I just bought a ticker....I think

[apratt]

You should post a sound file here.

Historically, the sound of the tick has been extremely difficult to capture. Microphones and recorders just don't do it justice. Captured in a garage, the echoes and general noise tend to overwhelm the signal. Even in other places, there is a lot of stuff going on acoustically, and when it's new the tick is kind of subtle. This is one reason I give the "wait 4K miles" advice. (I don't think I've heard a recording of an "old" ticker.)

There's a stethoscope method, but I have not used it and I'm no expert. It goes like this: place the tip of a long-stemmed screwdriver against the exhaust header bolts behind the radiator, and press your ear to the handle. Do this with a known-good FJR and a suspected ticker, and do it on all the bolts, and compare. Maybe there are other hard points to listen to also. If you have the tick, it should be discernible this way, usually more pronounced on the left side. (Something about the oil circulation pattern makes it happen on the left side first.) Cam chain tensioner noise tends to be on the right, and most other noises should be consistent across the engine.

Some notes on noise: as I said, I have a re-repaired re-ticker with the new valve guide seals, so you can imagine I'm hyper-sensitive. I hear some noises that peak at certain RPMs, and are also more pronounced under load vs. in neutral. To put the re-re-ticker theory to bed once and for all, I paid the shop to pull the headers and look. Nothing: bone dry. And the noises have not changed in the last 10K miles or so.

As for power, I notice that my '04 is peppier when cold: once the engine warms up, the jolts don't come until above 5800 RPM or so, instead of coming sooner, down lower. Maybe that's normal - I don't have a lot of experience on other FJRs to compare to. So if you feel down on power, it might be "down" compared to earlier that morning, not earlier in the life of the bike.

 

[pjm204]

I wonder what the chances of Yamaha fixing a ticker on an 03 today are? I can live with the noise if I have to pay $1,500 to get it fixed...I guess I could locate a Gen II head and do the repair myself?

 

[apratt]

I don't think it works that way. Can you just put a GenII head on a GenI engine?

The standard repair is to order the proper (new) exhaust valve guide seals and all the other necessary parts, and remove and replace the valve guides and seals and all in the existing head. That's how my second repair was done, and virtually all others. It's a machine-shop job: you have to bake the head to get the new valve guides in. When they swapped out my whole head the first time, it was so they could study it, not because that was the only way to fix it.

Alternatively, maybe you could find a GenI head that already has the new seals, like from a crashed bike whose engine wasn't damaged. Find out from Yamaha what serial numbers (or engine numbers) were manufactured with the new seals, or ask the owner (or Yamaha) about past ticker repair on that engine.

Then again, only a small percentage of GenI heads tick. It's never been clear what factor distinguished tickers from non-tickers: manufacturing variation or riding style or what. Maybe you could get ANY head from a crashed GenI and swap it in, and at worst you'll be rolling the dice again on developing a ticker. The more miles on the head without having ticked, the less likely it seems to be that it will develop the problem.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

...Then again, only a small percentage of GenI heads tick. It's never been clear what factor distinguished tickers from non-tickers: manufacturing variation or riding style or what.

My theory on this -- after giving it considerable thought, and discussing it with an automotive machinist, (and there is, by no means, any universal agreement with my theory among FJR owners...) is: The original (Gen I) head was set-up 'too good' with regard to exhaust valve/valve guide interface (fit) and had very good (perhaps 'too good'?) valve guide oil seals.

During the initial 'running in', if the valve stems ever got 'dry' in their respective guides (too heavy oil?, too many revs when cold?, ...?) they'd gall (metal 'scrubbing' on metal) and then proceed to wear-out the guide's internal bore.

Some engines (in my theory) got the right amount of lube oil (initially and early-on) in their guides (lighter oil?, fewer revs when cold?, ...?) and thus lived well and had a good, proper, long-lived, working fit.

Maybe you could get ANY head from a crashed GenI and swap it in, and at worst you'll be rolling the dice again on developing a ticker. The more miles on the head without having ticked, the less likely it seems to be that it will develop the problem.

That certainly seems to be the case (from experiences reported on this Forum)...?

 

[pjm204]

What are the chances of Yamaha fixing it on their dime this far out of warranty?

 

[FJRay]

That will easy to find out once it has been proven to be a ticker. You haven't done that yet. They will tell you whether or not it is covered. Find a dealer with experience with the issue and move on with the process. Everyone here with ticker knowledge can offer an opinion but you need to deal with it so find a dealer and get at it cause you are wasting valuble riding time stressing over it.

 

[apratt]

Find a dealer with experience with the issue ...

I strongly agree with this. If you go to a dealer who does NOT have experience with the ticker issue, you'll spend a lot of time convincing them this is real - that you aren't an Internet hypochondriac - and they won't really be able to go to bat with Yamaha for you. There was never widespread communication to dealers about this. Even my dealer didn't get official acknowledgment that it was a real issue, though they got the message when there was a new part number for the seals.

One dealer who has a lot of experience with this - from the beginning - is now called Desert Valley Powersports in Prosser, WA. (Used to be Sunnyside Yamaha or a similar name.) Dan Denchel the owner went to Yamaha personally back in the day and helped get this issue on their radar in the first place. He might have some idea whether any affected bikes are still being repaired out of warranty.

Personally, I don't think the odds are good. But I have no evidence either way.

 

[pjm204]

yup, i'm working on finding out if its a ticker, a bad cct, normal noises, or something else.

 

[Bungie]

I've discussed and posted this in another thread about my experience with my ticker recently. Do a search.

