone have an 04ABS, 05ABS, 06 or 07 rear wheel?

Did you get my PM?

 

[user 213]

You have too many plans. :lol: You suggest #8 as the lowest stress and the highest probability for success for you. Trust your instincts and go with that.

A couple of comments - Consider scrubbing in the PR2s prior to setting them aside for the checkpoint or when needed. Just 50-100 miles of even use to get rid of release agents and have them set to go. This avoids any potential traction issues while you are focused on your rally plans when departing from the checkpoint or under the stress of a mid-rally wheel swap.

The Me880s might or might not last the length of the rally, (they have in the past), but I'm not so sure I would consider them more long lived than the PR2s, and would consider them to not handle as well as the PR2s in the wet. The 880Rs I've run only went 10k. They would have lasted 1k more if I needed them to, but the wear and handling was truly awful at the end. Just thinking out loud.

Ebay '04 ABS rear wheel

 

[SkooterG]

Tremendous amount of pressure? It's just a rally Greg. You know that.
Greg, I know how you ride.

We are off topic here.

As far as off-topic, you started it! Neener, neener, neener!

Yes, a tremendous amount of stress and pressure. It's NOT just a rally. It's the Iron Butt Rally. Guess you and I approach things differently - probably on ANY rally.

You have no idea how I ride. You may think you know how I ride a rally, and you may not be too far off on that one. However, my FJR is my everyday mode of transportation, at least 80% of my riding is NOT IBA type riding. I ride very differently when in everyday mode, or travelling 'off the clock'. That's why I get a lot of miles out of my rear tires (11-12k on Avons, 19k on a PR2) normally, but not in rally mode. When not running rallys, my fJR is stripped of most LD running gear. Svelte. Just like me.

Regardless, you were trying to impose how YOU think everyone should run a rally. Everybody is different and needs to figure it out for themself in a way they are comfortable with. And thankfully, we are not all like you.

Hugs and Kisses, babe! :****:

 

[huron52]

WOW.... I can really feel the Love! :blink:

 

[user 213]

Don't worry about it Huron52, Skooty still has Koolaid in his system. It's just a flare up. Besides, can you really take the word of someone that has two of the same bikes in his garage? Jeeze, most folks, if they can afford two bikes, will at least change it up a little. Not our boy SkooterG, he needs a spare FJR for when he crashes the first one. Don't bother refuting it Greg, you know it's true, and so does everyone else.

When not running rallys, my fJR is stripped of most LD running gear.

M'kay, so you're a poser. Question is, which camp are you posing in, the squids or the LD? :wub:

Damn Skooty, it's not like I told him to man up and go with the proven tire method for the FJR. :rofl: :lol:

 

[Ignacio]

The Me880s might or might not last the length of the rally, (they have in the past), but I'm not so sure I would consider them more long lived than the PR2s, and would consider them to not handle as well as the PR2s in the wet.

I think they will...having done 13K on an ME880 including an IBR and about 9K or so on several PR2s. The ME880 is mileage king in my opinion...PR2 is a distant second. Agree they don't handle as well in the wet and howl like a sumbitch after 7 or 8K and you flog them up Mt. Hamilton.

The ME880 is a fine choice if you REALLY want to run one tire the distance and NOT do monster miles...even when you're a fat *** like me.

'09 I went with a rear swap (by minimizing the stress and involving the very dependable Kaitsdad and vectervp1), did 12.5K total, and not sure the ME880 would have gone the distance. Aiming for a Top 10 where you're flogging the bike on a particular leg.....I wouldn't think of trying to go the distance without a swap.

Just about any front is going to go the distance in my experience regardless of monster miles or aggressive riding.

Regardless of the view of others, I am comfortable with my current plan. I have learned that it is important to ride your own ride.

There's the money shot. Good on 'ya. Don't take what any of us too seriously...especially those with a rose-colored car tire view of the world.