Hey Jestal,
Kinda bout oil here,
How in the heck does Amsoil have a 25,000 mile oil interval change recommendation if you use their filter(no filter spin offs in-between)for auto's. They claim any engine oil related failure is covered under their warranty so long as you have a Amsoil servicer doing your oil changes and use their filter??? If their oil needs changing as much as conventional, I would assume they will be broke or getting sued often in the near future..
Whats your comments?
WW
The next few paragraphs were shamelessly cut and pasted from the other oil thread that is active.......
Amsoil has a good product. ...Just that it isn't any better than a lot of the other stuff out there and they charge and arm and a leg for it with their tiered marketing scheme. Most of the Amsoil zealots tend to be dealers....somehow......
Matching it to what manufacturer's specs..??? I don't think any manufacturer recommends Amsoil. I know that they won't even submit their product to GM for confirmation as an oil for the Corvette or Cadillac engines that spec synthetic. Wonder why..???
Amsoil is on the outs with most manufacturers with their insistence of claiming 25,000 mile oil change intervals with their product. There is no question that under certain rare circumstances their oil will go 25,000 miles between changes. But, under those same rare circumstances, most other modern oils will also. Amsoil bases their 25,000 mile oil change claims on their test results from the Sequence 3E tests that only measures oxidation rates. If oxidation were to be the sole determining factor they might have a point. It isn't and they don't. But Amsoil still continues their claims in their marketing. When you read their fine print these days they say to "follow oil life monitor if the vehicle is so equipped" and such but they do not take the 25,000 mile BS off their banner ads. No manufacturer agrees with this as it is very misleading and wrong.
Amsoil isn't going to ruin an engine if you change the oil properly but you can get the same level of protection (or even better) for much less money with a number of other products.
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In short, their 25,000 mile claim is purely a marketing ploy in my opinion. I think that most people will never run the oil that long but they like the feeling that they could if they wanted to. Plus, they feel that Amsoil must have a better product if they can make that claim. Nonsense. Pure PT Barnumism.
Once again, there are
MANY resasons for changing the oil. Oxidation (what Amsoil basis their claim on) is only one reason and RARELY
THE reason that you need to change oil. Amsoil offers absolutely nothing that makes up for contamination by water and gasoline and other combustion byproducts. And their ZDP levels, while higher in some cases than other oils, are still not high enough to match the depletion rate over 25,000 miles in all cases in all engines.
Having said all that you must realize that the oil life monitors and oil life algorithms have quite a bit of safety factor built into them. Honestly, if the oil life monitor is saying change the oil at 12,500 miles the oil is still "good" and could still be pressed into service for many thousands of miles more. That is the case with
any oil if you are operating under the conditions that would allow a change at 12,500.
The debate probably comes in when you try to decide when the oil is actually no longer serviceable. Someone has to look at the oxidation rate, acid formation, contamination levels, etc. and put a line in the sand as to when to recommend a change. I think the rest of the industry (petroleum and automotive) are much more conservative than Amsoil. Amsoil apparently allows the oil to be nearly 100% unserviceable with their 25,000 mile change interval. Since there is nothing in their product that other oils don't have then they must be looking at the data differently than everyone else. That is why no manufacturer recommends them.
The get away with it for the reasons stated above. Most people really don't do 25,000 mile oil changes. If they do, they would install the Amsoil after the engine is already broken in with miles on it so the lubrication degradation is going to be slower with an already broken in engine. They don't realize that they have less "insurance" or robustness in the lubricant for the last half of it's life. If the engine and conditins are perfect then all goes well.....which is the usual case. Even if the oil causes some wear it is likely to go undetected unless the engine is torn down. You probably notice that there are really few to none "lubrication related" engine failures anymore. The engines are much more robust to poor oil quality.
When the oil life monitors are calibrated we always want the oil to be changed while there is sufficient anti-wear and anti-oxidation resistance left in the oil to still handle an abnormal condition. We simply do not run the oil to the absolute limits that Amsoil appears to recommend. If you are comfortable with what Amsoil recommends then use 25,000 mile oil changes. Just realize that you could just as easily get away with it with any oil, not just Amsoil and/or if you run 25,000 mile oil changes with Amsoil and get away with it you could have with most any oil.
Some other products have "extended service" limits also. Namely some of the Mobil 1 products. Those oils have additional ZDP concentration specifically to improve the ZDP level as it depletes over extended change interval miles. Notice that those oils do NOT have the ILSAC starburst symbol that identify the oil as "For gasoline engines" ?? That is because the oils have ZDP concentrations that exceed the level required by ILSAC "For gasoline engine" approval and those oils are not as fuel efficient as the ILSAC approved oils due to the reduced level of friction modifiers. So....in your modern gasoline engine that is spec'ed for ILSAC "For Gasoline Engines" oil those extended service oils are not the correct oils. They will work fine and actually give better protection but they are technically NOT the correct oil for your engine. EVen with those oils Mobil still recommends following the oil life monitor.
The key thing in any of these oil debates and marketing claims is to realize that not all engines are the same. What will work for one type of engine might not work for another and what works for one type of service might not work for another. Just becuase one engine of a particular type ran 25,000 miles without a change does not mean that 1000 engines of the same type would ALWAYS do that. If you have the unlucky one out of a thousand then you would be pissed. You have to understand what each engine requires and what the different types of oils are designed for. And, you must realize that if it seems too good to be true, it probably is.
