Kawasaki GTR1400 - Son of Concours

[Warchild]

Latest GTR1400 launch video from the English Kawi web site....

https://www.kawasaki.co.uk/1400gtr/default.asp?Sub=654044A

Definitely a rip-off of opening scene for the movie "Top Gun".... but pretty cool, anyway.

 

[radman]

It'll be a good long while before Frank goes on the block, and a good long while before the bugs are outta Connie the Sequel. But FWIW, I have never been impressed with Kaw quality-you never really see those two words together, least I never have, since before the Mach 2-stroke terrors. They've always struck me as a bike that was built saving a dime here, fitty cents there. The ZX-14 I saw recently looked good at 10 feet, but close up, I saw nothing to change my mind.

 

[GalaxyBlue]

The ZX-14 I saw recently looked good at 10 feet, but close up, I saw nothing to change my mind.

You must have fell on your head getting out of bed to make that statement! :haha:

Kinda like a brown bagger...Looks good from a far... But far from good looking! :lol:

I personally like the ZX14 looks, It's growin' on me!

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

<snip>a good long while before the bugs are outta Connie the Sequel.

... maybe?

<snip, too> But FWIW, I have never been impressed with Kaw quality-you never really see those two words together, least I never have

Well, now you have -- I rode a Concours for 122K miles; and, altho they weren't smothered with luxo features -- you didn't pay for them, either. The stuff that counts was quality -- or, it wouldn't last. They didn't loose their rear ends or have a history of major engine failures or fried stators -- they did have bad J-boxes, tho (eventually). You have, I'm sure?, heard of the famously touted "H**** build quality" -- the same "build-quality" that has cracked frames being welded-up by local welders all over the country..... :angry2: Call a spade a spade and leave the "spin" to the advertizing funded, entertainment industry, moto-mags.

 

[rogdeb]

It just seems over the years Kawisaki has not put out the quality of other manufactures. They run like banshee's but don't seem to hold up. JMHO

It just seems over the years Kawisaki has not put out the quality of other manufactures. They run like banshee's but don't seem to hold up. JMHO

Yep. I only had 89K on my Connie when I sold it after the FJR purchase, and he's still riding and enjoying it.

Yea if it was anyone who would put me down it would be you. Guess I don't get an opinion with the rest of the general concensous about Kawisaki. Sorry for living.

Yea if it was anyone who would put me down it would be you. Guess I don't get an opinion with the rest of the general concensous about Kawisaki. Sorry for living.

Are we a might thin-skinned today? .

Now then fellas - be good.

 

[Scab]

"H**** build quality" -- the same "build-quality" that has cracked frames

Yeah, but those are no ordinary cracks. They are Quality cracks.

 

[Feejer/Weejer man]

The Connie is a dinosaur for technology. Hell Harley has made more changes than kawi did on the Concours. It did go the distance but was by no means spit and polished as were other bikes. List another kawi that had the same record....... None.

So some stand alone but the rest of the industy concurs the same results. Far behingd the other major manufactures. And as far as the Goldwing, name any bike without a year model problem, but over the 30 years of its existence it is by far the best, most dependable bike for two up cross county rides that ever existed.

 

[Warchild]

And as far as the Goldwing, name any bike without a year model problem, but over the 30 years of its existence it is by far the best, most dependable bike for two up cross county rides that ever existed.

Well, no.... IMO, that distinction would go to the Honda ST1100, a purpose-built 2-up touring machine.

The reason that bike was so dependable primarily involved the fact that the powertrain was significantly overbuilt and tremendously understressed.

The ST1100 had incremental changes most every year of it's 12-year production run, with only one year of rather substantial upgrades (1996).

I owned two of these machines (from the mid-90s until 2001), riding a combined 225,000 miles on this platform under some VERY extreme Endurance Rally events, including the 1997 Iron Butt Rally.

There were few machines on the road that could match it's record of unbelieveable reliability.

Pity Honda totally de-nutted itself building the unstable, turgid ST1300 whale-barge. Hey, I test-rode a ST1300 in June, 2002 at the Utah 1088. I wanted to like it. I really, really did. But, it turned out to be a bloated dog of a machine. Bah....! :glare:

The ST1100, OTOH, was phenominal in its day....

 

[Feejer/Weejer man]

Thanks for the info. Didn't know all the facts on the ST. Agree about the 1300. I would own a wing before the ST1300.

 

[FJR1300]

I personally like the ZX14 looks, It's growin' on me!

Dude... put down the crack pipe!

Ugly!