04 Ticker sound video

Pay particular attention at the 10 second mark. You can hear what my ticker sounded like plain as day. Purchased the bike with 18K and got the ticking fixed at 65K. Never pumped any oil out the exhaust. Was just annoying as all get out!

 

[RadioHowie]

I've discussed and posted this in another thread about my experience with my ticker recently. Do a search.
04 Ticker sound video

Pay particular attention at the 10 second mark. You can hear what my ticker sounded like plain as day. Purchased the bike with 18K and got the ticking fixed at 65K. Never pumped any oil out the exhaust. Was just annoying as all get out!

Sounds like an FJR to me.

BTW, LOVE how you and Rob "stop" for that stop sign at :12. :you'reunderarrestsmiley:

 

[gainsi]

You need to bear in mind that there is a lot of metal parts moving at high speed in this engine. I've owned my Gen 1 for 8 years, have 47,000kms on it & I consider mine to be low mileage. Yours is new out of the crate !

As an original owner, my advice is to change the oil & filter ASAP for the best MINERAL oil you can get. FJR engines aren't designed to run full synthetic until past the 12,000km mark due to the ceramic bores, so don't neglect this fact. You are still breaking the engine in. If you have no service hisitory, I'd do the spark plugs, TBS, coolant, air filter & shaft drive oil soon too & then ride it. On the right road, rev it up to 6-7,000 rpm in 2nd or 3rd gear & blow the cobwebs out of it.

IMHO, unless the previous owner has somehow abused it (apart from not riding it ! :dribble: ) all you are hearing is perfectly normal. I run a little Flashlube in my gas to help lube the valve seats & keep the injectors clean - maybe try something similar. And I never have to top up with oil from one change to the next - if yours is the same, it's very probable that all is well.

Enjoy the bike & let's us know how you get on with it.

 

[pjm204]

I changed out the oil and filter although the oil that was in there appeared to be very clean. I plan to do the coolant and shaft drive oil soon. I added some marvel mystery oil to the last tank and a little stp oil treatment to the oil.

 

[pjm204]

Well I met up with a fellow FJR rider to listen to my bike. Mine sounded just like his however my bike had been sitting for about 15 minutes. Today when I rode home from work and stopped in my driveway it sounded louder(bike was hot) and more pronounced like in the video above. I cannot really hear it with my helmet on while riding though. I guess I should see if it gets louder over the next few thousand. If I do have a ticker, I wanna get it in to a shop and see if I can get it fixed for free.

 

[Silverbullet]

Not to downplay your concerns but if I was you I'd "ride now, worry later." Both my 03 and 04 were tickers and it started real early in life, 4000-5000 mile range and I rode both of them untill the tick was loud enough that it couldn't be poo-pood as "normal." At this point another few months and some thousands of miles most likely won't make any difference as to if Yamaha will assist in a repair or not, especially considering the low miles on the bike. On my 04 I rode it another 15k and by the time I took it in you didn't have to wonder if something was going on, people taking a look to see where that noise was coming from at gas stations and stop lights made denial out of the question. Ride it a few months, rollup some miles and if it gets louder have the bike down for repairs in the fall after the best part of the season is over.

 

[pjm204]

Not to downplay your concerns but if I was you I'd "ride now, worry later." Both my 03 and 04 were tickers and it started real early in life, 4000-5000 mile range and I rode both of them untill the tick was loud enough that it couldn't be poo-pood as "normal." At this point another few months and some thousands of miles most likely won't make any difference as to if Yamaha will assist in a repair or not, especially considering the low miles on the bike. On my 04 I rode it another 15k and by the time I took it in you didn't have to wonder if something was going on, people taking a look to see where that noise was coming from at gas stations and stop lights made denial out of the question. Ride it a few months, rollup some miles and if it gets louder have the bike down for repairs in the fall after the best part of the season is over.

Yea I agree, I'll ride it until the sound is very loud and unmistakable. It'll suck if Yamaha won't take care of it but I have a feeling persistence is key with that. I'd also like to find the closest Yamaha dealer that has fixed tickers....anyone know of one in the NJ/PA/NY area?

 

[gainsi]

If you can't hear it with your helmet on, you have a normal bike. Ride it & get used to it, & if it's still bothering you in your Fall, get it looked at then.

Enjoy summer.

 

[Rampant]

If you can't hear it with your helmet on, you have a normal bike. Ride it & get used to it, & if it's still bothering you in your Fall, get it looked at then.
Enjoy summer.

I would chill out. I thought I had a ticker but, as he said "if you can't hear it with your helmet on" it is normal. These bikes make plenty of valve noise normally.

I got all weird about it but then realized my bike wasn't any louder than my old Kawasaki Vulcan's valves. Valves make noise. If your bike makes noise, its fine. If it makes a TON of noise, it may not be.

 

[JamesK]

And if it blows lots of grey smoke, don't worry it just means it's running . I had some numbnut try to convince me of this fact when I was buying my first car (a loooong time ago ).

 

[pjm204]

1k miles later and I can hear it with the helmet on now. Oh well...once its over 3k it goes silent...guess I will just keep monitoring it as the summer goes on.

 

[pjm204]

well I stopped by the local yamaha dealer for a clutch cover gasket(doing a clutch soak since the bike sat so long). Had one of the techs listen to the bike. He definitely heard the noise but was not familiar with the exhaust valve guide issue. Said he would do some research on it. So I may bring my bike back in for them to have a better listen. I'd like to get a regional service rep to listen to it and say that Yamaha will cover it.