Looks like a very cheap version of the FJR... or what would happen if a silver FJR mated with a black Concours.

:blink:

 

[FJRZON]

I personally like the ZX14 looks, It's growin' on me!

Dude... put down the crack pipe!

Ugly!

FJR1300, ah maybe you should put down your pipe & slippers lol. At least that is what the FJR reminds me of…an old mans bike. LOL. All kidding of course.

The ZX-14 was never meant to be cute. It is a beast…a demonic looking one at that.

Looks are subjective performance is objective. Move on…the torch has passed.

 

[RadioHowie]

I personally like the ZX14 looks, It's growin' on me!

Dude... put down the crack pipe!

Ugly!

FJR1300, ah maybe you should put down your pipe & slippers lol. At least that is what the FJR reminds me of…an old mans bike. LOL. All kidding of course.

The ZX-14 was never meant to be cute. It is a beast…a demonic looking one at that.

Looks are subjective performance is objective. Move on…the torch has passed.

I think you're mixing your metaphor with the wrong bike...

You're writing "ZX-14" but are you thinking "GTR1400"? 'cause it makes NO sense making any kind of comparison between the FJR and the big Zed. Apples and oranges.

However, if you ARE thinking GTR1400 and FJR comparisons with your "torch has passed" comment, I think it would be prudent to wait until someone has actually ridden one back to back with a Feejer. Just because the GTR is based on the Zed-X don't mean squat.

My ZRX is based on the legendary ZX-11, but the ZRX (stock) performance envelope falls FAR below that of the immortal 11. And you know what Kawasaki claimed the re-design of the ZX-11 motor in the ZRX form was for? Improved low and midrange torque. Same claim for the GTR1400 when compared to the ZX-14 mill.

Okay, the low and midrange torque curve was fattened up....at a sacrifice of about 70 hp up top.

Now take away 70 from the ZX-14 and the GTR1400 doesn't look so potent any more, does it.

But my analysis is based, like your "torch has passed" comment, on the purest speculation.

But I bet my Wild Ass Guess is better than yours.

:****:

 

[FJRZON]

I think you're mixing your metaphor with the wrong bike...
You're writing "ZX-14" but are you thinking "GTR1400"? 'cause it makes NO sense making any kind of comparison between the FJR and the big Zed. Apples and oranges.

However, if you ARE thinking GTR1400 and FJR comparisons with your "torch has passed" comment, I think it would be prudent to wait until someone has actually ridden one back to back with a Feejer. Just because the GTR is based on the Zed-X don't mean squat.

My ZRX is based on the legendary ZX-11, but the ZRX (stock) performance envelope falls FAR below that of the immortal 11. And you know what Kawasaki claimed the re-design of the ZX-11 motor in the ZRX form was for? Improved low and midrange torque. Same claim for the GTR1400 when compared to the ZX-14 mill.

Okay, the low and midrange torque curve was fattened up....at a sacrifice of about 70 hp up top.

Now take away 70 from the ZX-14 and the GTR1400 doesn't look so potent any more, does it.

But my analysis is based, like your "torch has passed" comment, on the purest speculation.

But I bet my Wild Ass Guess is better than yours.

:****:

Some good points RadioHowie, but I don‘t think you rewound far enough into the thread to understand where Galaxy Blue‘s comment came from which sparked the ZX-14. Yes, I know the difference between the ZX-14 & GTR1400. I just find it funny how people get so hung up in the looks department. But, agreed…it would be best “to pass the torch” after the bike gets further scrutinized and then… :****:

Personally I like to see the competition breeding. It’s a good thing for the motorcycle world to have more choices. That said, the GTR really isn’t my choice for a ride. I just like seeing the rivalry among manufacturers...speaking of which...HONDA WAKE UP! LOL. Cheers.

 

[mdisher]

There's a reason I kept my ZX11, and I look forward to trying one of the new Kawasaki's on for size.

I love my FJR, no doubt. I also like burgers, fries, a cold brew and of course bewbies. But I'll wait until they sell a few and see what people really think.

It's highly possible they've castrated that thing with the shaft drive, and the milder VVT and all the other BS. Who knows. We'll see.

 

[Windjammer]

Well, now you have -- I rode a Concours for 122K miles; and, altho they weren't smothered with luxo features -- you didn't pay for them, either. The stuff that counts was quality -- or, it wouldn't last. They didn't loose their rear ends or have a history of major engine failures or fried stators -- they did have bad J-boxes, tho (eventually).

Hold on there bro! I also put many a mile on the venerable (archaic) Concours. But lets remember that the original Connie "evolved" into a quality product. The early models were plagued by MANY problems. Some of the more serious of those were:

The Cam Chain Tensioner problem (it failed to self adjust)

Valves stretching due to being too soft

Camshaft pitting due to above valve problem

Clutch Backlash (Star) Spring fracture

I do agree with you that the Connie was (for the most part) a good, reliable machine. But that was because of evolution over the course of years, not because the design was flawlessly executed on the first try.

The reason that bike was so dependable primarily involved the fact that the powertrain was significantly overbuilt and tremendously understressed.

This was true of the Connie as well as the ST1100, and was another reason they were able to rack up tons of miles, once the design bugs got worked out. But both of these overbuilt, understressed bikes were also fairly slow and heavy.

And you know what Kawasaki claimed the re-design of the ZX-11 motor in the ZRX form was for? Improved low and midrange torque. Same claim for the GTR1400 when compared to the ZX-14 mill.

They made the same claim about the old ZX-10 Ninja motor when it was "de-tuned" for the original Connie. Kawi will have to break from a long tradition if the new 1400 is going to be a true powerhouse.

 

[painman]

It'll be a good long while before Frank goes on the block, and a good long while before the bugs are outta Connie the Sequel. But FWIW, I have never been impressed with Kaw quality-you never really see those two words together, least I never have, since before the Mach 2-stroke terrors. They've always struck me as a bike that was built saving a dime here, fitty cents there. The ZX-14 I saw recently looked good at 10 feet, but close up, I saw nothing to change my mind.

+1 on the Radman. Kawi just never had the quality and reliability needed IMO. PM. <><

 

[zorkler]

come on guys what is this thing going to cost .

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

<snip>I also put many a mile on the venerable (archaic) Concours. But lets remember that the original Connie "evolved" into a quality product. The early models were plagued by MANY problems. Some of the more serious of those were:The Cam Chain Tensioner problem (it failed to self adjust) Valves stretching due to being too soft Camshaft pitting due to above valve problem Clutch Backlash (Star) Spring fractureI do agree with you that the Connie was (for the most part) a good, reliable machine. But that was because of evolution over the course of years, not because the design was flawlessly executed on the first try.

W'jammer, no quarrel with your comments on the, decades old, GTR1000 -- my intent was to defend the "not associated with quality" remark. Quality may be a perception for some; and, may be an absolute for others? I maintain that if a bike works well for over 100K miles -- then, there must be quality there.

The reason that bike was so dependable primarily involved the fact that the powertrain was significantly overbuilt and tremendously understressed.This was true of the Connie as well as the ST1100, and was another reason they were able to rack up tons of miles, once the design bugs got worked out. But both of these overbuilt, understressed bikes were also fairly slow and heavy.

True, there's often a performance/durability trade-off. And the Concours suffered a bit from having a Ninja-sourced engine versus a dedicated purpose-built touring engine -- but, it did have the "sport" of a higher redline and an engine that rewarded the rider with it's sporting attributes (for the day).Whole books have been written about this "quality" thing -- and, often, it is purely perception (especially if the perceiver pays more -- ala BMW and H*****). This may even come around to bite us in the arse with the, originally, "competitively priced" FJR? Yamaha appears to be taking pre-emptive steps, tho, by trying to increase the cost -- and, thus, the perception of quality for Americans.

 

[Ignacio]

come on guys what is this thing going to cost .

Nobody knows! Kawasaki hasn't released that information yet. You can bet that when they do it will probably only be a few hours before somebody posts it here though.

 

[Warchild]

come on guys what is this thing going to cost .

On the various GTR1400 forums, it's all speculation, at this point.

I haven't had the need to get into bed with Kawi corporate dudes before, but I'm making some discrete inquires. No progress thus far to speak of though.

The rumor mill from those who have some connections within Kawasaki tell me they *plan* on a MSRP price for the GTR1400A to be "noticeably less" than the FJR1300A, and of course, the non-ABS version will be approx $1K-ish below that.

If this proves true, then no wonder Yammy has wisely dropped that dumb-ass PDP program... they know the GTR1400 will cut into the market share even with the FJR being floored like the rest of the product line. The only reason the PDP has work so well (for Yammy) to date is due to no real competition (there are TONS of ST1300s collecting dust on showroom floors; doesn't appear a big seller compared to the FJR.... surprise! :lol: )

The GTR1400 is likely to be another story, particularly if they price it competitively. Which I suspect they will…